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Re: Phoenix Wright Cough UpsTopic%20Title

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Name: Maya's mysterious prints
Type of cough-up: Impossible, useless plot device
Location: JFA case 2, Case overview
Description: In case 2, as another reason why Maya MUST have killed grey :sad-maya: it is said that her fingerprints were found on the knife. However, later it is explained that
Spoiler: case 2-2
It was mimi miney who killed dr grey, upon having had her face burnt off and having reconstructed it to look like ini miney's. It is never explained why maya's fingerprints were on the murder weapon, this was probably just used as some other reason to make it seem tougher, only the writers forgot about it or else noticed and were too lazy.

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Re: Phoenix Wright Cough UpsTopic%20Title

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I think to have found another cough-up

Name: The mysterious talisman
Type of cough-up: Contradiction
Location: T&T Case 5
Description:
Spoiler:
Do you remember the Kurain Master's Talisman, the red object found in the real crime scene? Well, if you examine it during the second section of the final investigation phase, Edgeworth says:"It's going in the evidence room once the investigation is over, so hands off, Wright". The problem is that, after the final trial, we see that this object is possessed by Maya. We even see the secret photo the Talisman was containing, the one with Mia and Maya depicted, so I guess this piece of evidence didn't eventually wind up in the evidence room!
Was Edgeworth lying?
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Lemonftw wrote:
Name: Maya's mysterious prints
Type of cough-up: Impossible, useless plot device
Location: JFA case 2, Case overview
Description: In case 2, as another reason why Maya MUST have killed grey :sad-maya: it is said that her fingerprints were found on the knife. However, later it is explained that
Spoiler: case 2-2
It was mimi miney who killed dr grey, upon having had her face burnt off and having reconstructed it to look like ini miney's. It is never explained why maya's fingerprints were on the murder weapon, this was probably just used as some other reason to make it seem tougher, only the writers forgot about it or else noticed and were too lazy.

NOT SO FAST! I am pretty sure that they explain it at one point, but if not here goes:
Spoiler: explanation is e-z pe-z lemon skwe-z
Mimi and Morgan wiped the prints and then planted Maya's on the gun.

And in 3-5
Spoiler: Silly evidence, Talismans are for Mediums!
When you get the talisman from the garden, it's labeled "Kurain Master's Talisman". And with Bikini's psyche-lock, Phoenix "finds out" that it's a talisman. If he didn't know previously, how was it entered into the Court Record as a talisman?
Re: Phoenix Wright Cough UpsTopic%20Title

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GantStare wrote:
Two things here....I don't know if they can be considered cough-ups but, lets give it a try.

Spoiler: AJ Spoilers
Zak ''contracted'' Olga to cheat with him against Phoenix, but how did he know about her other identity? More Over, How did Phoenix not know, he did work with her, right?



Spoiler: Answer
I believe they implied she was a fairly new employee at the club. Even if they didn't how do you know he didn't? She was the dealer for the game after all, it's very possible he knew some of it was an act, he just didn't know she was cheating.



weirdghostboo wrote:
Not sure if this is a contradiction, and I apologize if this has been done, but:

Spoiler: 2-4
When the tracking device goes off before the credits, shouldn't Franziska be at the airport by this point, and therefore far away from Edgeworth who has the thingy that tracks Franziska? Because it says somewhere in the game that whenever Franziska is NEAR Detective Gumshoe, it goes off, not when she's far away. So how did it go off when Franziska was far away from Edgeworth?


Spoiler: Answer
Gumshoe is the one being tracked not Franzy. It's possible someone else was carrying the device she uses to track him
Re: Phoenix Wright Cough UpsTopic%20Title
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Time Sage wrote:
Spoiler: Answer
Gumshoe is the one being tracked not Franzy. It's possible someone else was carrying the device she uses to track him

Spoiler: OBJECTION!
But that's not possible, because Franzy had the jacket with the tracker in, which is why Edgeworth was able to track her there.
If you want my opinion, I think she WAS there... Hiding behind a pillar, bitterly watching them celebrate. She's completely confused as to how Phoenix and co. are so happy that they lost the case, which is why she decides to leave the country and heads to the airport.
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This is probably the biggest contradiction in AA:I, and it's actually quite apparent.
Spoiler:
In Case 5 of AA:I, when they finally catch Calisto(7 Years Later as Shih-Na), and bring her in for her crimes against killing Byrne, and Mack, wouldn't the statue of limitations have been expired? Thus letting her go free? I'm basing this off the Statue in PW:AA Case 4.

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GantStare wrote:
This is probably the biggest contradiction in AA:I, and it's actually quite apparent.
Spoiler:
In Case 5 of AA:I, when they finally catch Calisto(7 Years Later as Shih-Na), and bring her in for her crimes against killing Byrne, and Mack, wouldn't the statue of limitations have been expired? Thus letting her go free? I'm basing this off the Statue in PW:AA Case 4.

Spoiler: Foolishly foolish fool
The statute of limitations is 15 years, not 7. Ergo, there is no contradiction!
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Steel Turnabout wrote:
GantStare wrote:
This is probably the biggest contradiction in AA:I, and it's actually quite apparent.
Spoiler:
In Case 5 of AA:I, when they finally catch Calisto(7 Years Later as Shih-Na), and bring her in for her crimes against killing Byrne, and Mack, wouldn't the statue of limitations have been expired? Thus letting her go free? I'm basing this off the Statue in PW:AA Case 4.

Spoiler: Foolishly foolish fool
The statute of limitations is 15 years, not 7. Ergo, there is no contradiction!


Ah DAMMMMMIT! *Von Karma Head Slam* Thanks though, It was really bugging me.
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GantStare wrote:
Steel Turnabout wrote:
GantStare wrote:
This is probably the biggest contradiction in AA:I, and it's actually quite apparent.
Spoiler:
In Case 5 of AA:I, when they finally catch Calisto(7 Years Later as Shih-Na), and bring her in for her crimes against killing Byrne, and Mack, wouldn't the statue of limitations have been expired? Thus letting her go free? I'm basing this off the Statue in PW:AA Case 4.

Spoiler: Foolishly foolish fool
The statute of limitations is 15 years, not 7. Ergo, there is no contradiction!


Ah DAMMMMMIT! *Von Karma Head Slam* Thanks though, It was really bugging me.

Anytime...
Hatsworth, use ATTRACT! It's super effective!
Re: Phoenix Wright Cough UpsTopic%20Title
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Backfired plan.
Spoiler:
In case 2-4, Matt videotaped Shelly so he could keep him at bay and even blackmail him. However... What if he succeeded in his plan? Think about it. If matt were to release the video to the press, he would reveal that he set up a camera to spy on Corrida, he knew that DeKiller would be there, and would have a motive ruining his reputation.
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Spoiler: 2-4
He had video tapes everywhere to spy on Corrida. So he would get some penalty for spying. But just because happened to see Corrida's murder, and the face of his assassin, because of it doesn't mean that he specifically knew Corrida would be killed at that time and place. Also, Matt wouldn't need to release the tape to the press; he would just need to give it to the police.

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Spoiler: 2-4
Thinking about it all he had to do was give them the tape as well, thus they would have no idea that he was SPECIFICALLY RECORDING that period of time in which he was murdered.
If they asked for the camera, well, as they said, he could just buy one from any electronics store.
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I believe this was brought up a few pages back, but I didn't see any answer, and it's been bugging me while I've been playing 1-5 again.

Spoiler: 1-5
Mike Meekins was somehow able to deliver a report of the murder he supposedly committed and was arrested for before he woke up after passing out from it. And had been in jail for since.

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Burninator wrote:
I believe this was brought up a few pages back, but I didn't see any answer, and it's been bugging me while I've been playing 1-5 again.

Spoiler: 1-5
Mike Meekins was somehow able to deliver a report of the murder he supposedly committed and was arrested for before he woke up after passing out from it. And had been in jail for since.

Spoiler:
I just assume Meekins was talking nonsense when he told Phoenix that he passed out at the murder scene and woke up in jail. He's very excitable and the shock of being arrested for murder just made him overly dramatic, plus he's generally confused about everything.

We do have offical word from the Chief (Gant) at the first day of trial that they only just arrested the suspect. So Meekins was indeed walking free for a day or so after the murder. And Meekins also said in his testimony that he was woken up in the evidence room by a colleague, and after that he went to move the Blue Badger back outside.
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Blitu wrote:
Backfired plan.
Spoiler:
In case 2-4, Matt videotaped Shelly so he could keep him at bay and even blackmail him. However... What if he succeeded in his plan? Think about it. If matt were to release the video to the press, he would reveal that he set up a camera to spy on Corrida, he knew that DeKiller would be there, and would have a motive ruining his reputation.


Spoiler:
I'm sure that Matt had no intention to release the tape to the police or the press. He is just using that video as 'insurance' against De Killer betraying him (since it shows De Killer murdering Juan).
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NinjaMonkey wrote:
Blitu wrote:
Backfired plan.
Spoiler:
In case 2-4, Matt videotaped Shelly so he could keep him at bay and even blackmail him. However... What if he succeeded in his plan? Think about it. If matt were to release the video to the press, he would reveal that he set up a camera to spy on Corrida, he knew that DeKiller would be there, and would have a motive ruining his reputation.


Spoiler:
I'm sure that Matt had no intention to release the tape to the police or the press. He is just using that video as 'insurance' against De Killer betraying him (since it shows De Killer murdering Juan).

Spoiler:
Sure Matt broke the law and was video-taping Corrida, but Corrida was spying on Matt too, and I'm sure the courts are going to be a little lenient since he was able to capture the face of the infamous murderer Shelly de Killer.

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Spoiler: 2-4
What bothers me is how much difference it would have made. The police ended up knowing that De Killer murdered Corrida, and they should have done had adrian not intervened, which Matt couldn't have predicted. The video wouldn't have shown anything beyond the fact that it was De Killer, but that wouldn't have done much in terms of capturing him.

Answering your contradiction, though, he didn't necessarily have to hand the tape to the police in person. He could have just delivered it anonymously.
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Darth GW7 wrote:
Spoiler: 2-4
What bothers me is how much difference it would have made. The police ended up knowing that De Killer murdered Corrida, and they should have done had adrian not intervened, which Matt couldn't have predicted. The video wouldn't have shown anything beyond the fact that it was De Killer, but that wouldn't have done much in terms of capturing him.

Spoiler:
BUT IT WOULD HAVE SHOWN THE POLICE DE KILLER'S FACE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

(which is a completely stupid reason since Phoenix and Maya already saw his face, and he has those super-distinguishing marks. I still hate 2-4!!)

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Really? 2-4 is one of my favourites! D:
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Spoiler: 1-5: Angel Starr's testimony
If Angel saw the stabbing from the security room, then I find it hard to believe she didn't notice any signs that Goodman was already dead?! I mean, he would already have blood on his jacket, his body limp, eyes closed (presumably) etc. Unless Angel only saw it the moment after Lana stabbed, but that just contradicts the fact that she did see the actual stabbing. :meekins: I guess one can argue that Lana would have blocked Angel's view of Goodman, but still, hard to believe.

Angel also said that Lana stabbed Goodman again and again. But this is not true since Lana later indicated that she only stabbed once, and why would she stab him multiple times anyway?? I guess the whole Angel Starr testimony just sounds super fishy to me.
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Spoiler:
What if Angel saw Goodman limp and bloody, and then saw Lana plunge the knife into Goodman? It would look like Lana killed Goodman by stabbing him multiple times, and she just witnessed the last stabbing.

or she got a little over-excited (so much for being a professional witness?)

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Spoiler:
Just because she saw it doesn't mean she'd recall everything later on.
And she might have omitted certain details; she was already angry at Lana because of the SL-9 aftermath and probably convinced herself that it was her who killed Goodman.
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Hmm... I may just be remembering things wrong, but

Spoiler: 2-2
If Dr. Grey shot at Mimi when she was crouching and changing into Maya's clothes, after putting Maya into the laundry box, then why didn't the bullet hit Maya in the box, not just the box itself?

That was phrased really weirdly...
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Spoiler:
I guess it's a thick box?
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Mikker wrote:
Melaris wrote:
Every now and then, we're reminded that Maya can't see what's happening when Mia is being called to the real world, yet sometimes Maya does know about it, without Phoenix having told her.


I believe that is explained in AA3: TaT. They write notes to each other. :udgy:


yeah, but like when maya calls mia in the actual court room to help phoenix and she knows what goes on in the court room with no one telling her. it was only twice when they wrote notes to each other, Once in JFA where maya is trapped and calles mia for help, and once in T&T where dahlia is trying to kill maya so maya asks mia what to do by writing a note the channeling her so she can reply. :minuki:
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iloveedgeworth wrote:
yeah, but like when maya calls mia in the actual court room to help phoenix and she knows what goes on in the court room with no one telling her. it was only twice when they wrote notes to each other, Once in JFA where maya is trapped and calles mia for help, and once in T&T where dahlia is trying to kill maya so maya asks mia what to do by writing a note the channeling her so she can reply. :minuki:

Phoenix probably tells her what happens.
She shouldn't know what's going on, it's even stated once that Phoenix wants Pearls to channel Mia during 2-4 so that she doesn't see what goes on.
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Burninator wrote:
Hmm... I may just be remembering things wrong, but

Spoiler: 2-2
If Dr. Grey shot at Mimi when she was crouching and changing into Maya's clothes, after putting Maya into the laundry box, then why didn't the bullet hit Maya in the box, not just the box itself?

That was phrased really weirdly...


Spoiler:
Its quite possible that she wasn't in the box when the shot was fired. If Grey fired the gun while Mimi was dragging Maya, then he could have missed, hitting Maya's sleeve, the backdrop, and then the box.

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This just occurred to me...

In 2-2, Mimi and Morgan planned to pin the crime on Maya by having Mimi dress up as Maya, have Phoenix + Lotta burst into the room to see "Maya" with all the blood and stuff, and then have Morgan shoo them out. But Phoenix only broke into the Channeling Chamber because of the gunshots, which weren't part of the plan. If "Maya" screamed, that wouldn't have exactly fit in with the whole "Maya killed Grey" story. If they wanted to just wait it out and have Morgan say "zomg something must be wrong, Phoenix get in there" then Mimi could've just drugged Maya, splattered blood on her, and left her there. That Mimi dressed up as Maya shows they wanted Phoenix and Lotta to see her, but how was she gonna get them into the room? >_>



(Also, another fallacy: The whole "The spirit took over Maya and killed Grey" thing just doesn't work at all. After all, if it had happened like that, it would've been Maya that had brought the knife into the room, not the spirit. If anything, the argument should've been "Maya herself killed Grey, but tried to make it seem as if was actually a spirit she was channeling")
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Bad Player wrote:
In 2-2, Mimi and Morgan planned to pin the crime on Maya by having Mimi dress up as Maya, have Phoenix + Lotta burst into the room to see "Maya" with all the blood and stuff, and then have Morgan shoo them out. But Phoenix only broke into the Channeling Chamber because of the gunshots, which weren't part of the plan. If "Maya" screamed, that wouldn't have exactly fit in with the whole "Maya killed Grey" story. If they wanted to just wait it out and have Morgan say "zomg something must be wrong, Phoenix get in there" then Mimi could've just drugged Maya, splattered blood on her, and left her there. That Mimi dressed up as Maya shows they wanted Phoenix and Lotta to see her, but how was she gonna get them into the room? >_>

I believe that they confessed that Mimi was supposed to walk out the room, dressed as Maya and show herself to the people in the area (Phoenix and Lotta). Then Morgan would "chase" her, drag her away and use the Spirit Severing technique.
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Nurio wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
In 2-2, Mimi and Morgan planned to pin the crime on Maya by having Mimi dress up as Maya, have Phoenix + Lotta burst into the room to see "Maya" with all the blood and stuff, and then have Morgan shoo them out. But Phoenix only broke into the Channeling Chamber because of the gunshots, which weren't part of the plan. If "Maya" screamed, that wouldn't have exactly fit in with the whole "Maya killed Grey" story. If they wanted to just wait it out and have Morgan say "zomg something must be wrong, Phoenix get in there" then Mimi could've just drugged Maya, splattered blood on her, and left her there. That Mimi dressed up as Maya shows they wanted Phoenix and Lotta to see her, but how was she gonna get them into the room? >_>

I believe that they confessed that Mimi was supposed to walk out the room, dressed as Maya and show herself to the people in the area (Phoenix and Lotta). Then Morgan would "chase" her, drag her away and use the Spirit Severing technique.

whoa really where? (doesn't remember that at all)
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Bad Player wrote:
whoa really where? (doesn't remember that at all)

Well, my memory is really bad so I might be recalling this incorrectly. So I might be wrong about this.
However, it's still a plausible explanation for the cough-up.
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Nurio wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
whoa really where? (doesn't remember that at all)

Well, my memory is really bad so I might be recalling this incorrectly. So I might be wrong about this.
However, it's still a plausible explanation for the cough-up.

I think this was deduced by Phoenix at some point.
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I definitely recall this being explicitly mentioned, too.
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Contradiction:Miles edgeworth's first case
Ok in 3-4 he said it was His first case going against mia fey also her first case
But in ace attorney investigations in case 4
So. my first job as a prosecutor. a replacement prosecutor
Im pretty sure you cant have 2 first cases
can anyone explain?
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HoboPhoenix wrote:
Contradiction:Miles edgeworth's first case
Ok in 3-4 he said it was His first case going against mia fey also her first case
But in ace attorney investigations in case 4
So. my first job as a prosecutor. a replacement prosecutor
Im pretty sure you cant have 2 first cases
can anyone explain?


Spoiler: AAI
Simple explanation: He never actually got to prosecute that case in AAI-4.

"Turnabout Reminiscence" (AAI-4) took place in September 2011. On that day was supposed to be Edgeworth's first job as a prosecutor, in which he would have taken Byrne Faraday's place as the prosecutor against Mack Rell for his crime of murdering Deid Mann. But, before the trial started, both Byrne Faraday (the previous prosecutor) and Mack Rell (the defendant) were killed in the court, and so the trial was forced to be cancelled. Since Edgeworth was already there (and is so cool and smart and lawyerly-trained) he did his investigations and proved some stuff, but that wasn't technically a "case."

("NOT SAIBAN," ja? :kyouya: Just because it took place in a court didn't make it a trial. None of the "cases" in Ace Attorney Investigations are actually "cases" because they don't go to trial. They're just that -- "investigations." Although Edgeworth essentially pinpoints each culprit, no sentences are technically given: the accused still has to have a real trial by due process. For example, the characters mention in the game's ending that the trial is still upcoming for [insert final villain spoiler here~] after AAI-5.)

He didn't prosecute, because the guy he was supposed to be prosecuting...died.


So he had to wait a little longer for his official first chance for actual courtroom action, which wasn't until February 2012, in "Turnabout Memories" (3-4).
...And then look at what happens to the defendant in that case, too... :wacky-edgy: P-poor Edgeworth... Can't even have a normal, non-depressing career.
Still, that qualifies as his "first case," because it actually went to court.
((But, even that didn't count toward his win record because a verdict was never reached.))

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HONESTLY for goodness sake do any of these things actually matter
does it matter if a tiny mystery isn't solved or something is mislabelled! does it really matter if there is a tiny contradiction in the game?

well... i don't think it matters that much :sadshoe:
I think i am in love with miles edgeworth
:phoenix: :maya: :franny: :edgy: :ema: :phoenix: :ka-whip:
Re: Phoenix Wright Cough UpsTopic%20Title
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Super High-School Level Galaxy Defender

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iloveedgeworth wrote:
HONESTLY for goodness sake do any of these things actually matter
does it matter if a tiny mystery isn't solved
or something is mislabelled! does it really matter if there is a tiny contradiction in the game?

well... i don't think it matters that much :sadshoe:



Um, they may or may not matter, but the purpose of this thread is to just discuss 'em. So if you don't think it's important, just click 'back' at your browser...
Re: Phoenix Wright Cough UpsTopic%20Title
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1000% Knight

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Okey, so Mimi was just gonna waltz out of the channeling chamber on her own. But there is still...

Bad Player wrote:
(Also, another fallacy: The whole "The spirit took over Maya and killed Grey" thing just doesn't work at all. After all, if it had happened like that, it would've been Maya that had brought the knife into the room, not the spirit. If anything, the argument should've been "Maya herself killed Grey, but tried to make it seem as if was actually a spirit she was channeling")

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Re: Phoenix Wright Cough UpsTopic%20Title
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My childhood right here

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Bad Player wrote:
Okey, so Mimi was just gonna waltz out of the channeling chamber on her own. But there is still...

Bad Player wrote:
(Also, another fallacy: The whole "The spirit took over Maya and killed Grey" thing just doesn't work at all. After all, if it had happened like that, it would've been Maya that had brought the knife into the room, not the spirit. If anything, the argument should've been "Maya herself killed Grey, but tried to make it seem as if was actually a spirit she was channeling")

Wait, what? They WERE pinning the crime on Maya, so their argument wouldn't matter. Doesn't the prosecution pull this card EVERY CASE? "I'm going to bullshit an explanation now, Your Honor." "OK fine by me. Penalty to the defense, not the dangerous, weapon-wielding maniac called the prosecution!"
Re: Phoenix Wright Cough UpsTopic%20Title
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But it was a stupid way to pin the crime on Maya, because there's no reason Maya would've brought a knife into the channeling chamber.
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