Re: Random conversations about Games
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I actually completed a Y Nuzlocke myself back in March I believe. I had actually wanted a Golurk in that route, but ended up getting Eevee instead. Jolteon ended up being my go to Pokemon, so it was worth it. Y was one of the easier ones to run. I did end up keeping the EXP share on though. I wanted to keep it off, but the trainers levels scaled too quickly and I didn't want to waste time grinding. The only downside is it made the game a little easy, but it's one of the few where I kept my starter through the whole thing.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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To be precise, the way it's presented makes no sense because it's not consistent. When we first see Lysandre with Diantha, he asks if she wouldn't prefer to be young and beautiful forever - which would point to him wanting to create a world of youthfulness and/or immortality. Then later he says this world is dirty and tainted because of evil humans. Okay... and then, when he finally reveals himself, he says he wants to, like, kill all Pokémon and a good chunk of the "pointless" humans so that the productive people can continue to life and won't take up all the resources...
Is it just me or do those things have NOTHING in common? And is this an issue with X, too? His plan sounds like it was hapharzadly cut together with various ideas before he settled on something?
C-A
PS: I'm playing with the idea of eventually getting ORAS (well OR most likely I am sick of Team Aqua) but I'm not sure... I don't like the big emphasis on the story and I hate the lack of customization... why did they remove that? I know that it wasn't THAT rich in X/Y but it was better than nothing! (And change May's hair it looks freaking stupid!)
Re: Random conversations about Games
Elohim Essaim Elohim Essaim
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CatMuto wrote:
A thought that occured to me about Lysandre in Pokémon Y last night: his... plan makes no sense.
To be precise, the way it's presented makes no sense because it's not consistent. When we first see Lysandre with Diantha, he asks if she wouldn't prefer to be young and beautiful forever - which would point to him wanting to create a world of youthfulness and/or immortality. Then later he says this world is dirty and tainted because of evil humans. Okay... and then, when he finally reveals himself, he says he wants to, like, kill all Pokémon and a good chunk of the "pointless" humans so that the productive people can continue to life and won't take up all the resources...
Is it just me or do those things have NOTHING in common? And is this an issue with X, too? His plan sounds like it was hapharzadly cut together with various ideas before he settled on something?
C-A
PS: I'm playing with the idea of eventually getting ORAS (well OR most likely I am sick of Team Aqua) but I'm not sure... I don't like the big emphasis on the story and I hate the lack of customization... why did they remove that? I know that it wasn't THAT rich in X/Y but it was better than nothing! (And change May's hair it looks freaking stupid!)
To be precise, the way it's presented makes no sense because it's not consistent. When we first see Lysandre with Diantha, he asks if she wouldn't prefer to be young and beautiful forever - which would point to him wanting to create a world of youthfulness and/or immortality. Then later he says this world is dirty and tainted because of evil humans. Okay... and then, when he finally reveals himself, he says he wants to, like, kill all Pokémon and a good chunk of the "pointless" humans so that the productive people can continue to life and won't take up all the resources...
Is it just me or do those things have NOTHING in common? And is this an issue with X, too? His plan sounds like it was hapharzadly cut together with various ideas before he settled on something?
C-A
PS: I'm playing with the idea of eventually getting ORAS (well OR most likely I am sick of Team Aqua) but I'm not sure... I don't like the big emphasis on the story and I hate the lack of customization... why did they remove that? I know that it wasn't THAT rich in X/Y but it was better than nothing! (And change May's hair it looks freaking stupid!)
Lysandre's plot did make no sense. He's a villian basically just because he looks like a bad guy. The Delta Episode from the end of the ORAS games has a better plot line than the entirety of X/Y.
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Re: Random conversations about Games
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On April 3, 2016, Court Records Forums experienced a miracle upon that day.
I feel the same
CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
Re: Random conversations about Games
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Quote:
introduced the idea of multiple timelines
What timelines? Zelda has no timelines - at least, none that A) make sense and B) are actually vitally important to know.
C-A
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dullahan1 wrote:
The one thing I didn't like with the Delta Episode was that it pulled a Zelda, or more specifically, Ocarina of Time, and introduced the idea of multiple timelines to explain the differences between Ruby and Sapphire and their remakes, specifically about the Mega Stones. Threw the simplicity of Pokemon right out the window. I miss the day where the most convoluted timeline in Pokemon was how Gold and Silver took place 3 years after Red and Blue. I still enjoyed Delta, but I don't like what it did.
I see what you're saying, and I agree yet disagree by pointing out that pokemon has been complicated since Gen 3; when abilities and double battles were introduced. Plus, the Delta Episode, to me, played out like a soap opera, and I just could not take it seriously.
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Re: Random conversations about Games
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CatMuto wrote:
Quote:
introduced the idea of multiple timelines
What timelines? Zelda has no timelines - at least, none that A) make sense and B) are actually vitally important to know.
C-A
For Zelda, it's not our opinions that determine whether there are timelines or not, because I'd honestly do away with them myself, but Nintendo has claimed it's canon, so whether we want to say they're there or not, it's there.
But really, the only games I'll accept that have the "timelines" between games are:
The Legend of Zelda to Zelda II
Link to the Past to Link Between Worlds
Ocarina of Time to Majora's Mask
Ocarina of Time to Wind Waker to Phantom Hourglass to Spirit Tracks
The only reason I support it for these games is because somewhere in the plot, it's explicitly stated that they're sequels or what not, so it follows. But I'm not going to give in to stuff like the multiple timeline theory that Nintendo is trying to stabilize because even Nintendo honestly has no idea what's up with all that since it's so convoluted.
@moonlit: I'm not talking complicated from a gameplay perspective. I'm talking complicated from a timeline standpoint. Gold and Silver had a simple 3 year time skip from Red and Blue. DPPt are highly suggested to take place at the same time as Gold and Silver. The other games never referenced time nor did it matter. So as far as timelines went for these games, it was rather tame since time was rarely addressed in the series outside of really Gold and Silver.
I'm simply saying that ORAS introducing the idea of multiple timelines have suddenly complicated the once simple time concept within the Pokemon universe.
Gameplay wise, I agree that it got WAY more complicated starting in Gen.3 because there was a major overhaul of the mechanics from Gen.2, to the point where Pokemon was basically starting from scratch again.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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Quote:
but Nintendo has claimed it's canon
That doesn't change the fact that the timelines themselves make no difference to the games. None of the games ever felt like direct sequels - not even Wind Waker, which I'm only calling a distant future sequel since a good hundred years or longer passed. And as I've pointed out before, looking at Waker as Ocarina's sequel just makes me raise questions that aren't given satisfying answers.
Even if we don't regard a World Building or Lore Building aspect, the timelines make no difference. It doesn't make a lick of difference in the game or its experience itself which Link I'm supposedly controlling right now or what has or has no happened.
C-A
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I do, however, consider some Zelda games direct sequels because you're controlling the exact same Link from the previous one and the game addresses it as such. Majora's Mask, Phantom Hourglass, and even Zelda II explicitly say they're direct sequels that take months to a couple of years after their predecessors. So, in that regard, I'll adhere to the existence of "a timeline" in terms of a sequel, but for the overarching timelines with the 3 paths and all that nonsense, forget it.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
Re: Random conversations about Games
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dullahan1 wrote:
Oh, the timelines don't matter to me in the longrun. It's all about playing the games and enjoying them for what they are. I may aesthetically prefer one Link over another because of how he may look, same with Zelda, but at the end of the day, it's still a Zelda game.
I do, however, consider some Zelda games direct sequels because you're controlling the exact same Link from the previous one and the game addresses it as such. Majora's Mask, Phantom Hourglass, and even Zelda II explicitly say they're direct sequels that take months to a couple of years after their predecessors. So, in that regard, I'll adhere to the existence of "a timeline" in terms of a sequel, but for the overarching timelines with the 3 paths and all that nonsense, forget it.
I do, however, consider some Zelda games direct sequels because you're controlling the exact same Link from the previous one and the game addresses it as such. Majora's Mask, Phantom Hourglass, and even Zelda II explicitly say they're direct sequels that take months to a couple of years after their predecessors. So, in that regard, I'll adhere to the existence of "a timeline" in terms of a sequel, but for the overarching timelines with the 3 paths and all that nonsense, forget it.
And that's an excellent way to view the LoZ series, because the "canon timeline" is basically fanservice. Who really pays attention to that anyway? Now maybe if it was one complete and singular timeline...
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TheMoonlitAttorney wrote:
And that's an excellent way to view the LoZ series, because the "canon timeline" is basically fanservice. Who really pays attention to that anyway? Now maybe if it was one complete and singular timeline...
Apparently a whole lot of Zelda players who think you're an idiot if you don't follow the timelines to the letter.
I've said it before, I wouldn't mind the Zelda timelines if they made sense entirely without resulting in Nintendo going back and saying "uh yeah, uh, there's another split in the timeline here, yeah, uh, yeah" to explain something and if the timelines actually made a difference. In terms of experiencing or even just playing the game.
Go ahead and add, like, a quiz minigame that asks you things about the timeline - at least that way I'd understand needing to have basic knowledge of it.
Then again, the timeline mostly just came about because people were complaining because the games weren't actually connected and then Nintendo just said, "FINE. Here have your stupid timeline, we'll go back to doing our job".
C-A
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CatMuto wrote:
Apparently a whole lot of Zelda players who think you're an idiot if you don't follow the timelines to the letter.
I've said it before, I wouldn't mind the Zelda timelines if they made sense entirely without resulting in Nintendo going back and saying "uh yeah, uh, there's another split in the timeline here, yeah, uh, yeah" to explain something and if the timelines actually made a difference. In terms of experiencing or even just playing the game.
Go ahead and add, like, a quiz minigame that asks you things about the timeline - at least that way I'd understand needing to have basic knowledge of it.
Then again, the timeline mostly just came about because people were complaining because the games weren't actually connected and then Nintendo just said, "FINE. Here have your stupid timeline, we'll go back to doing our job".
C-A
I've said it before, I wouldn't mind the Zelda timelines if they made sense entirely without resulting in Nintendo going back and saying "uh yeah, uh, there's another split in the timeline here, yeah, uh, yeah" to explain something and if the timelines actually made a difference. In terms of experiencing or even just playing the game.
Go ahead and add, like, a quiz minigame that asks you things about the timeline - at least that way I'd understand needing to have basic knowledge of it.
Then again, the timeline mostly just came about because people were complaining because the games weren't actually connected and then Nintendo just said, "FINE. Here have your stupid timeline, we'll go back to doing our job".
C-A
Then again, have you ever met someone who cares about the timeline to such an extent? I am a huge fan of the LoZ series, but even I don't know the canonical timeline that well.
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Re: Random conversations about Games
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CatMuto wrote:
Apparently a whole lot of Zelda players who think you're an idiot if you don't follow the timelines to the letter.
I've said it before, I wouldn't mind the Zelda timelines if they made sense entirely without resulting in Nintendo going back and saying "uh yeah, uh, there's another split in the timeline here, yeah, uh, yeah" to explain something and if the timelines actually made a difference. In terms of experiencing or even just playing the game.
Go ahead and add, like, a quiz minigame that asks you things about the timeline - at least that way I'd understand needing to have basic knowledge of it.
Then again, the timeline mostly just came about because people were complaining because the games weren't actually connected and then Nintendo just said, "FINE. Here have your stupid timeline, we'll go back to doing our job".
C-A
I've said it before, I wouldn't mind the Zelda timelines if they made sense entirely without resulting in Nintendo going back and saying "uh yeah, uh, there's another split in the timeline here, yeah, uh, yeah" to explain something and if the timelines actually made a difference. In terms of experiencing or even just playing the game.
Go ahead and add, like, a quiz minigame that asks you things about the timeline - at least that way I'd understand needing to have basic knowledge of it.
Then again, the timeline mostly just came about because people were complaining because the games weren't actually connected and then Nintendo just said, "FINE. Here have your stupid timeline, we'll go back to doing our job".
C-A
Then again, have you ever met someone who cares about the timeline to such an extent? I am a huge fan of the LoZ series, but even I don't know the canonical timeline that well.
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CatMuto wrote:
TheMoonlitAttorney wrote:
And that's an excellent way to view the LoZ series, because the "canon timeline" is basically fanservice. Who really pays attention to that anyway? Now maybe if it was one complete and singular timeline...
Apparently a whole lot of Zelda players who think you're an idiot if you don't follow the timelines to the letter.
I've said it before, I wouldn't mind the Zelda timelines if they made sense entirely without resulting in Nintendo going back and saying "uh yeah, uh, there's another split in the timeline here, yeah, uh, yeah" to explain something and if the timelines actually made a difference. In terms of experiencing or even just playing the game.
Go ahead and add, like, a quiz minigame that asks you things about the timeline - at least that way I'd understand needing to have basic knowledge of it.
Then again, the timeline mostly just came about because people were complaining because the games weren't actually connected and then Nintendo just said, "FINE. Here have your stupid timeline, we'll go back to doing our job".
C-A
I think it was more Ocarina of Time was so popular that fans clamored for more, that Nintendo started to reference the game in any way they could. Majora's Mask was okay because it was a sequel, and on the same system, and because of development time and the engine it ran on, it borrowed a lot of the same elements so it had to have a connection. I'm okay with this.
Then Wind Waker. Okay, so the beginning references OoT, says the world was drowned, blah blah blah. So it's a distant sequel. Was a bit wary here, but considering it didn't run off anything OoT did and it's really the first time they pull for a distant sequel, I'm still okay with this.
Then Twilight Princess. Let's throw more OoT references left and right. By this point, things were getting ridiculous. And then Nintendo outright claims that, hey, this game is also a distant sequel to OoT. But it takes place in Hyrule. But how, Hyrule was drowned out. I know, alternate timelines!
But wait, if that's the case, what about the games made before OoT? How do they connect to OoT? I know! We introduced alternate timelines, let's create something completely convoluted so it all connects. Fans are already doing it, we might as well make it official.
I don't think it was so much Nintendo getting frustrated and saying "here's your timeline", I think it was more sticking to the OoT nostalgia with a lot of their main games and writing themselves into a corner. A couple of games, I was okay with because it could follow one thing. But when they corner themselves and start claiming alternate timelines, that's when I just want to slap something.
I still love OoT, it still has some solid core gameplay, and really helped to define the 3D Zeldas and how they work. It's still something I enjoy. Gameplay wise, I love what it did with the Zelda series. Story-wise, no. Because of it's popularity and time travel plot, Nintendo felt the need to tack every subsequent game somehow to OoT. Like they felt they had to connect every game to this one, and because of the whole time travel plot, they probably thought they could and still have the liberty to make the later games do what they want. Instead though, it made everything confusing.
I'd have preferred if later games would have referenced OoT as Easter Eggs, not as a basis for a new plot. Ironically enough, OoT3D did that with Skyward Sword. I thought it was neat.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
Re: Random conversations about Games
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Now, it was speculation as to where the other games fit, but Ocarina of Time was always addressed in its specific place in the timeline. As time went on, before Skyward Sword, I started getting confused about another game whose timeline was uncertain, Minish Cap. It got overlooked, but like Ocarina of Time, it doesn't have a past hero. Rather, the past "hero" was a normal man, not Link. It also addressed how Link supposedly gets his signature hat.
One thing I did think it handwaved great was it explained why you find things in grass. I thought it was a cute explanation.
And then Skyward Sword brings up the origins of Ganondorf and Hyrule and then comes up again where Link's green garments came from. At this point, I'm just tired of the origin stories and I just want to enjoy the game.
I'm really hoping the new Zelda just stays away from all this nonsense and turns out to be a fun game. I'm fine with Easter Eggs, but keep 'em that way. I don't mind the story, but after it's gotten so convoluted, keep it from referencing a timeline.
And yes, I'm a hypocrite because this comes from a guy whose favorite 3D Zeldas are Majora's Mask and Wind Waker, which have a lot of references to the Ocarina of Time timeline. But they're fun and that's all I care about.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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Quote:
I'd have preferred if later games would have referenced OoT as Easter Eggs, not as a basis for a new plot
Agreed. Unless they can do the sequel thing well, I much prefer to just plain have references to other titles. Look at the Tales Of games - they tend to have references to all sorts of Tales Of or other Namco games. Namcot Island in Tales of the Abyss is basically nothing but one location stuffed with all sorts of references to Tales Of games or other games like Valkyrie.
Quote:
Ironically enough, OoT3D did that with Skyward Sword.
How? I know I played Ocarina 3DS once but I don't remember a reference...
Quote:
Nintendo feels that it would fare better with their fans, which consists mostly of older/veteran players who remember OoT in a very positive light
I'm of their generation of fans who are the older/veteran ones, but I honestly do not see Ocarina in a positive light. Up to now, no matter what age I played Ocarina at, it always bored me. When I first played it at age 8, it bored me. As I got older, it still bored me. Guess something about the pacing just feels absolutely off for me.
Quote:
And then Skyward Sword brings up the origins of Ganondorf and Hyrule and then comes up again where Link's green garments came from.
Well the origin of his clothes in that game wasn't anything special - it was just plain that year's decided color for the senior year's garbs.
Quote:
I'm really hoping the new Zelda just stays away from all this nonsense and turns out to be a fun game.
Hope so, too. Especially if they are trying to make it their best Zelda game to date. Don't try to tell me it's anywhere in the timeline, just give me references and make the game fun. Preferably with some ways to quick-travel to places cause I, for one, hate travelling times.
C-A
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It's funny because traveling times bother me in some games, but not others. It's odd because I loved the traveling in Wind Waker though I know a lot don't. But something about it just always gave me a sense of adventure so I was able to enjoy it. But I do much prefer having quick travel. I still feel out of all Zelda games, Ocarina, Majora, and Twilight Princess handled it the best. Wind Waker had a problem of being too big and I wish Skyward Sword could have done something for the hub world. I appreciate what it did for "Hyrule", but I wish I didn't have to fly back up and down just to move to another area quicker. It's tedious.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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Quote:
but I wish I didn't have to fly back up and down just to move to another area quicker. It's tedious.
That is a problem in the game, but it's a small one for me. Likely BECAUSE the sky is on a scale that I can get from one end to another within 3 Minutes or less - which, compared to Waker's huge ocean, was simpler to deal with. Even with the teleport song in Waker, I still had to sail for about 5 minutes to the next location I wanted. (Or longer if it was the Forsaken Fortress because OF COURSE we can't a proper teleport close to that place)
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Anyway, I was at my friend's house and had a rude awakening. We were going through the Earth Temple and it was...bad? I got really bored really quickly
I started thinking about other stuff in the game and there's not much I remember enjoying. There are definitely moments--returning to the Forsaken Fortress, killing that bird, killing that room full of enemies in the sunken Hyrule, the story, and fighting Ganondorf
A lot of the rest is bleh. I don't have to mention the dreaded Triforce quest which is the definition of padding, but not a single dungeon sticks out in my memory besides Forsaken Fortress (but that's quick). Worst of all, there are so few of them
I think the game could do with some tweaking. About two more dungeons (or just improve the ones they have), sail upgrades, and give every single spot on the map an island with its own sidequest. If you can't do that, there's no reason for the map to be as large as it is
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Honestly, I think my favorite thing about Wind Waker is how the dungeon items don't get put aside after you've used them in their respective dungeon. Examples include using the Grapple Hook (love the steal mechanic by the way), Deku Leaf (liked how they combined a new mechanic with the iron boots), and so on. Compare to say, Twilight Princess where after the dungeon, the item is only used a couple of more times for minor things. Looking at the Spinner and Dominion Rod. I like it when the Zelda games do that so the items don't serve as just a gimmick. Wish they'd do that more.
And Cat, I know I'm weird, but I just prefer the sailing in Wind Waker to flying in Skyward Sword. It probably has a lot to do with me taking 10 minutes in the tutorial to even figure out completely how the thing works, but then again, I'm not a fan of motion controls. Compare to the 10 seconds it took me to master the boat. That's probably got a lot to do with my preference.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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dullahan1 wrote:
Are you referring to the original or the HD version? They really improved the Triforce thing in the HD version, but I had heard many times before that they included the padding because they were pressed for time with the original's release. I heard they were originally going to have 2 more dungeons, but they had to be cut for time.
Honestly, I think my favorite thing about Wind Waker is how the dungeon items don't get put aside after you've used them in their respective dungeon. Examples include using the Grapple Hook (love the steal mechanic by the way), Deku Leaf (liked how they combined a new mechanic with the iron boots), and so on. Compare to say, Twilight Princess where after the dungeon, the item is only used a couple of more times for minor things. Looking at the Spinner and Dominion Rod. I like it when the Zelda games do that so the items don't serve as just a gimmick. Wish they'd do that more.
And Cat, I know I'm weird, but I just prefer the sailing in Wind Waker to flying in Skyward Sword. It probably has a lot to do with me taking 10 minutes in the tutorial to even figure out completely how the thing works, but then again, I'm not a fan of motion controls. Compare to the 10 seconds it took me to master the boat. That's probably got a lot to do with my preference.
Honestly, I think my favorite thing about Wind Waker is how the dungeon items don't get put aside after you've used them in their respective dungeon. Examples include using the Grapple Hook (love the steal mechanic by the way), Deku Leaf (liked how they combined a new mechanic with the iron boots), and so on. Compare to say, Twilight Princess where after the dungeon, the item is only used a couple of more times for minor things. Looking at the Spinner and Dominion Rod. I like it when the Zelda games do that so the items don't serve as just a gimmick. Wish they'd do that more.
And Cat, I know I'm weird, but I just prefer the sailing in Wind Waker to flying in Skyward Sword. It probably has a lot to do with me taking 10 minutes in the tutorial to even figure out completely how the thing works, but then again, I'm not a fan of motion controls. Compare to the 10 seconds it took me to master the boat. That's probably got a lot to do with my preference.
The original
I didn't know about the steal mechanic with the grapple hook or the deku/boots combo. Are those new to HD as well?
And Wind Waker still has the useless hammer. I actually prefer the spinner and dominion rod because they made for two really good dungeons--I just wish that those were a dungeon gimmick instead of the item you're expected to keep for the rest of the game
I also prefer sailing
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JesusMonroe wrote:
dullahan1 wrote:
Are you referring to the original or the HD version? They really improved the Triforce thing in the HD version, but I had heard many times before that they included the padding because they were pressed for time with the original's release. I heard they were originally going to have 2 more dungeons, but they had to be cut for time.
Honestly, I think my favorite thing about Wind Waker is how the dungeon items don't get put aside after you've used them in their respective dungeon. Examples include using the Grapple Hook (love the steal mechanic by the way), Deku Leaf (liked how they combined a new mechanic with the iron boots), and so on. Compare to say, Twilight Princess where after the dungeon, the item is only used a couple of more times for minor things. Looking at the Spinner and Dominion Rod. I like it when the Zelda games do that so the items don't serve as just a gimmick. Wish they'd do that more.
And Cat, I know I'm weird, but I just prefer the sailing in Wind Waker to flying in Skyward Sword. It probably has a lot to do with me taking 10 minutes in the tutorial to even figure out completely how the thing works, but then again, I'm not a fan of motion controls. Compare to the 10 seconds it took me to master the boat. That's probably got a lot to do with my preference.
Honestly, I think my favorite thing about Wind Waker is how the dungeon items don't get put aside after you've used them in their respective dungeon. Examples include using the Grapple Hook (love the steal mechanic by the way), Deku Leaf (liked how they combined a new mechanic with the iron boots), and so on. Compare to say, Twilight Princess where after the dungeon, the item is only used a couple of more times for minor things. Looking at the Spinner and Dominion Rod. I like it when the Zelda games do that so the items don't serve as just a gimmick. Wish they'd do that more.
And Cat, I know I'm weird, but I just prefer the sailing in Wind Waker to flying in Skyward Sword. It probably has a lot to do with me taking 10 minutes in the tutorial to even figure out completely how the thing works, but then again, I'm not a fan of motion controls. Compare to the 10 seconds it took me to master the boat. That's probably got a lot to do with my preference.
The original
I didn't know about the steal mechanic with the grapple hook or the deku/boots combo. Are those new to HD as well?
And Wind Waker still has the useless hammer. I actually prefer the spinner and dominion rod because they made for two really good dungeons--I just wish that those were a dungeon gimmick instead of the item you're expected to keep for the rest of the game
I also prefer sailing
No, you can using the Grappling Hook to steal from enemies in the original too. It's a great way to gather Joy Pendents quickly so you're not spending lots of time farming them later.
I'll concede the hammer, but I still stand by my statement that most of the items in the game aren't one-offs. And I love the spinner, but they wasted so much potential on it. Honestly, it's my stance on Twilight Princess as a whole, but that's another story.
To me, the good dungeons in that game were the desert one, the yeti one, and Hyrule Castle. While the Temple of Light was a neat throwback, I honestly didn't like that dungeon much at all. It's just glorified backtracking.
As for the Leaf/Boots combo, a lot of it was used in the Wind Temple.
But Jesus, if you're interested, some of your problems with the original Wind Waker were alleviated or fixed in the HD verison.
They added a faster sail, significantly reduced the tedious Triforce Quest tracking, now letting you find 5 pieces straight up and having to use charts on only 2. Also, enemies don't knock you out of your boat anymore. Can't tell you how needed that was.
They also changed the Pictograph, it defaults at color, you can hold more pictures, and you get a notice if your picture is worthy to be made into a figurine. And speaking of, you can now sculpt multiple figurines at once, and Miiverse even makes that easier as some players can give you characters that are hard to find pics of. It's a ton easier to 100% this if you like.
There were other minor changes made to the game I feel for the better as well.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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dullahan1 wrote:
I'll concede the hammer, but I still stand by my statement that most of the items in the game aren't one-offs. And I love the spinner, but they wasted so much potential on it. Honestly, it's my stance on Twilight Princess as a whole, but that's another story.
To me, the good dungeons in that game were the desert one, the yeti one, and Hyrule Castle. While the Temple of Light was a neat throwback, I honestly didn't like that dungeon much at all. It's just glorified backtracking.
As for the Leaf/Boots combo, a lot of it was used in the Wind Temple.
But Jesus, if you're interested, some of your problems with the original Wind Waker were alleviated or fixed in the HD verison.
They added a faster sail, significantly reduced the tedious Triforce Quest tracking, now letting you find 5 pieces straight up and having to use charts on only 2. Also, enemies don't knock you out of your boat anymore. Can't tell you how needed that was.
They also changed the Pictograph, it defaults at color, you can hold more pictures, and you get a notice if your picture is worthy to be made into a figurine. And speaking of, you can now sculpt multiple figurines at once, and Miiverse even makes that easier as some players can give you characters that are hard to find pics of. It's a ton easier to 100% this if you like.
There were other minor changes made to the game I feel for the better as well.
To me, the good dungeons in that game were the desert one, the yeti one, and Hyrule Castle. While the Temple of Light was a neat throwback, I honestly didn't like that dungeon much at all. It's just glorified backtracking.
As for the Leaf/Boots combo, a lot of it was used in the Wind Temple.
But Jesus, if you're interested, some of your problems with the original Wind Waker were alleviated or fixed in the HD verison.
They added a faster sail, significantly reduced the tedious Triforce Quest tracking, now letting you find 5 pieces straight up and having to use charts on only 2. Also, enemies don't knock you out of your boat anymore. Can't tell you how needed that was.
They also changed the Pictograph, it defaults at color, you can hold more pictures, and you get a notice if your picture is worthy to be made into a figurine. And speaking of, you can now sculpt multiple figurines at once, and Miiverse even makes that easier as some players can give you characters that are hard to find pics of. It's a ton easier to 100% this if you like.
There were other minor changes made to the game I feel for the better as well.
Honestly, the only thing that interests me about the remake is the pictobox for all the possible Link selfies
And you just named a lot of good dungeons to me regarding TP. The desert one might be my favorite in the series. Definitely up there
With Wind Waker, I can't really think of a dungeon that's more than "ok" besides Forsaken Fortress revisited. Even Tower of the Gods is pretty forgettable and the Earth Temple might be the worst in the series
The game with the best collection of temples is probably Majora's Mask actually
Maybe I'll get the HD version when I feel the need to replay Wind Waker, but that probably won't be for a while
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But yeah, the HD version of Wind Waker is basically Wind Waker, but without all the little things that would annoy you in the original.
I guess the Earth Temple for you is probably the equivalent of the Sky Dungeon in TP for me. Potential good music ruined by the annoying creature sounds, a very mediocre boss, and dungeon design that is less than stellar.
I probably agree now that Majora has the best selection of temples in a 3D Zelda game now, but it took me a while to warm up to Great Bay for a while. Prior, to me, it was a tie between OoT or Wind Waker. Honestly, there was never a time I've had in either game where there was a dungeon I'd dread going to. Wind Waker would probably stand out more if only because the bosses, to me, were more fun to fight. It helps that, to me, the combat in the series is the best in my opinion. I love the whole Parry feature.
I will say though, I think out of all 3D Zeldas, graphically Wind Waker has aged the best, but I personally like Cel-shading too. But even Twilight Princess, I feel, is definitely showing its age. HD Wind Waker didn't really change the graphics, just the lighting, and it looks gorgeous in HD. I'm hoping with Skyward Sword's graphic style, that it should age well too.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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dullahan1 wrote:
I guess the Earth Temple for you is probably the equivalent of the Sky Dungeon in TP for me. Potential good music ruined by the annoying creature sounds, a very mediocre boss, and dungeon design that is less than stellar.
I probably agree now that Majora has the best selection of temples in a 3D Zelda game now, but it took me a while to warm up to Great Bay for a while. Prior, to me, it was a tie between OoT or Wind Waker. Honestly, there was never a time I've had in either game where there was a dungeon I'd dread going to. Wind Waker would probably stand out more if only because the bosses, to me, were more fun to fight. It helps that, to me, the combat in the series is the best in my opinion. I love the whole Parry feature.
I will say though, I think out of all 3D Zeldas, graphically Wind Waker has aged the best, but I personally like Cel-shading too. But even Twilight Princess, I feel, is definitely showing its age. HD Wind Waker didn't really change the graphics, just the lighting, and it looks gorgeous in HD. I'm hoping with Skyward Sword's graphic style, that it should age well too.
I dislike Sky Temple too but I looooooove the boss in that one. Kind of uninspired in terms of design (it's just a dragon) but it's very fun to fight. I also love the double hookshot
Majora's temples are all difficult and they have good bosses, which is the decision maker for me. I don't like the Jabu-Jabu dungeon in OOT and I'm not a fan of the forest/water temple either (looooove the music in forest temple though). Neither of those two are terrible, though
I don't really like Wind Waker's bosses, though. There are some very fun ones but there are also some disappointing ones. That's what you get from Zelda, I guess. I do agree on the combat in Wind Waker, though. It's very good, stylish, and flashy. The parry is awesome as well
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I managed to beat the main story and collected all Sunken Scrolls. Now, I'm just partaking in Turf Wars (aka Regular Battles).
I have to says that Splatoon is very addicting, if I say so.
On a side note, I really wants the Inkling Boy Amiibo, but I might considers ordering one online if I can't find it in stores that sells video games.
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Quote:
killing that room full of enemies in the sunken Hyrule
That was kinda cool. I hated that part when I was younger, but I do enjoy it.
Quote:
They really improved the Triforce thing in the HD version, but I had heard many times before that they included the padding because they were pressed for time with the original's release. I heard they were originally going to have 2 more dungeons, but they had to be cut for time.
They really wanted it to be released for the Christmas sales. And this just makes me wonder: Why the hell did they keep the Triforce Shard hunt in the HD version? Yeah, I don't care if they improved it by making you find shards and not maps. They had time to improve the game this time, why didn't they USE it and put in those dungeons that were cut?
Quote:
Looking at the Spinner and Dominion Rod.
*cough* Ball and Chain *cough*
Quote:
And you just named a lot of good dungeons to me regarding TP. The desert one might be my favorite in the series. Definitely up there
Oh definitely! The Arbiter's Grounds in Twilight Princess was awesome and I loved the boss. I could've done without the Poes, that just felt too much like a rehash of the Forest Temple instead of just a reference, but it was overall pretty cool. Somehow, the desert dungeons seem to be the best dungeons in the games lately.
Arbiter's Ground, then the Sandship in Skyward Sword - okay, the Mining Facility was terrible, but the Sandship was neat. Personal favorite is still the Ancient Cistern.
Quote:
The game with the best collection of temples is probably Majora's Mask actually
I dunno... I mean, the Wood Temple one felt a bit slow, probably because you had to float a lot. But it wasn't anything special for a Zelda dungeon. The goron rolling was a bit better, but the Stone Temple got really boring and annoying with its constant use of switching up and down AND using the Elegy of Emptiness. Over and over again. And the Bay Temple... Water Temple, but with pipes.
Quote:
I don't really like Wind Waker's bosses, though.
I think the only one I kinda like is the Earth Temple boss. And only if you have the improved spin, because it's fun to see Link spin around like that. Rest of the bosses felt pretty uninspired. I'm not saying the bosses in Skyward were better - in fact, I first liked the Sandship boss but after a while I just got so bored with it... but the Koloktos in the Ancient Cistern is cool and the fights against Ghirahim are always fun.
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whyyyy
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CatMuto wrote:
They really wanted it to be released for the Christmas sales. And this just makes me wonder: Why the hell did they keep the Triforce Shard hunt in the HD version? Yeah, I don't care if they improved it by making you find shards and not maps. They had time to improve the game this time, why didn't they USE it and put in those dungeons that were cut?
I think the only one I kinda like is the Earth Temple boss. And only if you have the improved spin, because it's fun to see Link spin around like that. Rest of the bosses felt pretty uninspired. I'm not saying the bosses in Skyward were better - in fact, I first liked the Sandship boss but after a while I just got so bored with it... but the Koloktos in the Ancient Cistern is cool and the fights against Ghirahim are always fun.
C-A
I think the only one I kinda like is the Earth Temple boss. And only if you have the improved spin, because it's fun to see Link spin around like that. Rest of the bosses felt pretty uninspired. I'm not saying the bosses in Skyward were better - in fact, I first liked the Sandship boss but after a while I just got so bored with it... but the Koloktos in the Ancient Cistern is cool and the fights against Ghirahim are always fun.
C-A
The dungeons that were cut were used in later Zelda games. They don't say which dungeons, though
I hated the Earth Temple boss, actually. It was different but...annoying. I love Koloktos in Skyward Sword, though. I also love that parasite on the whale's back and the final fight with Ghirahim, followed by Demise (Demise was a good fight, but a little underwhelming compared to the TP battle)
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Koloktos in Skyward Sword was a lot of fun. Him, Stallord in TP, and Goht from the original MM are my favorite bosses to fight. What they did to Goht in MM3D kinda ruined the pace for that boss that I liked.
Spoiler:
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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dullahan1 wrote:
Spoiler:
Much as I love Skyward, the fact that you have to fight the Imprisoned three times AND that Demise is such a let-down of a villain ESPECIALLY for a final boss is terrible. Maybe it's the fact that Demise doesn't appear until the very final tenth of the game OR the fact that Ghirahim was SUCH a memorable villain, but he just feels pointless. Ghirahim's battles were much more interesting, his last one really made you use several techniques again and he was entertaining, intimidating and funny. He was a great villain. (Then they tried to copy him with Yuga and spectacularly failed)
I don't like Ganondorf in TP, honestly. He feels tacked on, like he was only added because it's a Zelda game, ya gotta have Ganny! And his battles were nothing special, they were basically rehashed battles against him from other games. I agree, better than Demise but nothing good. I'm not even saying that he pales in comparison to Zant - I have my own huge issues with that guy - but Ganondorf was... not necessary for TP.
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I cheesed Ghirahim's fight with potions, but it was still fun. Tacking Demise at the end was bleh. Reminded me of Dark Cloud in FF3. Or Necron in FF9. Gameplay wise, TP Ganon stood above Demise because there was at least more to do, even after you beat Zant, which also had a variety to do.
If I were to go with my favorite Ganon fight though, yes, I'll say Wind Waker. Zelda I, it was just slash Ganon/Gannon. Link to the Past was just a glorified version of that. Ocarina of Time's while epic for it's time, feels underwhelming for me. TP's copies the epic feel from OoT, but all that's really at stake is to really beat the bad guy.
Why I like the Wind Waker one the best is for many reasons. I stand by that I think WW has the best combat system in the Zelda series with its parry system. It makes the fight with Ganondorf more fun. I know the graphics make it cartoony, but I really like the atmosphere of this one. There's been this build up to Ganon since the beginning of the game. Unlike Ocarina and TP, you've had encounters prior and it comes down to you building yourself up to end this one final time. I also like that it's more personal than in OoT. OoT, you're just saving the world from evil. Here, this is the guy who kidnapped your sister, cast you away to die when you try saving her, then kidnaps the pirate who has been helping you to save your sister on your journey while nearly killing you in the process. I then feel Link wants to save Zelda and beat Ganon more for a personal reason than a whole "save the world" motif the other games give. So to me, when you get to that final encounter with Ganondorf and put him down, it feels more rewarding. Besides, Ganon getting stabbed deep in his skull, to me, is still his most brutal death.
Now TP and SS go down this personal route too, but it's unsatisfying beating the final bosses of these games for one reason. It's their henchmen, Zant and Ghirahim that are making this personal for Link, so of course it's going to build up for these characters nicely. When you beat them and are left with Ganondorf or Demise, it's such an empty feeling because there's nothing personal against these two in these games.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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C-A
Re: Random conversations about Games
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CatMuto wrote:
Why does my Butterfree/Villion always faint?! Ugh, whatever. But that Machop that killed my Mienfoo, shortly after I got it, I will NOT count. Just like how I didn't count wiping out on the first trainer battles. (Yes, I... I lost on the first trainer battle...)
C-A
C-A
*gasp* you cheated! Obey the Nuzlocke rules!
But naw, I understand how difficult those can be. But losing on the first trainer battle? Eh... well it says quite a bit. Either you're extremely unlucky, or not doing something right.
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TheMoonlitAttorney wrote:
CatMuto wrote:
Why does my Butterfree/Villion always faint?! Ugh, whatever. But that Machop that killed my Mienfoo, shortly after I got it, I will NOT count. Just like how I didn't count wiping out on the first trainer battles. (Yes, I... I lost on the first trainer battle...)
C-A
C-A
*gasp* you cheated! Obey the Nuzlocke rules!
But naw, I understand how difficult those can be. But losing on the first trainer battle? Eh... well it says quite a bit. Either you're extremely unlucky, or not doing something right.
Out of the several times I've played Y, that's the first time I lost the first trainer battle.
I had Chespin and a Lvl 3 Pidgey. Also, I think I had no Potion after using one on Pidgey to heal it after catching it, cause I didn't want to go back. But by now I am in Coumarine City, I lost against Korrina in that battle where I fight her two Lucarios and I decided to just fuck it. I play however I want but remain with the 1 new pokémon in new area rule.Exception is, as always, EEVEE. BECAUSE EEVEE IS AWESOME!
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