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Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
https://forums.court-records.net/viewtopic.php?f=49&t=32253		 Page 3 of 3
Author:  Ash [ Sun Oct 09, 2016 7:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
I agree the name rule thing is very natural for these kinds of things. See also: Death Note. Rules for these kinds of things are especially important for mystery fiction, because it provides a framework. See also: Asimov's Robot series.

Southern Corn wrote:
Soo my question still stands.

Also,'she lied' isn't good enough for me. We clearly see her channel the abbot in case 3 in that pose. So it's been established. And we never did see Maya or Misty channel onscreen in OG trilogy,right?

You could argue that it's only been established she used the pose in case 3, not that it's crucial *to* channel someone. Unless it's Naruto, movements like these (like you also see with meditation and stuff) aren't usually there to actually 'trigger' something; they are simply standardized moves that help the user concentrate. Compare to Dragon Ball, where you don't actually always need to go through the motions of Kamehameha to use it and Gokuu sometimes even uses short cuts.
Author:  EdgeworthxOldbag [ Sun Oct 09, 2016 4:35 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Spoiler: Case 6-3
Where did Reiss get all that blood from his apprentice? I mean it'd be pretty weird to donate blood to your boss or something
Author:  scarlet-flowers [ Sun Oct 09, 2016 6:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
I was actually confused about the Maya thing myself. The only explanation I could come up with was that the hand poses helped with the accuracy of her channeling, but weren't necessary for the channeling itself.

Also, as for Apollo's bracelet, I'm sure they didn't mean it literally when they said the bracelet would fit the user exactly. Metal expand when heated and contract when cold, but there's a limit to how much it can expand or contract (otherwise we'd be violating the Laws of the Conservation of Mass). My guess is that the bracelet is made of a special metal with a very low heat capacity, allow it expand even when heated by only body temperature. So it can expand or contract to fit the user's wrist, given that the user's wrist is within a certain range of circumferences.
Author:  Southern Corn [ Mon Oct 10, 2016 1:54 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
This is sorta a cough up by the writers,but what happened to Nahyuta's 'I can predict the outcome of the trial' gimmick after case 2?
Author:  linkenski [ Mon Oct 10, 2016 7:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Same as Blackquill's "power of suggestion" which is openly refered to throughout case 2 in DD but then he almost doesn't "use it" the rest of the game except that really cheesy part in the finale. I feel like in both games they went all out on showing us what the new rival got in their first appearance but not as much afterwards. It might be because each case has a different main writer though. In case 3 Nahyuta is really in the background most of the time even compared to case 2 and in case 4 he's suddenly kind of witty and then he's somewhat like in case 2 again in the final case.
Author:  luck [ Mon Oct 10, 2016 8:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
To be honest I thought they were just hyping him up before we met him like they do with every prosecutor in every single game, so I never expected much to come up of that to begin with. It's just another way of saying that the guy is a tough opponent.
Author:  Nurio [ Mon Oct 10, 2016 8:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
You could even argue that the rumor of Nahyuta being able to read the trial's karma kinda died down after he lost a case he was so convinced of winning.
"He lost that case about the magician girl? But couldn't he read the karma and know the outcome?"
"Yeah... Guess that was just a bunch of bollocks, huh?"
"Uh-huh. Let's just forget about that if it was just some hooey"
Author:  scarlet-flowers [ Tue Oct 11, 2016 2:02 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
linkenski wrote:
Same as Blackquill's "power of suggestion" which is openly refered to throughout case 2 in DD but then he almost doesn't "use it" the rest of the game except that really cheesy part in the finale. I feel like in both games they went all out on showing us what the new rival got in their first appearance but not as much afterwards. It might be because each case has a different main writer though. In case 3 Nahyuta is really in the background most of the time even compared to case 2 and in case 4 he's suddenly kind of witty and then he's somewhat like in case 2 again in the final case.


I thought his difference in attitude was because of the different settings he was in (case 3 he was in Khurain, case 2 and 4 he was in America).
Author:  linkenski [ Tue Oct 11, 2016 2:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Well, that's one way to justify it. I just don't think there is any excuse for not even trying to make him mysterious, funny or at least threatening. Deciding that he should hold back on how foreign he is just because it's Khura'in just made him forgettable.
Author:  Southern Corn [ Wed Oct 12, 2016 4:14 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Actually,in the opening cutscene to case five,Dhurke says Ga'ran like Ga'ranian.

You could say it's a foreign word,so maybe that's how it's pronounced.

Except later in the game,where the guards say it completely differently.

Also,does anyone know the guy who says,"Wheeeee!" in Paul's theme? Been trying to find him for ages with no success.
Author:  Turnabout Dave [ Wed Oct 12, 2016 8:47 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Southern Corn wrote:
Actually,in the opening cutscene to case five,Dhurke says Ga'ran like Ga'ranian.


I think that's similar to how we refer to Newtonian physics or Jeffersonian democracy, as developed by Sir Isaac Newton and Thomas Jefferson, respectively. Dhurke is referring to the Ga'ranian regime, not Queen Ga'ran herself.
Author:  Southern Corn [ Thu Oct 13, 2016 12:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
^ But the subtitles only say 'Ga'ran'. Did they screw up instead?
Author:  Turnabout Dave [ Thu Oct 13, 2016 3:00 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Southern Corn wrote:
^ But the subtitles only say 'Ga'ran'. Did they screw up instead?


One of them was wrong, but it doesn't really matter which. Either way, it still makes sense.
Author:  scarlet-flowers [ Thu Oct 13, 2016 10:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
linkenski wrote:
Well, that's one way to justify it. I just don't think there is any excuse for not even trying to make him mysterious, funny or at least threatening. Deciding that he should hold back on how foreign he is just because it's Khura'in just made him forgettable.


I kinda took it as he was uncomfortable being himself in Khu'rain because Ga'ran was watching him, but I agree. I wish they had made his character stand out more, like maybe having him actually be kind to the witnesses or make his sense of justice come across as misplaced but understandable. Instead he just came off as a total jerk.
Author:  Pierre [ Thu Oct 13, 2016 11:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
scarlet-flowers wrote:
linkenski wrote:
Well, that's one way to justify it. I just don't think there is any excuse for not even trying to make him mysterious, funny or at least threatening. Deciding that he should hold back on how foreign he is just because it's Khura'in just made him forgettable.


I kinda took it as he was uncomfortable being himself in Khu'rain because Ga'ran was watching him, but I agree. I wish they had made his character stand out more, like maybe having him actually be kind to the witnesses or make his sense of justice come across as misplaced but understandable. Instead he just came off as a total jerk.


Were we watching the same character?

The Courteous Fellow who saved Maya in the Prologue from a dangerous knife-wielding lunatic and showed her every courtesy?

The Lovely Lad who complimented Ema on her due diligence and hard work?

Spoiler: Final Case
The Generous Gent who attempted to spare a young girl from having to watch the death of her father?


Yeah what a jerk.
Author:  Southern Corn [ Fri Oct 14, 2016 3:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
The point is that he rarely does it,and even when he does,it's overshadowed by his blunt 'go to hell' comments against the defence.
Author:  JesusMonroe [ Sun Oct 16, 2016 2:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Spoiler: 6-1
How did Paht Rohl know the box was empty? He had no way opening it
Author:  Turnabout Dave [ Sun Oct 16, 2016 3:44 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
JesusMonroe wrote:
Spoiler: 6-1
How did Paht Rohl know the box was empty? He had no way opening it


Spoiler: Response
He could tell by the weight.

This one's actually explained in-game.
Author:  JesusMonroe [ Sun Oct 16, 2016 5:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Ah ok I missed that

Spoiler: 6-5
What were they going to do on New Year's Eve when he had to carry it again? Were they going to have it returned by that point or was Inga planning on enacting his coup by that point so it didn't matter?
Author:  Slammer [ Sun Oct 30, 2016 11:24 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Ash wrote:
Franzise Deauxnim wrote:
Name: Rules of Spirit Channeling
Type of cough-up: Inconsistency
Location: 6-3, Original trilogy
Description:
Spoiler: SoJ, AA, JfA, T&T
So there's a couple rules to spirit channeling made a lot clearer in SoJ than was made in the first games. One of them is that when a spirit is pulled back from the afterlife, it retains its memories up to the point when it died, and nothing else. There's been several times when Mia was channeled, though, and she knew things that had happened while she was dead (although this is inconsistent even in the originals, sometimes Mia wouldn't know what was happening like when Maya was kidnapped by deKiller)

The bigger problem, though, is the requirements for channeling a spirit; you need to know the spirit's name and face. In that case, how did Maya channel Dahlia in 3-5? She didn't know what Dahlia looked like. You could argue that knowing what Iris looked like would work since they were twins, but then Mia would have to tell Maya to imagine Iris' face, and how would Mia know to do that? She didn't know who Iris was (unless, again, she somehow saw Iris while Maya wasn't channeling her)

Spoiler: 3-5
Maya did know Dahlia's face. Dahlia tried to kill her. Maya only channeled her after Dahlia's attack.


Spoiler:
But the lantern in the Inner Temple wasn't lighted. In fact, Maya only saw Godot killing her mother because of the red light from his mask, and clearly stated that she didn't see her attacker in one of the last testimonies.

Author:  Apollo4Justice [ Sun Oct 30, 2016 3:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Slammer wrote:
Ash wrote:
Franzise Deauxnim wrote:
Name: Rules of Spirit Channeling
Type of cough-up: Inconsistency
Location: 6-3, Original trilogy
Description:
Spoiler: SoJ, AA, JfA, T&T
So there's a couple rules to spirit channeling made a lot clearer in SoJ than was made in the first games. One of them is that when a spirit is pulled back from the afterlife, it retains its memories up to the point when it died, and nothing else. There's been several times when Mia was channeled, though, and she knew things that had happened while she was dead (although this is inconsistent even in the originals, sometimes Mia wouldn't know what was happening like when Maya was kidnapped by deKiller)

The bigger problem, though, is the requirements for channeling a spirit; you need to know the spirit's name and face. In that case, how did Maya channel Dahlia in 3-5? She didn't know what Dahlia looked like. You could argue that knowing what Iris looked like would work since they were twins, but then Mia would have to tell Maya to imagine Iris' face, and how would Mia know to do that? She didn't know who Iris was (unless, again, she somehow saw Iris while Maya wasn't channeling her)

Spoiler: 3-5
Maya did know Dahlia's face. Dahlia tried to kill her. Maya only channeled her after Dahlia's attack.


Spoiler:
But the lantern in the Inner Temple wasn't lighted. In fact, Maya only saw Godot killing her mother because of the red light from his mask, and clearly stated that she didn't see her attacker in one of the last testimonies.


I think you're getting it slightly mixed up.
Spoiler: Bridge to the Turnabout
Maya testified that she saw Dahlia perfectly fine, as she was right in front of her, but she couldn't see Dahlia's attacker well, as she only identified him by the lights.
Author:  Slammer [ Sun Oct 30, 2016 3:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Apollo4Justice wrote:
Slammer wrote:
Spoiler:
But the lantern in the Inner Temple wasn't lighted. In fact, Maya only saw Godot killing her mother because of the red light from his mask, and clearly stated that she didn't see her attacker in one of the last testimonies.


I think you're getting it slightly mixed up.
Spoiler: Bridge to the Turnabout
Maya testified that she saw Dahlia perfectly fine, as she was right in front of her, but she couldn't see Dahlia's attacker well, as she only identified him by the lights.


Spoiler:
No. She said she couldn't see the person who attacked her, because there was no light. Instead, she recognised Godot (aka "the man") very well, thanks to the red lights.
Author:  Turnabout Dave [ Sun Oct 30, 2016 4:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Slammer wrote:
Apollo4Justice wrote:
Slammer wrote:
Spoiler:
But the lantern in the Inner Temple wasn't lighted. In fact, Maya only saw Godot killing her mother because of the red light from his mask, and clearly stated that she didn't see her attacker in one of the last testimonies.


I think you're getting it slightly mixed up.
Spoiler: Bridge to the Turnabout
Maya testified that she saw Dahlia perfectly fine, as she was right in front of her, but she couldn't see Dahlia's attacker well, as she only identified him by the lights.


Spoiler:
No. She said she couldn't see the person who attacked her, because there was no light. Instead, she recognised Godot (aka "the man") very well, thanks to the red lights.


Spoiler:
Whether or not Maya saw Dahlia when she was attacked is unimportant. As stated previously, Mia could have told Maya that Dahlia and Iris were identical twins. As for how she found out, it could have come up while she was investigating Dahlia. Additionally, Pearl said in the same case that knowing a spirit's name and face is usually enough to channel them, giving this "new" rule some precedent.


There. All contradictions resolved.
Author:  Slammer [ Sun Oct 30, 2016 5:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Turnabout Dave wrote:
Slammer wrote:
Apollo4Justice wrote:
I think you're getting it slightly mixed up.
Spoiler: Bridge to the Turnabout
Maya testified that she saw Dahlia perfectly fine, as she was right in front of her, but she couldn't see Dahlia's attacker well, as she only identified him by the lights.


Spoiler:
No. She said she couldn't see the person who attacked her, because there was no light. Instead, she recognised Godot (aka "the man") very well, thanks to the red lights.


Spoiler:
Whether or not Maya saw Dahlia when she was attacked is unimportant. As stated previously, Mia could have told Maya that Dahlia and Iris were identical twins. As for how she found out, it could have come up while she was investigating Dahlia. Additionally, Pearl said in the same case that knowing a spirit's name and face is usually enough to channel them, giving this "new" rule some precedent.


There. All contradictions resolved.


Yeah, another user already solved the contradiction for me days ago. I only wanted to point out that it would've been impossible for Maya to see Dahlia's face in that occasion.

Thanks for the reply anyway!
Author:  Southern Corn [ Wed Dec 28, 2016 6:23 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Another weird one is during case two,where during Retinz's final testimony Athena says something about fishes and Apollo reminds her that they aren't going to be fishermen.


...and they won't. Seriously,they already proved that Retinz forged the signature,so the company will be let off completely. Did they forget about that?
Author:  Apollo4Justice [ Thu Dec 29, 2016 7:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Yes, but Trucy would still be found guilty of the murder if they can't prove
Spoiler:
Retinz did it
and, according to them, Trucy is the office's only real source of income, meaning they'd still lose the office due to not paying bills.
Author:  Nano2424 [ Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Name: wrong Instrument
Type of cough-up: Localization error or maybe a severe cough up with the original Japanese script
Location: 6-3
Description: When you are visiting :maya: in jail you are taking about the differences between The Plumed Punisher and Steel Samurai theme, Maya says:

Quote:
Plus the Steel Samurai has Japanese Taiko drums that go...

(Theme plays)
Quote:
...daka don-don-don in the intro!


Here’s the slip-up: the drum heard in the intro is actually called a Kotsuzumi. Taikos have a lower pitch to them, you can hear one in Dogen’s theme as well as Kay’s. At least I hope it was a localization error and not part of the original script... Someone who knows Japanese should play that version to see if that’s so.
Author:  Southern Corn [ Wed Nov 22, 2017 2:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Spirit of Justice Cough Ups
Or you could say that Maya and Tahrust just made a mistake since they probably don't know much about the finer details of Japanese instruments.

I wouldn't call it a severe mistake though :p
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