Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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TheSteelSamurai wrote:
And remember, Spark Brushel was being watched. If Zak had contacted him to have a will created, odds are he would have been killed a lot sooner.
OK then, maybe he planned the whole thing (his assumed name, his will, etc) before his disappearing act. *grasps at straws*
If anyone can disprove that I'll be amazed.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
What is my liiiife?!?
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$10 X 12 X 15 = $1800
$15 X 12 X 15 = $2700
$20 X 12 X 15 = $3600
And all this is based on the assumption that the comment isn't a JOKE. :)
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Did Zak really have much of anything besides the performance rights to give away, anyway? Like a claim check from a poker casino in Vegas?
I'm gone for so long, and the colors got all psychedelic! Woohoo!
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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plus, my friend is 14, and machi-josh-machi-josh-machi-josh-OMFG!!!! THEY ARE LIKE WHAT?!?!?! the underestimation of age. FIGHT AGAINST IT!
i like the obvious check-for-fingerprints-on-gun contradiction. xD and seriously how is machi supposed to drag-or ANYONE FOR THAT MATTER-
this ain't a contradiction, but does anybody else thing the switching of the type of images they put into the music video kind of ....annoying?
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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~{₱ʜʘ€₦ℓẍ ₩®¡ğɧ₮}~ wrote:
also, i know i'm being a fuckin spoil sport here, but the fact that Borignese is like...can people speak symbols?
You're looking at symbols right now, hombre. No, the symbols used to represent Borginese ingame don't mean anything, but that's a silly way to put it.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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~{₱ʜʘ€₦ℓẍ ₩®¡ğɧ₮}~ wrote:
also, i know i'm being a fuckin spoil sport here, but the fact that Borignese is like...can people speak symbols?
Um, of course? What do you think written language is? Just because it's not written phonetically using English characters doesn't make it less of a language.
I mean, I'm sure the developers didn't bother to make it consistent or coherent, but just because they're "symbols" doesn't automatically make them less of a language.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
Soooooo not a Nazi!
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Anyway, Lamiroir's previous testimonies were already questionable, and in this case, she was also acting as a translator.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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[Team Sonic] Shadow wrote:
One thing that I never got: why not trust Lamiroir's testimony? Just because "she might have lied to protect Machi" is kinda a bad reason to bring down her testimony. Phoenix can't use this arguement in 1-3 when Oldbag testifies. "Oldbag could be lying to get my client guilty!"
Lamiroir has a clear motive, Oldbag doesn't.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
I got a letter.
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And everyone in the band is part of law. And they have an international star performing with them. If things didn't go exactly to plan, why on earth wouldn't the special effects people be like 'holy shit stop the show now'.
This isn't even mentioning that I don't believe that many of the Gavinners' fans could have been thrilled with Lamiroir's segment. People go to rock concerts for loud rock and roll and Gavinners, not for... slow, soothing melodies. If I were at that concert, I'd of demanded my money back.
It seems to me that Klavier didn't even get the other band members' permission to get Lamiroir to play. He was just all, "I'M DOING THIS BECAUSE I WANT TO!" and Daryan's all 'man what's with the blind bitch she dumb', and we don't even meet the other band members(we should have, to at least throw a little suspicion off Daryan...)
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
I got a letter.
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
Keep your hand at the level of your eyes
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Why would Machi want to kill Letouse? I know they uncovered the whole cocoon thing (it looks like a jellybean), but before the whole cocoon thing was unveiled, what motive did they have?
Machi doesn't look like a serial killer.
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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theatrejunkie wrote:
Klavier beating his flaming guitar made me laugh... not to be sadistic or anything.
Why would Machi want to kill Letouse? I know they uncovered the whole cocoon thing (it looks like a jellybean), but before the whole cocoon thing was unveiled, what motive did they have?
Machi doesn't look like a serial killer.
Why would Machi want to kill Letouse? I know they uncovered the whole cocoon thing (it looks like a jellybean), but before the whole cocoon thing was unveiled, what motive did they have?
Machi doesn't look like a serial killer.
Well, at that point, they thought that no one could possibly have any motive to kill a stranger from a foreign land who they hadn't even met. Except, well, Machi.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
Eep! Gargle...
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
eight bit goddess
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Ace Attorney wrote:
This is really a 4-4 contradiction, but it connects to Lamiroir.
Spoiler: 4-4
Because Zak Gramarye Is A Jerk.
Spoiler:
Quote:
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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About the 4-3 contradictions list, there is not a single contradiction in 4-3. There are a lot of stupid things, where the police make enormous mistakes. The unlikelihood of Machi doing it is not a contradiction without proof. It is true that Machi probably could not perform those feats, but LeTouse could have a slow reaction time to allow Machi to shoot him, and there are a few possibilities for transporting LeTouse. Although those possibilities are insane, as long as they exist, there are no contradictions. The police's ineptitude at some of these things only shows that they have overlooked evidence, not that the evidence contradicts the outcome of the plot. LeTouse naming Lamiroir as a witness is stupid, but he may have known about the trick. One "contradiction" may have been that, despite not knowing Daryan, he could have described his "unique" hairstyle to Apollo. However, that only shows that LeTouse either decided not to say anything about that, somehow didn't see a man with that hairstyle shoot twice, or is just an idiot.
Therefore, no contradictions remain!
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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The body was transported in a short time, and no one saw. There's no way Machi would have even been remotely able to move such a big corpse in general, let alone under those conditions. It would also be ridiculous for him to do so, given the risks and utter pointlessness of it. The body also had to be carried up stairs and placed on a platform. Then there's the fact that Machi himself ends up on this platform, unconscious. If he had been the one to move the body and raise it, he'd have to be able to fly or something to get up there without a ladder. Also, there is the fact that LeTouse knows Machi, and he makes it clear he did not know his killer, even though it's unthinkable he would not see him. And LeTouse could not have slow reaction time. The man is a trained Interpol agent, masquerading as a bodyguard.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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If you prefer it that way, Tmabbbb, you may imagine we're discussing implausibilities, but we call them contradictions.
LeTouse's body up on the platform is the most egregious one to me. There simply isn't a plausible explanation for thinking that Machi did it.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Why have Lamirior('s double) come onto stage, be introduced, start to lip-sing (or switch and then lip-sing), have Lamirior run through a vent while singing, then appear for 2 seconds? Wouldn't it have been much easier to have Lamirior come onto stage, disappear, sing while right underneath the stage, and have the lookalike ready on the other side appear for 2 seconds?
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Litral wrote:
LeTouse's body up on the platform is the most egregious one to me. There simply isn't a plausible explanation for thinking that Machi did it.
Unless it really isn't just a wierd hairstyle...>_>
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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I'm guessing Lamiroir may have to talk to people before and after the performance, so she has to be there both at the beginning and at the end. Maybe. Although it really is never explained...
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Litral wrote:
I'm guessing Lamiroir may have to talk to people before and after the performance, so she has to be there both at the beginning and at the end. Maybe. Although it really is never explained...
She can't talk to people from the high platform at the other edge.
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
Keep your hand at the level of your eyes
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Litral wrote:
theatrejunkie wrote:
Klavier beating his flaming guitar made me laugh... not to be sadistic or anything.
Why would Machi want to kill Letouse? I know they uncovered the whole cocoon thing (it looks like a jellybean), but before the whole cocoon thing was unveiled, what motive did they have?
Machi doesn't look like a serial killer.
Why would Machi want to kill Letouse? I know they uncovered the whole cocoon thing (it looks like a jellybean), but before the whole cocoon thing was unveiled, what motive did they have?
Machi doesn't look like a serial killer.
Well, at that point, they thought that no one could possibly have any motive to kill a stranger from a foreign land who they hadn't even met. Except, well, Machi.
The man who killed John Lennon didn't know him either. He was an obsessive fan.
Some crazy Lamiroir fan could have killed LeTouse to try to take a shot at Lamiroir. They never thought of that.
Machi's arm is not ripped off! He's not the murderer!
"Beginning today, treat everyone you meet as if they were going to be dead by midnight. Extend to them all the carekindness, and understanding you can muster, and do it with no thought of any reward." --Og Mandino
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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theatrejunkie wrote:
Litral wrote:
theatrejunkie wrote:
Klavier beating his flaming guitar made me laugh... not to be sadistic or anything.
Why would Machi want to kill Letouse? I know they uncovered the whole cocoon thing (it looks like a jellybean), but before the whole cocoon thing was unveiled, what motive did they have?
Machi doesn't look like a serial killer.
Why would Machi want to kill Letouse? I know they uncovered the whole cocoon thing (it looks like a jellybean), but before the whole cocoon thing was unveiled, what motive did they have?
Machi doesn't look like a serial killer.
Well, at that point, they thought that no one could possibly have any motive to kill a stranger from a foreign land who they hadn't even met. Except, well, Machi.
The man who killed John Lennon didn't know him either. He was an obsessive fan.
Some crazy Lamiroir fan could have killed LeTouse to try to take a shot at Lamiroir. They never thought of that.
Machi's arm is not ripped off! He's not the murderer!
Yes, but the man knew of John Lennon. If you were going to kill a star, you're going to go for the star, not for her no-name manager.
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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okay 1.the bullet hole nearest to the door should've gone through the parition wall, it makah no sensah
2. well...if lamiroire peeked through the door like straight before ema came back...IS EMA BLIND?!!?
3. fingerprints on gun? machi? gloves?
4. teleportation trick....HOW THE FREAK DID VALANT SOMEHOW MAGICALLY LOOK LIKE LAMIROIRE?!?!?!?! I DON'TKNOW ABOUT YOU, BUT IT SEEMS HIGHLY UNLIKELY THAT ANYONE WOULD BE TRICKED LIKE THAT. also, how is lamiroire supposed to get to the top of that tower?
thats all the contradictions i have now.
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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TheSteelSamurai wrote:
During the Machi/Lamiroir cross-examination, when you catch Lamiroir lying about the lyrics, she comments on how scary Apollo's eyes suddenly get. But...she shouldn't be able to see that...>_>
'Tis part of her faking seeing act :D
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
Keep your hand at the level of your eyes
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TheSteelSamurai wrote:
During the Machi/Lamiroir cross-examination, when you catch Lamiroir lying about the lyrics, she comments on how scary Apollo's eyes suddenly get. But...she shouldn't be able to see that...>_>
But don't forget...
Spoiler: 4-4
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Litral wrote:
TheSteelSamurai wrote:
During the Machi/Lamiroir cross-examination, when you catch Lamiroir lying about the lyrics, she comments on how scary Apollo's eyes suddenly get. But...she shouldn't be able to see that...>_>
'Tis part of her faking seeing act :D
She also could have used her bracelet to tell that Polly was getting all intense, and then said that his eyes were intense as part of her act.
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Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
Cross-examining your posts!
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Formerly Avenger...
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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LeTouse probably did try to call for help, but he was dying from blood-loss. He was shot as the second set was ending, and we know he tried to write out his IP number before the killer even left. By the time he was alone, the next set had probably started. It's doubtful anyone would hear him over that loud music, and maybe he hoped Lamiroir or Machi would return after their set was over and find him and get help.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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machi: (#&$(#&(@*&#$
Lamiroir: But then you'll be alone
Machi: (*#$&(#*$&Q
And she goes on to explain how he's shy and what not and then he leaves. Then we are supposed to be surprised that he can understand English? And she acts all shocked too. That was the biggest contradiction for me.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
Just a bit tipsy, see.
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Question.
Answer.
@theatrejunkie This is more of a technicality than anything else, but Machi wouldn't be considered a serial killer. He only "killed" one person, and it was someone he knew. Generally, serial killers have multiple victims and have no or very little connection to them.
Spoiler:
?Answer.
Spoiler:
@theatrejunkie This is more of a technicality than anything else, but Machi wouldn't be considered a serial killer. He only "killed" one person, and it was someone he knew. Generally, serial killers have multiple victims and have no or very little connection to them.
Re: The Massive 4-3 Contradictions List *spoilers*
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Artistic Socialism wrote:
@theatrejunkie This is more of a technicality than anything else, but Machi wouldn't be considered a serial killer. He only "killed" one person, and it was someone he knew. Generally, serial killers have multiple victims and have no or very little connection to them.
Continuing the nitpick, that's not 'generally', that's part of the definition of serial killing - there's also the cool down period between killings.
But to address the comment that kicked off this digression, Machi's apparent lack of motive is a problem to be sorted out during the investigation (which is what happened), or at trial. Motive is only one of three aspects to be considered for a potential suspect - means, motive, and opportunity. By the version of events they were working on at the time, he's one of a handful of people with the means (access to Letouse and his gun) and the opportunity (backstage at the apparent time of the crime) to commit the crime, and the only one of that group with the means to escape (able to slip through the air-vent).
Motive's also the weakest of the 3 factors, as it's the easiest hidden - someone with an obvious motive would be eliminated by lack of means and opportunity (because they couldn't have done it), but someone with the means and opportunity, but no apparent motive is still a valid suspect - at least until someone with means, opportunity, and a clear motive shows up - because, well, as we see in this case, they might have a motive that just takes a little digging to discover.
There's a Sherlock Holmes quote - 'Once you eliminate the impossible, whatever's left, however improbable, must be the answer'. Given when they thought the crime had happened, and how the killer escaped, anyone other than Machi doing it was impossible. That he was rather improbable - it would be sheer luck that the gun didn't snap him in two, and at the time they didn't know he had a reason to kill Letouse - doesn't eliminate him as a suspect.
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