Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Robin Goodfellow wrote:
Quote:
Phoenix Wright does not have to have a happy resolution after T&T with AJ. Losing his Attorney's badge, was another part of Phoenix's life, and things like that happen to people in reality.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
Have to agree with this.
The thing about stories and everything is, happy endings don't stay happy. That's why movies and stuff tend to cut to the credits and leave people with a happy picture because if life were to continue, bad things happen because that's the way things are. For example, since I've been on a nostalgia binge, let's take the Buffy series. If we were to isolate season 1 you could easily cry happy ending with the whole Buffy and Angel thing. But life moves on, a hell of a lot of nightmarish things happen, lots of heartbreak occurs, new "happy resolutions" occur (to be interupted by more bad things as life goes on), and the time with Angel becomes another point in her life but it isn't dependant on that.
I won't say that Phoenix doesn't miss being a lawyor or isn't bitter over what happened but he's had 7 years. For the time we DO see him on screen, considering he doesn't look suicidal, is pretty cheerful, and loves his daughter, I'd say he's moved on a little. 4-4 gives another key resolution to his life.
Also, to the point about 'why didn't anyone run to Phoenix's side once they found out?'. First off, we're only seeing a small sliver of time. Anything could have happened in the time off panel. Plus, you have to wonder how long it would take for them to find out depending on where they were at the time. For example, let's assume Edgeworth is abroad as usual, Maya/Pearl are at Kurain, Larry is chasing after a new girl (he chased a girl to Tibet, it's feasible), whatever. The thing is, the characters have lives that don't revolve around Phoenix so it's not likely they track every little thing that happens to him. I know that if I were Phoenix I wouldn't be calling up my old pals and telling them about what happened to me. It'd be hard, it'd be humiliating, and I wouldn't want to deal with the sting of it all with people close to me because it won't change what happened. I wouldn't be surprised if Phoenix's old friends had to contact him first before he would talk to them about it.
Furthermore, we don't know if Phoenix did get support from his friends up to some point. How the hell does an ex-attorney under suspicion of forging evidence change the whole legal system, alone?
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Platinum Skye wrote:
Phoenix Wright does not have to have a happy resolution after T&T with AJ. Losing his Attorney's badge, was another part of Phoenix's life, and things like that happen to people in reality.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
Look, yes, he does. Video games and media in general are escapism from reality- they're not supposed to be completely realistic. To HELL with reality, we were cheated out of GS3's happy ending, served the crap that was GS4, and we have EVERY right to be mad as hell about it.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOGANT
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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DramaticaXIV2 wrote:
Not everything has to have a happy ending. It's how life is. If every piece of media ended in everyone singing and dancing, where would be the fun with plot?
This
and this
Pickens wrote:
I Now shut the hell up about alternate timelines and canon and what not and go back to talking about how Edgeworth should be in GS5 so he can butt rape Phoenix.
Not trying to mini-mod,but gomake another topic or something to discuss this "Debate". The title of the thread isn't "lulzGS4ishtehAUluz !!11oneone!!" ,but "Designated Old Cast Topic." And how are you being "cheated?" It's a freaking fictional character crying out loud. If you don't like,then don't buy.
NOW TO THE ACTUAL TOPIC.
I think if we are going to see any of the old cast (Besides the usual,Phoenix,Ema,Payne,etc) in GS5, we'll be seeing Edgeworth and Maya defintely. Maybe Lana,Pearl and Gumshoe(Hey, he made a cameo in GS4.) Edgeworth will probably have something to do with the Mason System and trying to help Phoenix with it and explain it,so it makes sense. He could of been overseas seeing other countries' court systems all along.(Someone said something similar to this.) It would be amazing if we could face him in the last case,but that's never gonna happen.
We never got to face Lana in Court, maybe in GS5 we will for 1 case, since I don't think she'll be the main prosecutor and she could appear to help her sister Ema. Pearl could be the sidekick for one case, where Trucy is absent. *lame ideas*
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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DramaticaXIV2 wrote:
Not everything has to have a happy ending. It's how life is. If every piece of media ended in everyone singing and dancing, where would be the fun with plot?
The fun's in getting there, genius. I acknowledge the value of downer endings, but undoing a perfectly good one for crap like they did was unacceptable.
Colour wrote:
And how are you being "cheated?" It's a freaking fictional character crying out loud. If you don't like,then don't buy.
Oh, come on. Don't tell me you've never read/watched something and felt cheated by some element.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Colour wrote:
And how are you being "cheated?" It's a freaking fictional character crying out loud. If you don't like,then don't buy.
Oh, come on. Don't tell me you've never read/watched something and felt cheated by some element.[/quote]
That might of came out the wrong way,but you aren't being cheated. I'm been disappointed several times when watching a show/reading a book/etc,but I don't let it affect my whole life and get butthurt just because a fictional character's life sucks. >> You haven't even BOUGHT the game and you don't have too, since you have a choice. S'not like they're forcing you to buy it. Gee, they weren't even planning on putting him in the first place.
Great, we're off-topic again. C:
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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RobbieValiant wrote:
Platinum Skye wrote:
Phoenix Wright does not have to have a happy resolution after T&T with AJ. Losing his Attorney's badge, was another part of Phoenix's life, and things like that happen to people in reality.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
Look, yes, he does. Video games and media in general are escapism from reality- they're not supposed to be completely realistic. To HELL with reality, we were cheated out of GS3's happy ending, served the crap that was GS4, and we have EVERY right to be mad as hell about it.
You were not cheated at all. First off, you haven't played all of AJ. (I've read this whole thread). If you want to be a respectable debater in this topic, THEN RENT AJ AND PLAY THE WHOLE THING. How can you have an opinion that AJ was crap, if you haven't played the whole game.
Or are you just a PW fanboy who can't handle the PW cast not being the major characters in the game. Think about this for a second. The only way they could add to Phoenix Wright's story is to make him suffer in some way, that would completely change his life (Losing his Attorney's badge, by presenting forged evidence). If Wright had gone back to be a lawyer and AJ's events never happened, then there would be no way to continue Wright's storyline.
For the people who want the PW cast to come back and for AJ to have never happened then tell me the plotline for the next game. I'm serious, tell me what else they can do with Wright, Maya, and the rest of the cast without making the game stale. Tell me the plot for the game you want to happen.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Platinum Skye wrote:
RobbieValiant wrote:
Platinum Skye wrote:
Phoenix Wright does not have to have a happy resolution after T&T with AJ. Losing his Attorney's badge, was another part of Phoenix's life, and things like that happen to people in reality.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
Look, yes, he does. Video games and media in general are escapism from reality- they're not supposed to be completely realistic. To HELL with reality, we were cheated out of GS3's happy ending, served the crap that was GS4, and we have EVERY right to be mad as hell about it.
You were not cheated at all. First off, you haven't played all of AJ. (I've read this whole thread). If you want to be a respectable debater in this topic, THEN RENT AJ AND PLAY THE WHOLE THING. How can you have an opinion that AJ was crap, if you haven't played the whole game.
Or are you just a PW fanboy who can't handle the PW cast not being the major characters in the game. Think about this for a second. The only way they could add to Phoenix Wright's story is to make him suffer in some way, that would completely change his life (Losing his Attorney's badge, by presenting forged evidence). If Wright had gone back to be a lawyer and AJ's events never happened, then there would be no way to continue Wright's storyline.
For the people who want the PW cast to come back and for AJ to have never happened then tell me the plotline for the next game. I'm serious, tell me what else they can do with Wright, Maya, and the rest of the cast without making the game stale. Tell me the plot for the game you want to happen.
Okay, I'll tell you, though I've detailed it various times in other places. Note- This doesn't assume AJ never happened, it just makes it part of an alternate future.
7 years in the future, Phoenix is unsatisfied with his life. One morning, he notices a small story in the paper, about a local inventor dabbling with time travel. Of course, Phoenix is interested. He seeks out this inventor, and manages to convince him to let him borrow the time machine. He ends up 7 years in the past- just a few weeks before the case that changed his life! Phoenix Wright, Ace Attorney, and Phoenix Wright, Hobo Pianist work together, and end up uncovering that someone else has already altered the past, and it extends all the way back to the pivotal moment of his life- The murder of Mia Fey! Chaos ensues, and eventually we end up in a very different future, where Nick's still a lawyer, Maya's graduated from assistant to wife, and Apollo's a promising young intern as the Wright Law Offices.
(Not telling the big baddie- It's a secret, as this is also the plot of a fangame I'm developing. XD)
Now tell me- how "stale" is that?
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Quote:
Okay, I'll tell you, though I've detailed it various times in other places. Note- This doesn't assume AJ never happened, it just makes it part of an alternate future.
7 years in the future, Phoenix is unsatisfied with his life. One morning, he notices a small story in the paper, about a local inventor dabbling with time travel. Of course, Phoenix is interested. He seeks out this inventor, and manages to convince him to let him borrow the time machine. He ends up 7 years in the past- just a few weeks before the case that changed his life! Phoenix Wright, Ace Attorney, and Phoenix Wright, Hobo Pianist work together, and end up uncovering that someone else has already altered the past, and it extends all the way back to the pivotal moment of his life- The murder of Mia Fey! Chaos ensues, and eventually we end up in a very different future, where Nick's still a lawyer, Maya's graduated from assistant to wife, and Apollo's a promising young intern as the Wright Law Offices.
(Not telling the big baddie- It's a secret, as this is also the plot of a fangame I'm developing. XD)
Now tell me- how "stale" is that?
7 years in the future, Phoenix is unsatisfied with his life. One morning, he notices a small story in the paper, about a local inventor dabbling with time travel. Of course, Phoenix is interested. He seeks out this inventor, and manages to convince him to let him borrow the time machine. He ends up 7 years in the past- just a few weeks before the case that changed his life! Phoenix Wright, Ace Attorney, and Phoenix Wright, Hobo Pianist work together, and end up uncovering that someone else has already altered the past, and it extends all the way back to the pivotal moment of his life- The murder of Mia Fey! Chaos ensues, and eventually we end up in a very different future, where Nick's still a lawyer, Maya's graduated from assistant to wife, and Apollo's a promising young intern as the Wright Law Offices.
(Not telling the big baddie- It's a secret, as this is also the plot of a fangame I'm developing. XD)
Now tell me- how "stale" is that?
It's not stale, it's stupid. Let me explain why.
I thought the games each had different cases where you had to take a client and prove them innocent in a court of law right. Your idea sounds more like a RPG (Metroid, Mario, LOZ etc.) but wouldn't fit into the Ace Attorney formula.
Second, I doubt Capcom will introduce time travel into the games. Unless they come up with some sort of Kurain ability to time travel, that concept is stupid.
And
being wife. First off, that right there is going to piss off several people. Second, they wont play any future games, because the shipping they support has no basis anymore. So automatically you would have Capcom lose profit off this game and any future ones.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Platinum Skye wrote:
I thought the games each had different cases where you had to take a client and prove them innocent in a court of law right. Your idea sounds more like a RPG (Metroid, Mario, LOZ etc.) but wouldn't fit into the Ace Attorney formula.
Well, it does have more of the investigation style point and click, but there are the classical cases, the first couple being Past!Nick with Hobo!Nick's help, and the rest being in the (fluctuating) time stream- For example, as Nick shifts through time without any idea exactly how things are working, he finds himself in various alternate presents, with a case to solve. The last would be Hobo!Nick in a cosmic courtroom, against a temporal authority, self-defense.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Strange? Yes.
:/ Besides, he has spent more time as a pianist,pokerplayer, and father more than he has been a lawyer. I think he's used to it by now and I don't think he is unsatifisfed with his life seeing his attitude in AJ. The point and click style is for GK, not GS and they won't change the style since it's a VISUAL NOVEL. Takumi and co. most likely already planned out GS5 before GS4 was released. That's what fanfiction is for and we aren't even on the topic of the AU anymore,which isn't even the topic of the thread in the first place.
Anyways, I would love to see an Afro!Payne and Udgey or Apollo making some sort of comment on his hairstyles. Speaking of Udgey, we know he has two brothers according to T&T. xDD I wouldn't be suprised if the old brother appeared in GS5 saying he has MORE brothers that are judges. *will be ignored*
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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No.
For the same reason Phoenix couldn't be a lawyer for 7 years. She forged evidence and presented it at the SL-9 case.
She can still appear in some way, but I think it'll be more important to see Maya and get more character development for Apollo.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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RobbieValiant wrote:
Platinum Skye wrote:
Phoenix Wright does not have to have a happy resolution after T&T with AJ. Losing his Attorney's badge, was another part of Phoenix's life, and things like that happen to people in reality.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
It's like people expect Phoenix to be some sort of god and be invincible to reality. People, Phoenix Wright is a human being, nothing more, nothing less. He may have deserved a great life after all he did in GS 1-3, but bad things happen to good people. People need to except the fact that this is something Phoenix has dealt with, and now he can move on with his life however the game designers feel like.
Look, yes, he does. Video games and media in general are escapism from reality- they're not supposed to be completely realistic. To HELL with reality, we were cheated out of GS3's happy ending, served the crap that was GS4, and we have EVERY right to be mad as hell about it.
AHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA!
SURELY, you jest! He does NOT have to be a God! Ace Attorney is probably one of the most realistic game series' that I've read/played. Aside from spirit channeling (which some believe in) and the Mason system, it's been pretty true to life. The law system, while different from ours, could happen somewhere, and the characters act realisticly. It's a series that has deep roots in realism. I doubt they're going to change it, by making it seem like he can never have anything REALLY bad happen to him for an extended period of time. Apollo Justice did just that, and made me appreciate Phoenix as a genuine character, even better than in the original trilogy.
And while a lot of movies and other medias are supposed to be escapes from reality, not all are. I'm sure you've heard of realistic fiction? It's quite a big genre, I'm surprised you've never heard of it. It is mostly prevailent in books, but also can be done well in other mediums. Like visual novels, for example. It has been done quite well there, with Apollo Justice!
And now you really sound like a butthurt fanboy about the ending of GS3 and start of GS4. You sure have a right to be mad about it, but no. We weren't cheated out of anything. GS3 got it's happy ending. But then time moved on. Phoenix had a series of unfortunate events happen to him, and then AJ starts. He's different, but still Phoenix. He still got his happy ending after 3-5. He had his party at the resturant. After it, he had things happen to him. His good luck ran out. GS4 isn't crap. YOU can't even call it that. YOU haven't played it.
Now, if you want to be taken seriously, or more than some fanboy with a stick up their butt, I suggest you play ALL of it. Otherwise we'll continue to do what we'll be doing.
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Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Gozu wrote:
omg ur just lik 
did ur parents di or somefin
did ur parents di or somefin
icer wrote:
Trucy: [Daddy was fired from legal clerk for loitering] Daddy has a fun new job as a street sweeper!
Phoenix: Guess what Apollo, today I swept up some EVIDENCE! ....
Phoenix: Guess what Apollo, today I swept up some EVIDENCE! ....
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Emperor Ing wrote:
I say we all stop bitching about it, and hope that a character like Lana Skye returns.
I'd like it very much if Lana returned, but that all depends on what Capcom does with the plot.
Julia...<3Related to NaturallyLazy, fatalfeline, JadeRoach, and Game Over!
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Prosecutor Scorpion wrote:
How the hell does an ex-attorney under suspicion of forging evidence change the whole legal system, alone?
With a massive, massive plothole.
It would have been so, so easy to even indirectly allude to some kinds of 'friend/s' at this point. But they deliberately decide NOT to, creating a ridiculousity of implausibility. Thus, they could only have had an alternate scenario in mind, not meant to be a continuation of GS3.
This is a story. Phoenix is NOT human. He's a character. Unlike real humans, everything which happens is up to the whim of the writers. The types of indignities Phoenix was subjected to were not even exactly helpful in terms of the plot or development of a new series or Apollo's character. Even people who loved GS4 and Apollo complain about how Phoenix took over/hogged the spotlight et al. Most of what they did with Phoenix in returning him was actually detrimental to developing the new story and characters, so it was all in vain. And as for what it did to the old, completed story...
The point about GS4 re. Phoenix is that GS3 was very explicitly designed as a permanent ending for his character and cast. GS3 was never finished with the slightest bit of any intention that Phoenix's story would ever be continued. There was never meant to be another series with Phoenix.
Then, when they decide to make his "bad 'continuation'", it's executed in the most implausible and discontinuous fashion possible. Actually alluding that his friends abandoned him/couldn't help him, though sad, would have at least made the situation somehow, however negative, a slightly plausible follow-up to game 3. The fact that his friends and entire GS2 and 3 actual plot and character development may as well not exist (and they don't, in their GS3 forms) is what renders this nothing but a completely implausible injustice on his character. Phoenix was dragged back merely because somebody at marketing insisted it, and then it wasn't even executed in any useful fashion. Phoenix in the game merely took the spotlight off Apollo and it wasn't beneficial to either character.
And unlike a bad 2nd series which you can just ignore, the GS4 game virtually ret-cons the entirety of GS2 and 3. They were futile in terms of Phoenix, Maya, Edgeworth and who knows who else. And we can't un-see GS4. So, basically the 4th game ruins the story of the 1-3 games. The way it is written and the sheer extent they have gone to to maintain discontinuity suggests they were deliberately attempting to write an 'alternate scenario' to try to escape GS2/3 and make the new story they always wanted to. Pity they weren't allowed to specifically label it as such. It would have made the new series interesting. As it is, it's just depressing because of the bad taste it leaves on the actual quality product of the Gyakuten Saiban series, the original 3 games, with the connotation they were futile and largely 'didn't occur' as they have ceased to exert any kind of impact on the present and their character development and continuity has been completely ignored.
Making a more mediocre 2nd series = forgivable, don't like don't play etc.
Making a mediocre 2nd series labelled an alternate scenario = forgivable, even interesting
Making a mediocre 2nd series that renders the previous 2 games futile, obsolete, superseded by some strange unreality and ruins the original completed story so we can't enjoy it anymore = NOT something we as consumers should have to tolerate.
Platinum Skye wrote:
Second, I doubt Capcom will introduce time travel into the games. Unless they come up with some sort of Kurain ability to time travel, that concept is stupid.
MASON System.
Yes, I know he didn't' really time travel. But people tend to take it literally in all the wrong ways. I would dearly love to ask Takumi exactly his interpretation of it...
So, RobbieValiant can have a variation of his idea, except it's that Phoenix finds out the entire of GS4 he was stuck in the MASON System, a computer game, and he escapes! I don't care if it makes no sense. Most of GS4 made no sense.
... actually, instead GS4 should just be declared an alternate scenario so they can get on with developing Apollo and his story, without ruining the old one. They only ever wanted an alternate scenario not connected to GS2/3's story. It's what the writers wanted, and obviously attempted to execute to the maximum the marketing dept allowed.
LOL parody sig trend. Phoenix/Maya Day is Sept 5!
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Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Quote:
They only ever wanted an alternate scenario not connected to GS2/3's story. It's what the writers wanted, and obviously attempted to execute to the maximum the marketing dept allowed.
They weren't going to put Phoenix in it,so it wouldn't connect to GS1's story either. You're acting like it was only GS2 and GS3 they intended to ignore. And just because it has a different story and is from a different perspective IT MUST TOTALLY BE AN AU. Things don't have to revolve around the same thing EVERY SINGLE time in the world,do they? Jezze, why would it need to take place in a different continutiy anyway? They aren't going to deem it an AU just because a member on a fan-forum wants it to be.
Last edited by Auburnsun on Sun Feb 15, 2009 3:00 am, edited 2 times in total.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Gerkuman wrote:
As soon as they AU AJ, no-one will ever trust this series again. I can't let that happen. Just like I can't let the Capcom team listen to the fanbase incase it influences them like all the others, and turns the series crap.
Really? I'd regain trust if they did.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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RobbieValiant wrote:
Gerkuman wrote:
As soon as they AU AJ, no-one will ever trust this series again. I can't let that happen. Just like I can't let the Capcom team listen to the fanbase incase it influences them like all the others, and turns the series crap.
Really? I'd regain trust if they did.
And that's why Capcom doesn't listen to people like you.
You know who'd be cool to return? More of the 1-5 characters, specifically Jake.
Only in that they have a connection to the Skyes do I see them returning.
Gozu wrote:
omg ur just lik
did ur parents di or somefin
did ur parents di or somefin
icer wrote:
Trucy: [Daddy was fired from legal clerk for loitering] Daddy has a fun new job as a street sweeper!
Phoenix: Guess what Apollo, today I swept up some EVIDENCE! ....
Phoenix: Guess what Apollo, today I swept up some EVIDENCE! ....
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Emperor Ing wrote:
RobbieValiant wrote:
Gerkuman wrote:
As soon as they AU AJ, no-one will ever trust this series again. I can't let that happen. Just like I can't let the Capcom team listen to the fanbase incase it influences them like all the others, and turns the series crap.
Really? I'd regain trust if they did.
And that's why Capcom doesn't listen to people like you.
You mean people who want their characters *in*-character or people who like happy endings?
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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universe? It seems that everyone is willing to agree at least with that. Why does it matter whether or not 
fully acknowledges the existence of 
? What does that freaking change about anything? That's what I want to know, because as far as I can see, it's all the same series in reality. PERIOD. Speculation about what the writers intended is pointless because the FACT is that = 
, and that's the ONLY thing relevant to ANYTHING as far as I can see. It's made even MORE pointless by the fact that most characters in the games are case-specific and are never talked about at length again after their appearance.... So yeah. Go, Phoenix!
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Does anybody really maintain this is a continuation of the GS3 story and conceptual scenario? Really? Does anybody not admit this is a continuation of 1-5, storywise, not GS3?
LOL parody sig trend. Phoenix/Maya Day is Sept 5!
[ Read my fanfics! =) | Phoenix/Maya 'Evidence' List ]
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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icer wrote:
^But if they actually admit it's a scenario which is a continuation of 1-5, not GS3, which is what it is, conceptually, then most of the problems GS4 cast on the franchise disappear. It no longer ruins the old story, they don't have to try and restore any kind of continuity with GS3 and risk their entirely new story, they can develop Apollo without demands from marketing or whatever to have some kind of ties to the old arc, we don't have to keep wishing the old chars return, and it makes GS4 an interesting concept rather than some farce of abysmal discontinuity and implausibility.
Does anybody really maintain this is a continuation of the GS3 story and conceptual scenario? Really? Does anybody not admit this is a continuation of 1-5, storywise, not GS3?
Does anybody really maintain this is a continuation of the GS3 story and conceptual scenario? Really? Does anybody not admit this is a continuation of 1-5, storywise, not GS3?
Yes, a lot of people do. Specifically, people that are not you, Robbie, and one or two other people, AND the Capcom writers.
As for Robbie: Not those types of people, he means butthurt fanboys. The ones who don't follow the series no matter what.
Julia...<3Related to NaturallyLazy, fatalfeline, JadeRoach, and Game Over!
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
The Mouth of Sauron
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RobbieValiant wrote:
Emperor Ing wrote:
And that's why Capcom doesn't listen to people like you.
You mean people who want their characters *in*-character or people who like happy endings?
No, just stupid people.
Gozu wrote:
omg ur just lik
did ur parents di or somefin
did ur parents di or somefin
icer wrote:
Trucy: [Daddy was fired from legal clerk for loitering] Daddy has a fun new job as a street sweeper!
Phoenix: Guess what Apollo, today I swept up some EVIDENCE! ....
Phoenix: Guess what Apollo, today I swept up some EVIDENCE! ....
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Ing, you didn't even play the trilogy first, right? You have no qualification to judge on this issue.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
Otaku, #1 Machi fan, #2 Machi Fan
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RobbieValiant wrote:
Emperor Ing wrote:
RobbieValiant wrote:
Really? I'd regain trust if they did.
And that's why Capcom doesn't listen to people like you.
You mean people who want their characters *in*-character or people who like happy endings?
Again, plot. While you did say the fun is in getting there, I repeat, not everything has to have a happy ending. Even the best characters, favourites of Capcom, might not get them. One of the reasons I like my favourite character is because he doesn't have the best ending in GS4.
Sheez, this thread will have to be locked soon.
ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOGANT
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
I hate Klaviema >_>
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Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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RandomJibberish wrote:
I was skeptical about how Phoenix was in GS4, but when he appears in your co council and the blue flash appeared in his eyes, I knew he was still the same person underneath. He is still in contact with his friends, he just had no need to mention it to apollo...
I think that was the intention of that bit, with the Objection theme and all. I never thought about that...
ALL GLORY TO THE HYPNOGANT
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
What is my liiiife?!?
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Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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icer wrote:
^^This is a continuation of the GS3 STORY when Takumi specifically said it wasn't?
Ing, you didn't even play the trilogy first, right? You have no qualification to judge on this issue.
Ing, you didn't even play the trilogy first, right? You have no qualification to judge on this issue.
When did Takumi say that "GS4 isn't a continuation of GS3?"
He only ever said that he doesn't want to continue GS3, and that was before they made GS4. He simply changed his mind, or he had no choice because Capcom wanted a GS4 that's a continuation of the original trilogy.
And what makes you think that "GS4 is a continuation of 1-5"?
Just because Ema is in there?
GS4's story has nothing to do with 1-5's story anyway.
The references to 1-5 are also just simple Easter eggs. You can just say that "oh, Phoenix could have taken any case where there was a scarf in the exhaust pipe". They never said that this case was the one with Gant, Lana and Marshall.
Even with Ema and Meekins it was only that "we met during a case".
GS4 is a continuation of the trilogy, with very few connections to anything that happened in GS1-GS3. A departure in concept, but still a continuation, like the second American Pie trilogy, or Aladdin 3.
And I think it's okay to reference 1-5 more than the other cases, to make up for the obvious lack of 1-5 references in GS2-3.
They didn't mention ANYTHING from GS1 other than 1-5, other than the existence of Steel Samurai and Larry's first costume. Not more than GS3, and less than GS2.
I bet they want to make Maya return in GS5, as a complete stranger to Apollo (and mentioning Maya by name to Apollo would kind of ruin it). They probably have something planned and they didn't want to reveal anything about her until necessary.
If only GS5 came...
It sucks that it takes more and more to make a new episode.
GS2 came 1 year after GS1.
GS3 came 2 years after GS2.
GS4 came 3 years after GS3.
And when will GS5 come? Not before the end of 2010 (unless they keep it as a secret, which I doubt). I'm afraid they won't even be able to finish the second trilogy on the DS.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
I'd say
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He was an interesting character, I'd like to see him return someday.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Ceres wrote:
I wonder what happened to Grossberg, It's not like he dissipated into thin air.
He was an interesting character, I'd like to see him return someday.
He was an interesting character, I'd like to see him return someday.
I hope he died somehow :P
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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icer wrote:
^^This is a continuation of the GS3 STORY when Takumi specifically said it wasn't?
Ing, you didn't even play the trilogy first, right? You have no qualification to judge on this issue.
Ing, you didn't even play the trilogy first, right? You have no qualification to judge on this issue.
When did he ever say it was just GS3's story? Didn't he meant the trilogy story's as a whole? The main storyline in GS4 doesn't relate to ANY of the GS1 cases. The only storyline connection it has it the forgery thing,really. Sure,it has more easter eggs,cameos, and references than GS2 and even a returning main character,but it's not a continuation or anything to the actual story. If it was,then we would at least hear about the events DL-6 and SL-9,or SOMETHING that relates to it. The thing that relates to 1-5 the most is when Ema says that she owes Wright alot since he helped her a lot in the past and Apollo saying to look in the car pipe because Mr.Wright did in his previous cases,which are just as or little less vague than the reference Phoenix gave us about 2-4 in 4-4 "to never to take a nap on the sofa again because a terrible event happened.",or something like that. GS4 has a storyline of its own. So,according to your logic,it must take place in a different world(or continuity) of 1-5 because of this? Different Story=/=Different Continuity.
GS4 was made for a new audience, where it didn't require players playing the past games,making sense on its own. On the other hand, I played two cases of T&T before I played AA and I was confused as hell,it made zero sense to me,so I dropped and decided to get AA instead. My sister played GS4 first(and hasn't picked up on the previous ones),she didn't even know a single thing about GS1 or 1-5,but it still made sense to her. If it was a continuation of the storyline of 1-5, then it wouldn't make sense as an independent story. 1-5 would have more references than GS2 because it was the most recent case that was released and I would find it pretty cheap if they completed didn't even bother refering it since it was a pretty good case as well. Why would the new story need to revolve around the Feys anyway? All of their issues were solved in the trilogy. GS4 is more of a sequel than to anything to the previous games,not a continuation since it doesn't even bother touching the storylines of the games. I'll add more to this once I get a response.
About Ing not playing the previous games(which I think he/she has),shouldn't Robbie not have a say in this either since he hasn't even played GS4.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Applying Icer's viewpoint on references, the connections to 1-5 are mute. Ema doesn't specifiy how she was helped by Phoenix in the past, for all we know he might have given her a lift to the supermarket one time. Phoenix has had a case with a muffler at one point, Apollo doesn't specify what case it was so it could have been any case.
Given Icer's viewpoint the only acceptable references would have to be something like this..."Oh, this sofa is bad luck, as back in my career a man called Wellington hit me with a fire extinguisher leaving me with memory loss for the trial of state vs. Byrde" which would not only be confusing for new players, but would be rather stupid for those who are in the know already.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Colour wrote:
About Ing not playing the previous games(which I think he/she has),shouldn't Robbie not have a say in this either since he hasn't even played GS4.
I have played it. I've played it enough to know I hate it and it's a steaming pile of crap with an OOC Nick that would've been unrecognizable had he not been named "Phoenix", that cheats us out of GS3's ending.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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@Nose-Yeah,most of the 1-5 references are pretty much on par with the GS2 ones. It seems all of our "arguements" are in the same vein.
@Robbie-You said you didn't even finish the first case and dropped it. :/ And during the second halve of the first case,Phoenix takes the co-council stand and does pretty much all the work. It's been seven years. Not one,two,but SEVEN. Why would he be the same? 2 or 3 years before he was a lawyer as Fennie,he was completely different and OOC from Lawyer!Nick. It's okay for him to different in only in amount time of 2 years,but he can't be more laid-back in 7 years seeing how much has happened to him during that period? To be honest, I like his personality more now than he was a lawyer.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Colour wrote:
Don't make Grossberg die. D: He's probably is in his early 70s by now, if he got fatter, I hope he doesn't get a heart attack.
@Nose-Yeah,most of the 1-5 references are pretty much on par with the GS2 ones. It seems all of our "arguements" are in the same vein.
@Robbie-You said you didn't even finish the first case and dropped it. :/ And during the second halve of the first case,Phoenix takes the co-council stand and does pretty much all the work. It's been seven years. Not one,two,but SEVEN. Why would he be the same? 2 or 3 years before he was a lawyer as Fennie,he was completely different and OOC from Lawyer!Nick. It's okay for him to different in only in amount time of 2 years,but he can't be more laid-back in 7 years seeing how much has happened to him during that period? To be honest, I like his personality more now than he was a lawyer.
@Nose-Yeah,most of the 1-5 references are pretty much on par with the GS2 ones. It seems all of our "arguements" are in the same vein.
@Robbie-You said you didn't even finish the first case and dropped it. :/ And during the second halve of the first case,Phoenix takes the co-council stand and does pretty much all the work. It's been seven years. Not one,two,but SEVEN. Why would he be the same? 2 or 3 years before he was a lawyer as Fennie,he was completely different and OOC from Lawyer!Nick. It's okay for him to different in only in amount time of 2 years,but he can't be more laid-back in 7 years seeing how much has happened to him during that period? To be honest, I like his personality more now than he was a lawyer.
I finished the first case from morbid curiosity- it's like Twilight, I struggled through the first from morbid curiosity, but I didn't have the stomach to go through the other 3.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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And really what was his character before Apollo Justice? he was a generic avatar with no real personality other than sacrasm and caring for others. Apollo Justice made him a more realistic character, with more of a backbone and more of an actual personality.
His early character in the game 4-1 in particular is a plot device, it's to make the returning gamer angry with him, much like Apollo was, and to try and work out what caused this change in him.
Icer, seemingly your main ally in this pointless debate, seems to like the new Phoenix enough to have him in her sig, and she is one of the main Phoenix fans and Apollo Justice haters on the board.
Re: Designated Old Cast Topic
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Nose wrote:
His early character in the game 4-1 in particular is a plot device, it's to make the returning gamer angry with him, much like Apollo was, and to try and work out what caused this change in him.
IF what you say is true, then it obviously worked way too well... <<
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