Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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So who do you think is going to star in GS6? We've got a happy end of Nick, Athena, and Apollo in GS5. Are they all going to appear, like in GS5? Or will we just focus on 1 or 2 of them? Or will we get a completely new protagonist?
I'm personally hoping that Athena gets written out off-screen, and the main star is Polly. (And Nick will be busy with his own cases or something. But obviously it ends up being related to Polly's case at some point!)
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Yeah Apollo will probably be along for the ride as well, but I hear where your coming from with all the complaints about GS5 suffering from too many protagonists. I really loved the games before this since you got to play as the same character throughout the whole game, it really allowed you to get attached to them. Even GS3 wasnt so bad, despite the fact that Phoenix was only playable for 2 and a half cases, because GS3 was still clearly Phoenix's game. I feel the franchise is loosing its identity with so many playable characters. Phoenix or Apollo, one has to run the franchise. I would prefer Phoenix, since I feel like hes a much more fleshed out character, but I hear the pleads for more Polly (which I hear was answered in GS5.) SO personally I'd prefer an all Phoenix game, one where his character is developed and explored more. Wouldnt care if Apollo popped in for one case, but no more than that. They can loose Athena, she looks ok, I like the fact that shes actually an attorney, but they didnt need to make her playable. Sidekick would have been fine.
So thats my opinion on the future of the franchise, I get the love for Apollo, and pleads for him to take over, but personally I prefer Phoenix.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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GyakutenGodot wrote:
Sadly its probably going to be a long time until we get GS6 since next will most likely be GK3.
A Gyakuten game has been released in Japan on average every other year since the series began, so I think we'll get another game in 2015. Of course, the question is if it will be GK3 or GS6. (The only time it hasn't been 2 years was between GS1 and GS2, which was 1 year, and between GS3 and GS4, which was 3 years... which then averages out to 2 years.)
It's true that Nick has been fleshed out the most of any AA protagonist, but that's why I want him to step down already. He's been developed and fleshed out--now do the same for Polly.
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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TheIdioteque wrote:
I'd like for Phoenix to become somewhat like how Edgeworth was in GS5, where he only takes on really big cases. That way we could play as Apollo for most of the game, and then Phoenix can step in during the final case (but not in a way that it would overshadow Apollo).
By the way, no real need for a spoiler tag.
Anyways, the only reason the Edgeworth things worked in GS1-GS3 is because he is an opponent, a prosecutor. He is able to appear in a every final case without overshadowing Phoenix. Apollo on the other hand is a protagonist and defense attorney like phoenix, when ever you are playing as one, it takes away form the other. There is no way for Phoenix to be playable in the last case without taking away from Apollo. The last cases usually make the game, its the shining moment for the main character. You destroy your main characters development if he doesnt defend for the last case. Thats why Edgeworth and Phoenix are different than Apollo and Phoenix.
BadPlayer wrote:
It's true that Nick has been fleshed out the most of any AA protagonist, but that's why I want him to step down already. He's been developed and fleshed out--now do the same for Polly.
As I said, I totally understand, and agree. I really do like Apollo. I just like Phoenix more. I dont know. I'd be happy either way. Maybe its just because Im nostalgic for the older games.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Now, at the point we are at now Phoenix is no longer the rookie attorney that he once was, he's the best around. There's not really that much room for development for Phoenix, whereas Apollo has had two games that despite being a great character he has been constantly been overshadowed by Phoenix. Phoenix should stay with an advisory role to Apollo, and Athena. He should certainly be a big part of the story, but it's Apollo's time to shine now.
One thing that I would say, is that if you want Phoenix playable - how about standalone DLC cases? Something that is to the scale of Rise From The Ashes would be great, as it was a huge case but doesn't tie in to any games story.
Eh, that's just what I think. If Phoenix is the main character of the next game I probably won't be complaining too much.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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meur123 wrote:
I like Phoenix a lot, and although I doubt this will happen I feel that Phoenix should step down too. AA6 should focus on Apollo, and if a second attorney should be playable (although I'm in the minority here) I think it should be Athena. Phoenix's story ended in AA3. The way he returned in AA4 was obviously a disappointment to fans, and would have been a bad way for Phoenix's story to end, so I feel that it was good that he got his badge back.
Now, at the point we are at now Phoenix is no longer the rookie attorney that he once was, he's the best around. There's not really that much room for development for Phoenix, whereas Apollo has had two games that despite being a great character he has been constantly been overshadowed by Phoenix. Phoenix should stay with an advisory role to Apollo, and Athena. He should certainly be a big part of the story, but it's Apollo's time to shine now.
One thing that I would say, is that if you want Phoenix playable - how about standalone DLC cases? Something that is to the scale of Rise From The Ashes would be great, as it was a huge case but doesn't tie in to any games story.
Eh, that's just what I think. If Phoenix is the main character of the next game I probably won't be complaining too much.
Now, at the point we are at now Phoenix is no longer the rookie attorney that he once was, he's the best around. There's not really that much room for development for Phoenix, whereas Apollo has had two games that despite being a great character he has been constantly been overshadowed by Phoenix. Phoenix should stay with an advisory role to Apollo, and Athena. He should certainly be a big part of the story, but it's Apollo's time to shine now.
One thing that I would say, is that if you want Phoenix playable - how about standalone DLC cases? Something that is to the scale of Rise From The Ashes would be great, as it was a huge case but doesn't tie in to any games story.
Eh, that's just what I think. If Phoenix is the main character of the next game I probably won't be complaining too much.
I fully agree with this post.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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I mean, GS fans love those rehashed plots and over developed characters that serve little to no purpose right? Seriously, this'll probably happen.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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meur123 wrote:
Now, at the point we are at now Phoenix is no longer the rookie attorney that he once was, he's the best around. There's not really that much room for development for Phoenix, whereas Apollo has had two games that despite being a great character he has been constantly been overshadowed by Phoenix. Phoenix should stay with an advisory role to Apollo, and Athena. He should certainly be a big part of the story, but it's Apollo's time to shine now.
That's kind of what I was saying. Phoenix is at the point where I feel that he should only work on really big cases similar to Edgeworth in GS5 now that he's the Chief Prosecutor. Too bad there's not a "Chief Defense Attorney" role that Phoenix could take on. He definitely deserves a role like that.
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TheIdioteque wrote:
meur123 wrote:
Now, at the point we are at now Phoenix is no longer the rookie attorney that he once was, he's the best around. There's not really that much room for development for Phoenix, whereas Apollo has had two games that despite being a great character he has been constantly been overshadowed by Phoenix. Phoenix should stay with an advisory role to Apollo, and Athena. He should certainly be a big part of the story, but it's Apollo's time to shine now.
That's kind of what I was saying. Phoenix is at the point where I feel that he should only work on really big cases similar to Edgeworth in GS5 now that he's the Chief Prosecutor. Too bad there's not a "Chief Defense Attorney" role that Phoenix could take on. He definitely deserves a role like that.
Yeah, he's the cheif of the Wright Anything Agency of course :)
I agree that Phoenix should definitely be one to only take big cases, but he shouldn't take the last case of Apollo's game. As stated above by others, that would be completely robbing Apollo of his shining moment of the game. A Standalone large DLC case that is similar to Rise From The Ashes would be a perfect way of using Phoenix as a playable character.
TopHatProfessor1014 wrote:
Apollo Justice is like what Raiden was for Metal Gear Solid 2. A young, brash, mostly unlikeable character that constantly had to receive help from the more experienced original protagonist. And of course, Apollo looks more "badass" in DD like how Raiden returned as the katana-wielding ninja in MGS4. All that's left now is to make Phoenix into a dying old man.
I never found Apollo unlikeable to be honest, I always liked him. I think he's just as strong of a protagonist as Phoenix. Yes, he constantly needed help but that was more of a problem with Phoenix's prominence is AA4 than of Apollo's character.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Quote:
I never found Apollo unlikeable to be honest, I always liked him. I think he's just as strong of a protagonist as Phoenix. Yes, he constantly needed help but that was more of a problem with Phoenix's prominence is AA4 than of Apollo's character.
He's okay I guess. Like Raiden, I never actually HATED Apollo; but I felt him to be a huge step down from Phoenix's character. In fact, I barely remember playing AJ. To me, the game is the weakest and most forgettable in the series.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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And his assistants will still be cute, perky teenagers.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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TheIdioteque wrote:
That's kind of what I was saying. Phoenix is at the point where I feel that he should only work on really big cases similar to Edgeworth in GS5 now that he's the Chief Prosecutor. Too bad there's not a "Chief Defense Attorney" role that Phoenix could take on. He definitely deserves a role like that.
Well, there are things like the bar association, so it's not like there are no high-up positions for attorneys, although admittedly the Chief Prosecutor to prosecutors is different from someone on the bar association to attorneys.
Thane wrote:
And his assistants will still be cute, perky teenagers.
But that's true of all lawyers!
Also, another reason I want Athena written out of the next game: I don't want more Mood Matrix. I think it was done well in GS5, but... that's why I don't want it again; I think they've pretty much done all there is to do with it.
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Thane wrote:
Phoenix Wright will be shouting objections until he defies the human lifespan.
And his assistants will still be cute, perky teenagers.
And his assistants will still be cute, perky teenagers.
I knew it. He IS a law vampire. That explains how he can look so young in court. He'll suck out all of the darkness in law until it's pure, and then we can finally have a game with Phoenix as the villain. I am so psyched.
On a more serious note, the Mood Matrix does seem to have outlived its prime utility. Unless Capcom can come up with an even more inventive way around it, it's going to dull drastically from its introduction in this game. Another way around the issue would be to introduce yet another application that Athena has programmed into Monita, so we won't need another main character for the sake of introducing new game mechanics. Monita is still a
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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ravensep wrote:
Regarding GS6, I have my eyes on Shu Takumi. Now that he is done with Professor Layton vs Ace attorney, I am wondering what would be his next move. As much as I am hyped for GS5, I still have doubts if I will like it or not because he was not involved in its development. If Shu Takumi decides not to work on GS franchise then I think Motohide Eshiro might just work on GK3.
I could be misremembering, but if I recall correctly a few months ago on Twitter he said he was starting on his next project. (He took a vacation after PLvsAA.) So unless they're planning way in advance, I don't think he's going to be working on GS6/GK3. Maybe a new IP?
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Rubia Silve Ryu wrote:
Thane wrote:
Phoenix Wright will be shouting objections until he defies the human lifespan.
And his assistants will still be cute, perky teenagers.
And his assistants will still be cute, perky teenagers.
I knew it. He IS a law vampire. That explains how he can look so young in court. He'll suck out all of the darkness in law until it's pure, and then we can finally have a game with Phoenix as the villain. I am so psyched.
Sort of like Ash Ketchum - he feeds on virgins to maintain his eternal youth.
Seriously though, I am a bit worried they'll overuse him. If they keep having him as the main character the plot will feel slightly...I don't know, like a soap opera with neverending drama. That's why I think they should focus a bit more on Apollo or a new character.
I feel like the first game wrapped things up so nicely. Of course I'm glad they kept making the games since they're so bleeping good, but I think it will be harder for the franchise to have that level of closure the longer it keeps going.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Bad Player wrote:
So who do you think is going to star in GS6? We've got a happy end of Nick, Athena, and Apollo in GS5. Are they all going to appear, like in GS5? Or will we just focus on 1 or 2 of them? Or will we get a completely new protagonist?
I'm personally hoping that Athena gets written out off-screen, and the main star is Polly. (And Nick will be busy with his own cases or something. But obviously it ends up being related to Polly's case at some point!)
Is this what we want, or what we think?
They're pretty big on Athena. Maybe that's the 'fan reaction' they're waiting on. How they take a 'measure' of that who knows.
I know the series can't 'disbar' Phoenix again. I don't think there's any promotion ('District Chief Defense Attorney') either.
Maybe they'd just try and write another game with the 3 lawyers 'co-starring'.
This is all assuming Takumi doesn't come back. Him writing a GS6.... who knows?
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Quote:
I never found Apollo unlikeable to be honest, I always liked him. I think he's just as strong of a protagonist as Phoenix. Yes, he constantly needed help but that was more of a problem with Phoenix's prominence is AA4 than of Apollo's character.
I always found Apollo to be a likeable guy, but he never really had his stand out moment in GS4 the way that Phoenix did in GS1. He basically got his hand held by Phoenix and Klavier throughout all of his trials, and still acted far too "newbie" ish at the end. I hear that GS5 gives him a bit of an edge, and exactly what he needs to make him "main protagonist" worthy.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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TheIdioteque wrote:
I don't see why so many say that Phoenix will be around until he's ancient. I know it's a joke and all, but Phoenix isn't that old. He's only in his early 30s, not to mention that some of his prosecutor opponents (Winston, Gaspen, Manfred) were well into their 50s. I would think that, in game, Phoenix has a good 20-30 years left before he should realistically think about retiring.
While we were indeed joking, we were joking mainly about Capcom's reluctance to let go of Phoenix as the main character.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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As if a compromise, GS5 takes both their roles and splits them into two uneven pieces (much like how the fandom has been split, heh). And because their newest employee can't be written out from her own introduction, they give her a star role as well. I can see that Yamazaki and his team were opting for an entirely new story, given that Phoenix's old ones were just about over with. Sadly, Apollo's story seems more of a latch-on. They want to expand on it, but not everyone agrees that he should take the spotlight.
I'm not disappointed with the final release of GS5. I'm just disappointed that it feels so detached with the rest of the series. Hopefully, with the arrival of GS6, these new characters will gain more development and thus, more empathy from the players. After all, some people hated Gumshoe in the first game, but over time, came to love him.
Actually, the parallels they make between Apollo and Athena give them different aspects to their characters. Now, I better see them as a pair, as opposed to Apollo and Trucy. And when I say "pair", I'm not talking about romance. This is the bond of friendship at its purest. And on the side, Phoenix has become more of a "boss" type of character. I am rather satisfied with how much of a defense attorney team they've formed into, and how well it matches with their corresponding prosecutor rivals.
Okay, enough moping around. Here's to GS6 being an even wilder ride than ever!
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Bad Player wrote:
I hope Trucy gets a bigger role in GS6. I think Polly + Trucy is the best pair in the franchise. Seriously, the beginning of 5-2 was great.
Spoiler: Sort of spoilers? Not really but...
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Rubia Silve Ryu wrote:
It's a sad state of affairs if one thinks about it. Takumi knew that Phoenix's story should have ended with the original trilogy, but because it was so popular, Capcom couldn't risk losing support by taking Phoenix out altogether.
Well that was just an assumption Capcom Marketing made. You can see it happening in other things too: for example, books by an author which were clearly originally envisioned as a separate novel with different characters, but rewritten to be the 'sequel' to their popular earlier standalone work at the behest of publishers. Now some people would have complained about missing Phoenix and how the originals were better but they still would have played a total cast reset. I know I would have. It's how they made a new story which not writing proper continuity with the old cast that's distracting from enjoying GS4. In an actual new story with a new cast you don't have to think about that, you can just enjoy the new plot and cast. Maybe later you might think it wasn't as good as the first, but you can better enjoy it for what it is. Or it might end up BETTER than the originals. If Phoenix and Apollo aren't in the same story it's not setting up any kind of direct 'rivalry' from fans over who they like better.
Takumi knew best about his own story so Capcom Marketing should have listened to him. Also forcing him to include stuff about the Jury was obviously a challenge for him, (as he himself implies in the GS4 blog) especially since he's more a fan of unrealistic plots rather than real world issues. I get the sense he was really going for something profound in GS4, but due to whatever... producer's 're-interpretation', running out of time, etc. it didn't quite manifest in a way we can properly appreciate and parts are just confusing. (The MASON system for one, and when Phoenix spoke about the Dark time coming for the legal system, what did TAKUMI mean? Not the canon fanfic the new writers wrote about it.). And whatever profound thing he's writing around Phoenix (in some strange ironic spin on 1-5 and who knows what else) is mashed up with what ended up as a half-attempt at a new Apollo-centric story reset as originally intended.
In some ways his GS4-Phoenix story reminds me of 2-3. Everyone hates the case, but if you look at it more carefully, it's making some pretty profound comments. But it's just not fun and the music is awful. It's like a disturbing artpiece. But clearly they were at least trying something ambitious rather than a superficial fun time at the circus. So although I liked GS1-3 a lot better, in many ways GS4 is clearly the most interesting and ambitious game. The annoying thing is Takumi really didn't seem to bring his full vision for it to fruition due to time constraints and whatever else the various staffers did to his concepts. Matsukawa as producer would have had a huge influence on the game. It's too hard to know which parts of the staff did what.
As for what they tried with GS5... well this really isn't AJ2. Not the way GS2 was to GS1. It's kind of a halfway-reset again I guess.
Spoiler:
I don't think they know themselves what GS6 will be (if it eventuates - didn't they say more Phoenix Wright but not necessarily more GS6?) at the present time.
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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All of this to say that, whether we like it or not, Phoenix will probably stay the main protagonist of the Ace Attorney series for a loooong time. I think the only way Capcom will let Phoenix step down for good is if he gets a proper 'retirement' from the series and officially passes the torch to Apollo or a different pupil of his (or is killed off, though I can't even imagine the backlash that would cause).
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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icer wrote:
Spoiler:
I'd say that this plays the biggest role of all. GS4's end reveals some huge twists that could potentially be spoiled if the team had stayed with Apollo's story. For the most part, vague references to Phoenix's last case before disbarment and the Gramarye line could work, but someone who hadn't played the previous game wouldn't understand the importance nearly as well as another who did. It makes it unfair to players who happen to start the series on a later game than otherwise.
For example, there's the issue over whether to include Phoenix's "dilemma" about announcing Trucy and Apollo's true relationship. To someone out of the loop, this just feels like something completely thrown in for no good reason. To someone in the loop, if it were taken out completely, it'd be like how some fans are reacting now.
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Rubia Silve Ryu wrote:
I'd say that this plays the biggest role of all. GS4's end reveals some huge twists that could potentially be spoiled if the team had stayed with Apollo's story. For the most part, vague references to Phoenix's last case before disbarment and the Gramarye line could work, but someone who hadn't played the previous game wouldn't understand the importance nearly as well as another who did. It makes it unfair to players who happen to start the series on a later game than otherwise.
For example, there's the issue over whether to include Phoenix's "dilemma" about announcing Trucy and Apollo's true relationship. To someone out of the loop, this just feels like something completely thrown in for no good reason. To someone in the loop, if it were taken out completely, it'd be like how some fans are reacting now.
For example, there's the issue over whether to include Phoenix's "dilemma" about announcing Trucy and Apollo's true relationship. To someone out of the loop, this just feels like something completely thrown in for no good reason. To someone in the loop, if it were taken out completely, it'd be like how some fans are reacting now.
They do claim this is a kind of follow-up/sequel to GS4 though. If 'new' players get the idea it's a good idea to also buy previous titles so much the better.
GS2 and GS3 seemed to be written in that things were reviewed in case the players had a poor memory, and smaller details to solve cases (probably) weren't spoiled, but major plot points or resolution that were important character development were retained. For example, the outcome of 1-4 is rehashed in GS2. We don't wonder if maybe Edgeworth was guilty of the murder of his father or anything to avoid 'spoiling' it if you played GS2 before Gs1. So the characters did move forward between games rather than weird resetting/ignoring of core developments. There was a point to effecting the major resolutions in the previous title. For example sure Edgey's disappeared by GS2, but when he comes back in 2-4 he's directly crediting Phoenix's actions in GS1 and 1-4 for changing him. This scene is so much more powerful because it's also our achievement, we actually played that stuff, so there was a point to completing the previous game and solving the cases. It's part of why these stories are better as games not just movies or something where you just watch.
I don't think knowing Apollo and Trucy are siblings spoils much of the surprise of GS4. It might be less of a surprise but with this knowledge you can still appreciate the game as a touching story of them being reunited, while it happens, even though they don't know. Phoenix could have told them that part BEFORE GS5, without ever revealing the larger spoiler about Thalassa being alive and their mother. It's not betraying Thalassa's secret at all for Apollo to simply know he's Trucy's brother. Trucy just thinks her mother is dead, and she still does by GS5 as far as we know.
Maybe Thalassa doesn't want Trucy to know she'd had a first child beforehand. Well I'm kind of low on sympathy to be honest. But the secret seemed to be more that Thalassa herself didn't want to see them after being 'dead' for so long. Due to this well we don't get to have the Trucy-Apollo relationship developed like it could have been. They could just know they're siblings by the time we see them again and add this to their dynamic.
Also how are juries a spoiler? I thought everyone knew the game was commissioned to be about juries due to the jury referendum in Japan. Maybe new player's curiosity would be piqued at these other stories and they'd go back and play GS4? It's not like it ruins GS5 to vaguely mention something like that, like it didn't go ahead for some reason ('just a trial... not happening YET etc'). There's so much text they might not even notice. Now juries are ret-conned out it feels even more like the whole deal was just so Phoenix could rig the trial/game, not something about actual reform for the improvement of justice.
So I guess this kind of writing 'policy' makes any claim of 'continuity' feel unnatural, since key developments and resolutions are 'forgotten'. It's like what was the point of all that hard work playing though them? It's stupid to always make 'new players' come first when they ALSO keep on numbering them and claiming they're direct follow ups to the previous game/s. They don't call it Series 2 or something.
Spoiler:
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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icer wrote:
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Spoiler:
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Auburnsun wrote:
To be fair, it's not like they haven't included spoilers in past sequels. T&T literally is a walking spoiler for the previous two entries in the series and as strange as this sounds, I know people that started the series with T&T. GK2 also heavily spoils AAI and PW to an extent.
icer wrote:
They do claim this is a kind of follow-up/sequel to GS4 though. If 'new' players get the idea it's a good idea to also buy previous titles so much the better.
GS2 and GS3 seemed to be written in that things were reviewed in case the players had a poor memory, and smaller details to solve cases (probably) weren't spoiled, but major plot points or resolution that were important character development were retained. For example, the outcome of 1-4 is rehashed in GS2. We don't wonder if maybe Edgeworth was guilty of the murder of his father or anything to avoid 'spoiling' it if you played GS2 before Gs1. So the characters did move forward between games rather than weird resetting/ignoring of core developments. There was a point to effecting the major resolutions in the previous title. For example sure Edgey's disappeared by GS2, but when he comes back in 2-4 he's directly crediting Phoenix's actions in GS1 and 1-4 for changing him. This scene is so much more powerful because it's also our achievement, we actually played that stuff, so there was a point to completing the previous game and solving the cases. It's part of why these stories are better as games not just movies or something where you just watch.
GS2 and GS3 seemed to be written in that things were reviewed in case the players had a poor memory, and smaller details to solve cases (probably) weren't spoiled, but major plot points or resolution that were important character development were retained. For example, the outcome of 1-4 is rehashed in GS2. We don't wonder if maybe Edgeworth was guilty of the murder of his father or anything to avoid 'spoiling' it if you played GS2 before Gs1. So the characters did move forward between games rather than weird resetting/ignoring of core developments. There was a point to effecting the major resolutions in the previous title. For example sure Edgey's disappeared by GS2, but when he comes back in 2-4 he's directly crediting Phoenix's actions in GS1 and 1-4 for changing him. This scene is so much more powerful because it's also our achievement, we actually played that stuff, so there was a point to completing the previous game and solving the cases. It's part of why these stories are better as games not just movies or something where you just watch.
It's just a matter of knowing what to spoil and how to implement it so that the answer isn't just given away. Of course we'd expect Phoenix to successfully defend Edgeworth in his trial, or the latter wouldn't be a recurring character. And yet, throughout GS2, no one mentioned anything specific about Manfred von Karma's disappearance, but only that he's "gone". Phoenix describes him briefly via flashback, but never did this game suggest that Edgeworth's trial was being prosecuted specifically by von Karma. Of course, us fans already know the whole story.
By the way, since GS4 is a different time altogether, someone who jumps over the game right into GS5 would be meeting Apollo, Trucy, and Klavier for the first time. GS5 didn't reveal anything about the existence of Kristoph Gavin or that Klavier had a brother at all. Now why is that? Although bringing it up would be good incentive for new players to try GS4 later, there's no place for it to fit. The only place I can imagine it being placed in without seeming too obtrusive would be with Klavier's introduction, but clearly Apollo doesn't want to complicate it.
I'm not saying that they couldn't have thrown in a small reference and brushed it aside when Athena could start prying, but it leaves the question of whether it's necessary to leave in. The games' pacing is pretty slow in the first place, and adding extra tidbits drags on everything. References to past games that aren't related to the case at hand are better done if they're placed in optional dialogue lines... like from presenting attorney's badges.
Quote:
I don't think knowing Apollo and Trucy are siblings spoils much of the surprise of GS4. It might be less of a surprise but with this knowledge you can still appreciate the game as a touching story of them being reunited, while it happens, even though they don't know. Phoenix could have told them that part BEFORE GS5, without ever revealing the larger spoiler about Thalassa being alive and their mother. It's not betraying Thalassa's secret at all for Apollo to simply know he's Trucy's brother. Trucy just thinks her mother is dead, and she still does by GS5 as far as we know.
Maybe Thalassa doesn't want Trucy to know she'd had a first child beforehand. Well I'm kind of low on sympathy to be honest. But the secret seemed to be more that Thalassa herself didn't want to see them after being 'dead' for so long. Due to this well we don't get to have the Trucy-Apollo relationship developed like it could have been. They could just know they're siblings by the time we see them again and add this to their dynamic.
Maybe Thalassa doesn't want Trucy to know she'd had a first child beforehand. Well I'm kind of low on sympathy to be honest. But the secret seemed to be more that Thalassa herself didn't want to see them after being 'dead' for so long. Due to this well we don't get to have the Trucy-Apollo relationship developed like it could have been. They could just know they're siblings by the time we see them again and add this to their dynamic.
It doesn't have much influence in this game at all, yes. That's exactly why it's something kept to GS4. It's not needed info to know to continue the story or to appreciate Apollo and Trucy's relationship. Mia's death, on the other end of the spectrum, is a must to be recapped in following games.
Quote:
Now juries are ret-conned out it feels even more like the whole deal was just so Phoenix could rig the trial/game, not something about actual reform for the improvement of justice.
The juries were the best part of case 4-4. I wanted them back in. Regardless, it's up to the players' interpretation of Nick's character on whether or not he rigged the trial. Based on a casual conversation between him and Edgey about his badge, Edgey may have had some involvement in it too. But it is pointless to keep mum about the entire jurist system renovations in a sequel. They could have at least given more hints to the public's reaction to that verdict, without tying Nick directly to that trial.
Quote:
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
If anything, I want something more interesting to happen with Trucy. The Gramarye lineage was a mess, and lineage conflicts aren't supposed to be easy to clean up. (Oh, but they seemed to have dropped it by the end of GS4. Hmm...)
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1/3/19 edit: The project has officially been moved to a new blog at https://gsvsaa.blogspot.com/ Further updates will be pending.
AA fanfiction archive: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=31369
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My misc translation and work promos here at http://rubiaryutheroyal.tumblr.com
1/3/19 edit: The project has officially been moved to a new blog at https://gsvsaa.blogspot.com/ Further updates will be pending.
AA fanfiction archive: viewtopic.php?f=11&t=31369
Yakuza/RGG fanfiction archive: https://archiveofourown.org/users/rubia ... /rubia_ryu
My misc translation and work promos here at http://rubiaryutheroyal.tumblr.com
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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Quote:
Quote:
Now juries are ret-conned out it feels even more like the whole deal was just so Phoenix could rig the trial/game, not something about actual reform for the improvement of justice.
The juries were the best part of case 4-4. I wanted them back in. Regardless, it's up to the players' interpretation of Nick's character on whether or not he rigged the trial.
Of course, yes it was ambiguous in GS4 itself. But by writing this particular follow up, it makes it seem less 'ambiguous'. Was the Jury trial just something so Phoenix could clear his name, that being the motive for Phoenix (and Edgeworth if he was helping)? or was it really about reforming things so all trials were more fair?
If it was indeed the latter, we'd expect the juries to be mentioned in the next game, not just fall down a plothole. If it's the former, it's yet another thing swept under the rug about Hobo!Phoenix, about as legit as his forged Ace (which I'm assuming was NOT mentioned.) It's fine that they didn't add a jury to the gameplay, but there could be some reason they didn't happen. It could have even been a plotpoint to do with the dark time of law. The way this is, it could just as easily be after the 'Bad End' where the jury was hung. (Although you'd expect Apollo to be a bit more upset if that were so, I suppose.) So that's not really good continuity.
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Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
Sarcastic Prosecutor
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I think the game will have a new protagonist...
Phoenix Wright - Justice for U!
Only for the 3DS and WiiU
YOU!
You design your attorney, record your voice to be used in game as well.
Maybe it will be like Pokémon in a sense?
Im not getting my hopes up, but it would be neat.
Re: Who will star in GS6? (GS5 spoilers)
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pokemonmercury wrote:
I've been itching with this Idea.
I think the game will have a new protagonist...
Phoenix Wright - Justice for U!
Only for the 3DS and WiiU
YOU!
You design your attorney, record your voice to be used in game as well.
Maybe it will be like Pokémon in a sense?
Im not getting my hopes up, but it would be neat.
I think the game will have a new protagonist...
Phoenix Wright - Justice for U!
Only for the 3DS and WiiU
YOU!
You design your attorney, record your voice to be used in game as well.
Maybe it will be like Pokémon in a sense?
Im not getting my hopes up, but it would be neat.
I wouldn't say putting Ace Attorney on the Wii U is too far-fetched. It'd be a perfect fit for the tablet controller. Then again, there's a lot of things that would work well for the system. Too bad no one's taking it seriously.
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