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Oh, that makes more sense, I apologize.

Also, by looking through the Rips, I've found out that Hart Vortex is the killer of Case 5. There's plenty of sound effects labeled break for him.
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He is, his real name was revealed to also have the initials H.M to explain the pen that incriminated Haori. That track I s related to his breakdown. Speaking of which...

https://youtu.be/D8I9KLrzoJo someone uploaded all the breakdowns to youtube. That person has no videos for the rest of the game yet however.
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Well, that trial sure was interesting!

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...Well, I know what's gonna be the best breakdown ever in this series for me now. And ever. Like I don't know if anyone's ever gonna top that.
"When you have eliminated all which is impossible, then whatever remains, however improbable, must be the truth."
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Wow, I never saw that twist with the pen coming.

And My God, is the Case 5 Breakdown incredible.
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Does anyone know what the Japanese judge (I don't remember his name) is saying during his breakdown?
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So....

Spoiler:
Vortex is the mastermind after all? I wonder which murders exactly he's responsible of. Just Gregson? Or maybe he was the Professor and my theory was correct?
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Okay that breakdown was amazing... goodness sake.

But hold on so the Japanese judge (Jigoku right) is bad??
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Spoiler:
I think he's a copycat killer inspired by the societal results from the Professor's killings, who then ended up in league with him. Pretty sure the Japanese judge will be pegged as the Professor (why else would he turn up in England now, if not to probably deal with any leftover evidence that might incriminate him), and the whole thing will end up something like the Gant situation; they used their influence over the law to protect the alliance between the two empires by any means necessary, probably as a result of pressure from even higher up.


Last edited by Kiyanavasala on Sun Aug 06, 2017 4:29 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Alan Bernard wrote:
I have a question. Considering that we have these confirmed killers:

Case 1: Cameraman
Case 2: Petenshy
Case 3: Sithe as Accomplice
Case 4: Unsure, but continues into Case 5
Case 5: Hart Vortex?


Also the Japanese judge is an accomplice for case 5
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Hang on, why is there talk of a copycat killer? No one was copycatting the Professor, right? If they did, there'd be a hound involved.

Either way, my theory is that Vortex was the real Professor (because his actions in the background of this game have been entirely fishy and, again, he was a prosecutor back when Klimt was the Chief Prosecutor and now he's up in the ranks ten years later) and the Japanese judge attempted to expose the truth behind the Professor, because that stuff from ten years ago in which one of their friends died still haunts him. In his breakdown, he says something about ten years ago, I think. Japanese judge attempted desperately to save Genshin (and yes, it made him look very suspicious in the process, but I think that's a red herring) and now he's been working with Mikotoba.

Just a theory, of course.
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That was just me thinking how this game could continue in the vein of subverting our expectations; until now it seems the narrative is leading us to expect the Professor to still be alive. Vortex's real name is probably Moriarty either way.

Edit: And I didn't mean 'copycat' as in 'makes the killings look like theirs,' I meant copycat as in 'that guy seems to have the right idea, let's kill people for the greater good.'
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Aaah, okay. Though, looking at the latest cases, the only victims are Gregson and maybe Mikotoba? I'm still not sure what that last Joint Reasoning rip is supposed to be. It doesn't strike me exactly as 'killing for the greater good', more like 'killing to cover one's own tracks because these people were on to the Professor's real identity'.
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Now... how does any of this tie into Asougi's mission and the names on the discs? Given Jezail/Sasha killed Watson and both their names are on the list, at best it could be a kill-list to tie up loose ends related to some important case like the Professor one... but why wouldn't Sherlock's name be on there in that case?

Edit: Just had a thought. Given all we got were initials for their first names, Jezail might not be the only one on the list operating under an alias or a changed name.
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Alan Bernard wrote:
I have a question. Considering that we have these confirmed killers:

Case 1: Cameraman
Case 2: Petenshy
Case 3: Sithe as Accomplice
Case 4: Unsure, but continues into Case 5
Case 5: Hart Vortex?


For Case 2, Viridian is also one of the "killers" as she tried to kill Petenshy.
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Wow didn't think much of that last breakdown until the scale tipped and fire started spewing everywhere jfc
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I had a good long laugh when he flopped down from the bench and onto the jurors tables, then onward onto the floor. I think right before he roars and breaks the head off his staff, he's screaming something like "court is adjourned! Court is adjourned!" too.
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Also fun to note, even though Vortex was technically a Prosecutor before, this is the first game to finally have a judge villain, two if you count Jigoku (Jp Judge).
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And now we've also taken down someone in every courtroom role while they've been performing that role, except for a bailiff.

Edit: Just had a thought: Moriarty's characterisation. Which character in this game would you say has the sort of personality that would fit someone like Moriarty? It's got to be Vortex, with his obsession with time and control. The mastermind behind the Professor; remember, Moriarty wasn't one to get his own hands dirty if he could help it.

Edit 2: Another thought. The list of names. Remember the Yatagarasu?

Control the attorney, you control the defense. K. Asougi.
Control the detective, you control the crime scene. T. Gregson.
Control the doctor, you control the autopsy. J. Watson.

Control the prosecutor? Why bother? No sense getting everyone found guilty; let a few get found innocent so people don't think there's something up with the system, then use your assassin to fix the problem if needed.

And it just so happens one of the liveblogs just found that A. Sasha was the assassin who made Barok's curse happen.

Why go to the effort? Well, you've got a jury; they cast verdicts based on emotion, and they're (at least supposedly) random. No way you can control them all. Why would someone like Vortex accept a system he can't control?
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Kiyanavasala wrote:
And now we've also taken down someone in every courtroom role while they've been performing that role, except for a bailiff.

Edit: Just had a thought: Moriarty's characterisation. Which character in this game would you say has the sort of personality that would fit someone like Moriarty? It's got to be Vortex, with his obsession with time and control. The mastermind behind the Professor; remember, Moriarty wasn't one to get his own hands dirty if he could help it.

Edit 2: Another thought. The list of names. Remember the Yatagarasu?

Control the attorney, you control the defense. K. Asougi.
Control the detective, you control the crime scene. T. Gregson.
Control the doctor, you control the autopsy. J. Watson.

Control the prosecutor? Why bother? No sense getting everyone found guilty; let a few get found innocent so people don't think there's something up with the system, then use your assassin to fix the problem if needed.

And it just so happens one of the liveblogs just found that A. Sasha was the assassin who made Barok's curse happen.

Why go to the effort? Well, you've got a jury; they cast verdicts based on emotion, and they're (at least supposedly) random. No way you can control them all. Why would someone like Vortex accept a system he can't control?



Vortex didn't like it, but he didn't have a choice, because he was a mere prosecutor when the jury rule went into effect. In fact, he threw out all the jurors in case 5, which ultimately led to his demise.
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Pastebin for case 5 (mainly explaining the professor stuff): https://pastebin.com/dv5vuA8E
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Well that took a turn.
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Also, Susato and Iris are half sisters apparently?? Watson was never Iris's father, it was Yuujin.
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Actually, there's another twist about that. The user who posted those pastebins on discord said something on the chat itself.

"mikotoba went to see genshin before he died and genshin made one final request to his friend.
mikotoba did as he was told and went to a certain address and found a woman about to give birth there. as a doctor, he helped her, but the mother died soon after. then his eyes drifted to a suitcase in the corner with the crest of the baskervilles on it and realized

Iris's parent's are klimt van zieks and his wife, a baskerville."

So...yeah, that happened too.
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The twists just don't end huh holy. Please there has to be a scene or aftercredits or something where Barok and Iris awkwardly dance around this subject, this is too good to not happen.

That does answer my unsaid question though, if Iris's father was Yuujin she'd be half Japanese and you'd think people in London would notice considering.
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Did Vortex just pull a Gant on us?
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WHAT??? I.... HUH???

Okay I did not see any of that coming. I guess in a sense, that does still make Vortex more like Moriarty than Klimt, because while Klimt did all the dirty work, Vortex was the one pulling the strings. I wonder what happened to the hound, though? If Klimt died because of a duel with Genshin, how could this death have been linked to the Professor? Is it because the falsified autopsy report made it seem like he was attacked by a dog?

Also... jfc that thing about Iris. WOW. Um. I'm not sure I like this? I'm not seeing the point of this twist at all.
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Yeah, will have to see how it's related cause if Iris and Barok don't get at least one meaningful scene together I don't see the point of faking us out twice.

First thinking it's Yuujin, then revealing it's Klimt and all.
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...What's going on with Iris? From what I can tell she doesn't seem to be doing a whole lot, honestly.
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She might become more important in case 5. I don't know.

I find the Yuujin twist a little insulting, too. Maybe it's just my sentimental attachments to 'canon' Holmes crying out in pain, but it bugs me that Watson exists in this universe- he was a real guy- and instead of going on adventures with him Holmes developed a strong partnership with some other guy. Holmes might not even have known John Watson beyond 'Yuujin's colleague'. Yuujin has the same basic personality as Watson as we're familiar with him, I know that, but... He's NOT Watson. And Sherlock didn't do a thing to correct Iris's assumption that her father was named John Watson. He let her believe that some total stranger was her dad.
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I think the Iris twist is just some development for Sherlock and Iris I suppose, cause I don't see it being relevant to the Professor case who Iris's parents are. More of an answer to a question fans and players are wondering I bet.

As for Watson, I guess in the AA-verse he only existed as a giant red herring for players, and a random coroner in universe.

Now I wonder what reason could possibly be good enough for Sherlock to not tell Iris who her father was. Maybe Vortex would've hunted down Klimt's children or something so it had to be kept secret?
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Yeah, I don't understand why he couldn't have just told Iris about her father, especially after she took on the wrong name for herself. The only reason I could see is that he was trying to protect her because he'd figured out the truth behind the Professor's identity (Klimt) but couldn't prove it either way and needed to find out more (with Mikotoba's help).
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Most likely because of Kilmet's status as both a prosecutor which would have caused controversy and the Professor - a serial killer though most pepole did not know this. Iris is not going to react well when she realises her father was a serial killer.

I do think pepole will be mixed on the twists presented in this game. Some of them are really great but some of them are kinda eh
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"Just" telling Iris about her parents seems complicated due to the circumstances surrounding their deaths. Like, I don't see him straight-up saying to a 10 year-old girl that her father was (supposedly) brutally killed by a serial murderer and that everything about his death is shrouded in mystery and shady deals, so she has to just "let go and move on" with this. Even more so when Sherlock was definitely onto something. Remember that he tends to conceal the truth as long as he didn't get to the bottom of it.
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So... what was with the list on names on the discs? Do we have an actual answer for that yet?
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Meowzy wrote:
She might become more important in case 5. I don't know.

I find the Yuujin twist a little insulting, too. Maybe it's just my sentimental attachments to 'canon' Holmes crying out in pain, but it bugs me that Watson exists in this universe- he was a real guy- and instead of going on adventures with him Holmes developed a strong partnership with some other guy. Holmes might not even have known John Watson beyond 'Yuujin's colleague'. Yuujin has the same basic personality as Watson as we're familiar with him, I know that, but... He's NOT Watson. And Sherlock didn't do a thing to correct Iris's assumption that her father was named John Watson. He let her believe that some total stranger was her dad.


Related, when looking at the profiles, when I saw Yuujin in his suit, I initially thought he was Watson at first because they looked similar to me, and that they were going to pull that again with Watson being alive.
...Turns out I was right at the first point, not the second one...
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I actually thought he was Watson when the cover art was first released, until I realized Watson was standing all the way in the back. It's very ironic.

And now that I've had some time to think it over and get more details, I'm actually sort of glad that Mikotoba is the Watson of this universe. What a lot of us wanted in DGS2 was a 'flashback case' featuring Holmes and Watson, so we could see their dynamic in action. What it gave us instead was a bit of investigation (and Join Reasoning, heck yeah!!!) with Holmes and Mikotoba, who is basically Watson, except alive. He's ALIVE. Holmes deserves a partner who's alive and who will (hopefully) continue investigating with him. And I kind of like the idea of Holmes becoming best friends with a Japanese man even before he met Naruhodou.
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I had a gut feeling that Vortex would be the big bad, but the Japanese judge being an accomplice is...surprising. Wish we could hear their breakdowns with audio instead of just the pursuit theme overlayed.
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Thunder84 wrote:
I had a gut feeling that Vortex would be the big bad, but the Japanese judge being an accomplice is...surprising. Wish we could hear their breakdowns with audio instead of just the pursuit theme overlayed.


Is there a video of all of the breakdowns?
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Thunder84 wrote:
I had a gut feeling that Vortex would be the big bad, but the Japanese judge being an accomplice is...surprising. Wish we could hear their breakdowns with audio instead of just the pursuit theme overlayed.


That's an annoying trend I've noticed with Japanese breakdown videos for some reason. I remember seeing an SoJ breakdown video last year that was the same way. Really bugs me.
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Cesar Zero wrote:
https://youtu.be/D8I9KLrzoJo someone uploaded all the breakdowns to youtube. That person has no videos for the rest of the game yet however.
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