Alright. Takumi's games have gotten a very sudden, and thus far successful HD jump to the iOS platform. It seems Capcom is taking Apple's platform rather seriously. So seriously that a two year old DS game got ported there. It seems that age of the game isn't a deciding factor in Capcom's porting decisions.

Then I started to think, AAI2 was released not very far from Ghost Trick. The DS is dead as far as new titles go unless high profile. They could reformat it for the 3DS, but I doubt Japanese gamers would be too interested, even ignoring the need to rework the interface and add 3D perspective. We did previously theorize that Capcom could release it on the eShop, but if that were the case, then the eShop likely would've been flooded by now with DS ports.

So why not iOS? GS1-GS3 could be considered testing the waters. And it "may" be one of the options Sven was negotiating with the higher ups.

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Yeah, it's certainly possible that it'll be getting an iOS release. ...It'd be nice if it stayed on the nintendo handhelds, though >_> But I guess it's better for it to be released at all.


Ghost Trick lends itself well to touch-screen controls (and I think there are certain games that don't), and I can't really think of any parts of GK2 that would be difficult to do with touch controls.

If they do plan on releasing GK2 on iOS, I wonder if they'll release AAI there first...

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Yeah....I'm not a fan of apple or the big 'iphone' revolution that's happening.

I'd much rather see it on DS or simply as a download.
Really I don't like how so many games are going to iOS....to me it seems very much like it's just going to usher in casual games and drain from the proper console market.

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Yeah, I agree.
I think/hope that eventually the iPhone market will simmer down, similar to the way zynga's casual market has been waning recently.

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I was actually thinking of this a couple of days ago. I'd say it's looking very likely with the way things are going, anyway. If they do get around to this, though, I'll either have to buy myself an iTouch or constantly steal my sister's. *herp derp, Android user* But yeah, better this than nothing at all, and at this stage, a DS release doesn't seem like a smart move from Capcom's POV.

Yeah, I see what you mean. However, I'd take AAI2 on a Commodore 64 if that's what it meant for me to play it in English.

The theory makes sense in one way: All of the other AA games have been translated and sold overseas, with reasonably well reception and earnings. Having said that, does it really make sense for a sequel to a really niche game to be released on a new, unrelated system? It's not really the same than if it was released on 3DS, because that's a sort of upgrade. I'm not sure if this game would generate much revenue at all if it was only released on iPhone.

D:

Whatever the case, I hope to see it someday!

Edit:
Ohh, I think that answers my post a bit XD

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I would love this. I always have my iPhone on me, and the game probably wouldn't be expensive.

I have a friend who bought the first AA when it was released for iphone a while back. She wouldn't have got it otherwise, as she's not a big DS user. By releasing it on iOS, they can probably attract a larger audience, expecially if they release, say, the first case for free like they have with Ghost Trick.

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I had the first ace attorney game on my ipod touch and I don't think it's has the magic of a DS.

The first was a quick and dirty port for iOS. The HD was a quick and uh not-dirty port. They're slowly getting it...

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As a gamer, I have mixed feelings about focus being shifted to mobiles rather than consoles. On one hand, it's cool that some old games are released on my iPhone so I can play them whenever because I always have my phone with me. Then again, I always carry my 3DS as well. I don't know I guess I just prefer the feel of a console control in my hand.

Speaking as a game developer, right now the money is in the mobile phone market. Serious gaming on handhelds seems to be waning because of mobile phones. After all, it's easier to get a game in the iPhone App or Google Play Stores than it would on the eShop. And with more and more people owning smartphones, it reaches a much larger audience. That's not to say that handheld consoles will die (and I hope they don't), but they do seem to be another victim of the "all-in-one" device.

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I absolutely disagree with this.
As a user stated here in this thread before, games like Ghost Trick/Phoenix Wright would reach a larger audience and generate an extended fanbase for the longterm of these franchises.

As a matter of fact, I myself would not have gotten into the AA series were it not for the fact Phoenix Wright didn't appear on the App Store 2-3 years ago, and I wouldn't have been able to know about its sequels and such, nor would I know about Court-Records at all were it not for that port.

When it comes to gaming on a mobile device (such as ipod touch/ipad), I consider myself a casual gamer. Due to the nature of how the game plays, I consider Ace Attorney series to be a "casual" game. The proper console market isn't going to be really affected, but the portable console market's face is going on a rapid change of pace for sure.

Consider the fact that millions upon millions (we're talking over 30 here) of users own an iOS device.
Consider the fact that gaming on a mobile device has exploded in the past couple of years and has produced a large audience (in the millions) of gamers (casual or not) for playing exclusively on a mobile device.

Knowing these two things, we can therefore assume that the market for portable gaming has shifted from a dedicated, portable console (such as the DS), to a multi-purpose device that happens to be powerful enough to run some sweet games well.

Knowing that one fact, we can therefore make an assumption that big game companies (from Capcom, Epic[of all companies] to Square Enix, to EA), will be able to develop mobile game apps that can be reached upon the millions of millions of users of an iOS device (we're talking over 30 million), a large part of that audience that would most likely never own a portable console like a DS, or games that would be considered not appealing to get on a device like a DS.

Ghost Trick, in just a few days that was released on the Apple Store, became a sleeper hit on the iOS, so successful that it became the Game of the Week/Month, and is now considered one of the best puzzle-games on the iOS store. And it was just a port.
There had barely been any marketing or information that it was even coming to the Appstore at all.
And the best thing about it? This port was accessible to a larger audience that wouldn't have been found for that on the DS.
Capcom themselves stated that the Ghost Trick title sold well to their expectations on the mobile platform. Its Smurf Village game had *exceeded* expectations for them.

As a matter of fact, Capcom reported that its mobile unit, Beeline Interactive, acquired over 40 million unique downloads [I'm not sure about the *unique* part] for all of its games apps in February of this year. Considering that there was about over 30 million people that bought an iOS device, that's pretty impressive.

Check this out: In the last fiscal year (March being the end of a fiscal year), Capcom reported that its mobile revenue increased to 68% in the first nine months of last fiscal year (52.6 million bucks) with a net income of around 18 million dollars.
This is impressive considering the pricing scheme found at the App Store and considering the fact that the mobile sector for Capcom is considered a little bit of low priority.

Everything else for Capcom went into decline.
For example, the arcade/video game sales not related to mobile went down 30% (660 million dollars), with a net income declining to 50% (42 million dollars).
That's a pretty big decline considering the fiscal year of 2010 (ending in March 2011) was a pretty damned good one for the company in terms of the bottom line being increased greatly for that year (somewhere in the 200%).

Here's the fiscal sheet so you can read it yourself: https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://www.capcom.co.jp/ir/english/data/pdf/explanation/2011/3rd/explanation_2011_3rd_01.pdf&embedded=true

Yet, ever since Capcom started seriously releasing apps on the iOS device, their revenue on the mobile platform has only been *increasing* every year in that regard.


Source of quote and other facts presented here in this post.
This is just Capcom. They themselves admitted that a portable handheld that *only* does gaming is not the big trend anymore in the long-term. This is exactly one of the reasons why big-game companies are shifting to this mobile market. I'm not saying dedicated handhelds are being completely abandoned, but like a user here said, the mobile market is something that has *exploded*.

Epic Games reported to alot of gamings news outlets that the Infinity Blade series (a graphically-impressive action-game that became a hit in the first month of its release) was its most profitable game ever in terms of man years invested vs. profit revenue, being more profitable than Gears of War, a console game.
http://www.theverge.com/2012/6/27/3120308/infinity-blade-epic-games-most-profitable-game
The Infinity Blade series has made over 30 million dollars in profits. Very impressive, considering the pricing scheme found at the App Store and the amount of content universally accessible to all sorts of iOS devices (from the iphone, to an iPad).

And let's not get started on Square Enix...They've been seeing a large profit of their games (ports/original titles) on the mobile platform too, and their pricing is ridiculous considering the pricing scheme found at the App Store normally.

With open-world games like The Dark Knight Rises, we've actually been seeing more hardcore titles that push the boundary of the iOS device.

And the only real competitor would be a Playstation Vita in terms of what can be pushed to the limit (I am not emphasizing on "WOW graphics!" here).
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Ever since the App Store hit, there has been a large amount of casual/clone/ripoff games hitting the market there. Thanks to Apple's efforts, in the past two years, they've made finding quality titles easier with their organizations of certain lists/categories that an interested mobile gamer would look into (such as "Best turn-based games" or "Best hardcore games" or "Best platformers", "Best Games you've never Played/Heard of", etc. etc.)

You might say that it sucks there's an iphone revolution or such...But it's not. It's a complete growth/revolution of the entire mobile market *in general*. The massive audience that exists in the mobile audience gives gaming companies like Capcom a chance to release their titles found previously on dedicated handhelds, and give them a new life into a market that will see its title have greater *EXPOSURE*.

This will allow us to see more great titles being developed/sequels to games that deserve to be made.

If developers/companies would take a chance to just port all of its DS titles to an iOS device, there would also be a reason to have a greater influx of competition to have quality games that people may buy there.

Since the first establishment of the App Store, user's expectations for great content have been raised higher higher (from Doodle Jump, to N.O.V.A 3), and as the devices get more powerful, and as powerful as a dedicated console device, more quality games are going to potentially occur here.

The fact that the GS HD remakes have been doing successful in the Japanese mobile market alone shows that mobile is here to stay, whether or not you like it.

People are going to want a portable device that can do *anything*, and not just simply one thing. The fact that over 300 million iphones+25 million ipads have been sold is a testament to this. That's big compared to 152 million units on the DS/20+ million units on the 3DS, or the 1.9+million Vitas sold.

Look at that, not even the 3 dedicated portable handhelds units sold combined even equals the iOS devices. :P


I for one, am glad that the iOS especially is getting all these awesome ports/titles. It gives me opportunity to quickly try out any game that I wouldn't have otherwise played if it were on a device like the DS, and I have become more susceptible to trying out brand new IP like Chaos Rings. This is only a good thing for everyone that can benefit.

I really don't like AAI at all, but if AAI/AAI2 were to come out for iOS right now I'd give it a chance again considering the touch controls could play real well on my ipad.

Aww man you had to come back here and drop your big sheet of facts and statistical reasons why it should when I'm living in hope.

Allow me to counter this.
Ace Attorney is far from a casual game, it's a very very niche game, while Ghost Trick can get off on being a puzzle genre, Ace Attorney doesn't have such gameplay being an adventure/visual novel game which is a far less common market. In addition, it would alienate a series of fans who have followed the series on Nintendo consoles and thus have no reason to expect it on some tablet device and get it there.

Though you make an excellent pitch and paint a great picture for the future of 'iOS' gaming, if aspects of console gaming were to abandon it for an arguably more expensive device I think it would be massively detrimental for the Gaming industry and companies if their consoles were to be invalidated.

As someone who doesn't own one of these crappy iPads with their arsenal of casual games I'd be mortified to be left in the dust, to me your sales pitch sounds like a cruel uncaring march of industry however tablets can't properly emulate the console experience, maybe for something like Ace Attorney sure but a purely touch-screen and *swivel* control scheme can't give the same degree of control as buttons on a controller.

Then again with the rise of casual gaming in the form of Kinect and Move and iGaming maybe I should just find a new hobby.

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I'm going to have fun with your post :D

It's ok, I was a high-school debater, it's just a natural habit that I must back up some of my claims in some form or way xP

-The gameplay of Ace Attorney/Ghost Trick is considered as a "casual" type of game on the App Store. It's grouped along crappy physics games such as Angry Birds/Doodle Jump in terms of "casual" gaming. It is not considered a hardcore title like Infinity Blade/TKDR/N.O.V.A/Shadowgun/Chaos Rings, etc.
All visual novels that exist on the App Store/DS are also considered casual. It's a quick "pick-up and play where you left off reading", and while not necessarily a time-killer, it is essentially something *anyone* can get into without any real difficulty. You're literally reading text upon text in a visual novel game (such as Phoenix Wright) that happens to force some gameplay mechanics into it. It's still casual.

You're right in the fact that Ace Attorney *was* a niche series, maybe for the GBA for sure, and maybe for the DS, but Capcom has already stated with the first Phoenix Wright port 3 years ago that it was a success on the iOS. Thanks to that+the success of Ghost Trick, Capcom had more than enough reason to allow for all 3 GS HD remakes to be released on the ios (and considering it's still a success even though it's only still at the Japanese region so far) We would NOT have gotten these remakes otherwise if those ports weren't successful at all.

Really, the only "niche" titles in the AA franchise are the AAI spin-offs, as those games sold considerably poorer compared to AJ/AA (correct me if I'm wrong on this).

Now I'm going to have to lol at your "it would alienate Nintendo fans", you seem to be forgetting that the AA series was never exclusively on Nintendo devices, or even on a handheld device for that matter.
After the GBA releases, they were *ported* to the Nintendo DS and enhanced to take small advantages of the DS hardware. But they never planned it to just keep it on the DS...Have you forgotten that Capcom ported the series to the Windows PC/Wii?
You may argue that "But they were released on the PC in Japan only!" but that's irrelevant-the point is Capcom didn't force exclusivity on this visual-novel game because it's apparently *that easy* to port a game that does not demand heavy resources regarding its engine/assets.

...But I digress, no one really in the AA community seems to remember that fact and just generally praised it as that "exclusive" game that should give reason for people to buy a Nintendo handheld. If porting it to the iOS device (which has pure touch screen controls that the game has always taken advantage to be used like DS hardware) would alienate Nintendo fans, then why the hell did no one complain when it was ported to a platform that relies on a mouse+keyboard many many years ago???

There is one thing that I think you're misunderstanding about the iOS device: It's not just something that *has* to be ported to a tablet. The iPad didn't exist (or was just recently released) when PW first came out in 2010. The best thing about all of the iOS device ecosystem is if you don't want to take advantage of the screen, that's ok, because a tablet can run an iphone-only resolution as though you have an iphone/ipod touch on you without a developer having to do any optimization for the tablet. Just dl the app and play, just like how you would pick up your GBA game and play it on a DS.

Remember that I mentioned last in my post about there being 300+million iphone+25 million ipad users out there? It's not about you or the rest of the small/already loyal fanbase that's only been flocking to the Nintendo handhelds expecting/not expecting Capcom to make/port titles to the mobile market. Capcom first and foremost is a company that focuses on the bottom line (money), so why not take advantage of a new exploding market and expose your game that did reasonably well on the DS to a similar hardware that clearly has the biggest audience in mobile history?
It's smart, it's about reaching to and establishing a broader, newer audience of "gamers" that have probably never owned a DS before, from all sorts of ages. Does this sound familiar? It should, as the same thing was said about the DS many many years ago.
If it does well (and it has already), this will give Capcom *more* reason to do *more* with the AA franchise/brand/series, even if the next Ace Attorney title is only for the iOS. By saying that you're not glad that it's being on a platform other then a DS/Nintendo device, you're merely echoing this old-generational mindset that Reggie of Nintendo had by downplaying the importance of what the mobile market is doing for the gaming world (such as Apple's popular iOS devices), that the pricing of the content you pay for on an iOS device will lead to less quality games, and that's what the established audience (who aren't just kids/teens using a portable handheld for one thing, but a multitasked bunch) supposedly is expecting to pay which will somehow damage the games industry in the long-term.
But Reggie has been proven completely wrong in the past 4 years so far. The 300+ million owners of iOS devices have shown that they're willing to pay a "normal" price of a good game, as long as the content/quality of said game is *worth* paying for, no matter if it's a port or original title (Chaos Rings, Final Fantasy, Ghost Trick, Phoenix Wright, Street Fighter, TKDR, N.O.V.A, Fifa, Superbrothers Sword and Sorcery, Sonic the Hedgehog, SOUL CALIBUR, Metal Slug, etc. These are just the top of my head). 3 of those games I've listed are considered casual, while the rest are considered hardcore, with Chaos Rings/Final Fantasy ports having the most "ridiculous" prices (above the 10 dollar range).
What really helps on the iOS store is the ease of integrating shareware/demo-like properties for potential customers to check out. Something you couldn't do with a DS.


It seems you didn't read my post in full detail, as I am talking about the success of the mobile market in general. I'm just using the iOS as my examples as it is the only tight ecosystem that is really defining the direction of the mobile market clearly alongside Android and is easy to illustrate my points.

If you read my last post all the way, I have already shown you that the mobile market for games is here to stay, not just iOS gaming. Whether or not there is a future or not for IOS specifically is irrelevant, as Reggie said the same thing years ago and got proven wrong anyway by that. Like Capcom said, the shift/trend in the tech/game world regarding mobility is all about multi-purpose devices that happens to do gaming as good or better than a DS/3DS/Or even a Vita [though tech wise iOS devices don't compare to Vita haha]. Everybody in the world is buying into that, and so the Games industry is going to shift and adapt to that too if they want to make the most money. It just so happens iOS/Android are the first "pioneers" of that shift.
I'm not trying to make a sales pitch here/painting a great picture, the picture was already painted, I am simply telling you the significance of the picture/painting as it is right now :P

You stated that the mobile market would take away from "aspects" of console gaming in general. Care to elaborate?
Because last time I checked, the only thing the mobile market is taking away is the "aspects" of *portable* console gaming, and making games more accessible that way. Why the hell should I buy a DS to do one thing when my iPad/iPhone can do the same thing a DS/3DS can do [Just look at Ghost Trick, a perfect port of the DS with no difference than it using your fingers instead of a stylus to play] easily *and* more?

This is why I'm having serious issues with your last part of your post...the mobile market will never replace main console gaming. Maybe in the future when we can play a ps3-graphic quality game with large content on our wrists you can make an argument like that, but right now? Nope. It's senseless to argue with my post on portable consoles and then jump to main consoles. That's irrelevant, and completely dodges my post considering I've only been talking about *portable* gaming this entire time.
You can't blame anyone for expecting to play a good-looking game on their phone/tablet. We have the technology/means to do so at an affordable price-point, so the standards have been raised for how games should be on a *mobile* device. People will still want their triple-AAA Call of Duty game on a console on a big TV, and there's no way you can do that solely with a touchscreen :P
Now if Apple released an official controller for the iOS device though....Things could start changing in this regard as well :P


See I used to be like you, I used to look down upon the iPad too, just calling it a big iPod Touch.
Then I demo'd it at my brothers house and saw the potential for how much it could replace a computer.
But it just so happened that there was a huge potential for gaming too. The iOS is not meant to emulate a console experience...It is meant to play a good-looking easy to control, tightly polished game, *casual* or not, *simply* because it has the hardware to do so.

That's why it's easy for even a cat to play on it.
You're generalizing/associating the iOS specifically as something filled with casual crap. I could make the same argument for the DS, but it just so happens to have more unique gems than iOS does at this point in time.
About your industry marching cruelly to the next big thing...You act like this is a shocker. If they don't adapt to the times companies die out. That's why everyone shifted to consoles since gamers didn't go to the arcades anymore.
It'sok that you don't want/don't own a "crappy" tablet/mobile device. The world doesn't revolve around you, and neither does it revolve around the industries.


No comment on Move/Kinect...You cannot seriously game on those as those *accesories* should be supplementing console experiences, not replacing them.

I know it's just an emotional topic for me.

In the end it boils down to selfish thinking.

I dislike (and always have) the "i" range outside of macs. I don't think it's fair that the word MP3 is more or less replaced with 'ipod' in regular conversation. I don't like exclusively touchscreen devices that don't provide a stylus (fingerprints and unlocking in your pocket). They are hugely expensive devices. My mother owns one and my little brother plays on it a lot however I don't really see why it's so special or interesting to me. Mostly I dislike casual gaming because of the reduction of quality titles on other platforms in an attempt to appeal to a mass market.

I do not own a tablet and as such I do not want a series I love to go exclusively to that format. You make a very good sound financial argument for why they should and that's why I don't like it, because I could likely not afford to play the latest game (that was unexpected but hoped and prayed for) in a series that I had loved a long time.



Well yeah...you said it's taking away aspects of portable gaming....that's what I do most. Possibly taking AA away would leave me very sad. Worse if more games go or other 'niche' series I enjoyed reappear there too like an Advance Wars or a Golden Sun game were to be given new sequels there and I'd not be able to play them.

I realise this is hardly an argument however I'm sure I'm not the only fan who'd be hurt to see it leave the handheld console platform.



You can totally do this with a 3DS though as the most modern property.

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Not really a big fan of it, tbh. :/
I am not the guy for smartphones and all this stuff.
However, if it gets a translation, someone somewhere maybe might be doing a translation for the DS-Games.

If someone out there, would be eager enough, to maybe even get the "Objection"-Sounds, but that´s just me dreaming...

AA belongs on the Handhelds. That´s my opinion and I am gonna stick with it.

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If it's emotional for you, I haven't seen it because so far it's been a pretty mature discussion ;)

Yet again, you seem to not be fully reading all my posts: The direction of the mobile market has *nothing* to do with the iOS device specifically, but I'm merely using the iOS as examples to illustrate my points since it and Android-based hardware are the first pioneer smartphones *clearly* showing the change of the market regarding games.
If I had been only talking about the Xperia Play to illustrate my points, you and the rest of the gaming community in the world would probably not be using the "it's a touchscreen-only device!" argument ;P
Forget about it being a touchscreen for one second and think of the hardware specs of an average mobile device itself today. Now think about 300 million people having access to a device that's more powerful than a DS/3DS, and a device that plays like a DS, but without a need for a stylus (everyone hated using stylus's for their PDA's and smartphones).
It just so happens to be the iOS right now. Which happens to be touch-screen only (which btw, your stylus argument makes no sense because you're basically admitting right now that you're not willing to accept change with the times. But that's okay because you *can* still use a stylus for the iOS, but you'd have to buy it separately since no one really has a need for it unless they're an artist/writer of notes.)

You're right that the devices are expensive though...The new ones that is, because of Apple's tight ecosystem, anytime a new iphone comes out, the value of an older iphone significantly drops (same thing with the iPad).
You don't have to buy the latest and greatest iOS device. Android's got you covered (because Capcom plans to release some of its titles there to ;))

Again with the casual gaming taking away from quality console titles, I dislike this argument because people would've been able to say the same thing about the DS many many years ago, especially the "whole crapload of casual games that don't stick out".
The DS tends to have more unique titles that can be found that stands out from the iOS, and it's been only 2 years since iOS gaming has really picked up, including the 4 years that Apple first opened up the App-Store as well. It's not fair to be bashing the iOS only regarding the large releasable quantity of crapware, since iOS gaming *specifically* has just picked up only recently (we're again talking 2 years).
The DS had 7-8 years of a library of games since it was released in 2004, the iOS has has only 3-4 years (considering the App-store was released in 2008 and not 2007 when the first iphone was sold) so far.
And look how easy it's been for a developer to port/make a title for the iOS compared to the DS. Capcom spent really no time porting Phoenix Wright to the App-Store 2 years ago. Became a hit. You can say the same thing about Ghost Trick, as nothing had really been changed except fitting to the iPad, and optimizing full use of the touchscreen with your fingers (which had already been done for the DS).

Your argument about the "it'll take quality console titles from other platforms to appeal to mass market"...Wtf? This has always been a fact of life in the gaming industry. When the SNES came out, everyone dropped the 3DO/NES. When the Genesis came out, it provided *more* competition against the SNES and brought along *more* great games that came out to the Genesis first, making a dent so companies could appeal to the mass market still. When the PS2 came out, everyone jumped ship to that from the PS1/Dreamcast/N64 in an attempt to appeal to the mass market (because the mass market exploded on the PS2). The same thing could be said again and again for the 360/PS3/PC.
This is not including the fact that most companies that are shifting to the mobile market has their own mobile division dedicated to the focus of mobile. It won't be taking away *any* console titles from other platforms unless the main gaming divisions of a company are forced to work on a mobile title.
Which is not true at all.


I don't work for Capcom, so I wouldn't know about the "exclusivity" being out for solely the iOS. Since they planned to release these titles to the Android as well, there's just going to be two more platforms that are going to compete with the likes of 3DS/Vita.

About the not owning the tablet and not being able to afford it, again it doesn't have to be a tablet, and again you don't have to buy the latest upgrade to necessarily play their titles, since the value of an older gen iOS device decreases significantly. You can make the same argument about the 300 million people that doesn't want to buy a Vita/3DS because they can't "afford to buy a device that only does one thing, and it would be sad that a series/game that I loved on the app-store is remaining exclusive to a device whose audience is miniscule compared to the mobile community".

Okay, just a heads up: "Portable (console) gaming" is *completely* different from just "console gaming".
Why are you upset that something like the iphone has been bringing more competition in the portable space? Shouldn't you be more glad that there's going to be even more competition for developers to consider the mobile market and make the series you love most more accessible to the average person in the world?
I mean damn, I was shocked that mostly everyone that owned/owns a DS completely criticized the mobile space (and really just iOS and its touchscreen-only device). You'd think they'd be backing a device that easily plays like a DS and is capable of doing other amazing things then just purely gaming. This is a great opportunity to make niche titles like the AA series be played by all sorts of people that have lives/work in the real-world and would mock at the kiddyness of the DS. Make them gamers so gaming can be taken more seriously and more invested.

Who cares if you're personally sad (don't take this the wrong way :P)? Like I said in my last post, the world doesn't revolve around you, and neither does it revolve around the gaming industry...If you're not willing to change/can't change, then tough. This is how the real-world works and you're going to have to deal with it somehow. The gaming industry is slowly being forced to accept that, and you will too.
Your being sad that it's "leaving" portable handhelds mentality can be considered a mentality that's holding back the gaming industry to change/adapt to the times. You can think of it like Sony being sad that Final Fantasy 13 wasn't going to be an exclusive title anymore and that was going to be released for the xbox 360...simply because Square Enix wanted to make its RPG title more accessible to an audience that's just as big/bigger than the ps3, and that probably would never pick up an RPG at all.
Exclusivity made sense back in the day when the hardware specs from different consoles were hugely/significantly different, and when games would legitimately depend on one console due to console specs.
Considering 360/PS3 are nearly identical in every sort of way, it makes no sense to force an exclusive title on our throats all the time.

The same argument can be applied in the portable space. Exclusivity makes no sense at all when it comes to the DS/3DS vs. iOS/Android. No sense at all. Especially when the hardware specs of the iOS/Android-based hardware are completely superior to that of the DS/3DS right now.
And especially when I've clearly shown you time-and time again that the audience of the mobile market (specifically iOS) is bigger than the DS/3DS/Vita combined.
The exclusivity argument, especially for the *portable* gaming scene, is a joke.
The iOS/Android hardware accepts ports easily and would require really no effort on a dev side to get DS/3DS ported games to work. I'm not saying Capcom is going to disregard the 3DS/DS audience completely, I'm just saying that they're taking the mobile space as seriously as their 3DS/DS audience.
To me, making that argument feels like you're trying to patronize the average mobile owner and *not* want them to play your niche titles for fear of mainstream status or something.
I just don't get it and completely boggled by the stance you and the rest of the handheld community that thinks the same way are taking by echoing Reggie.

Face it, the market has shown for some time now that a handheld doing only one thing is not the best investment right now. Smartphones that happen to do gaming is the craze and will probably be so for a long time. And everyone is going to jump on it.
I'm sorry if the likes of dedicated portable handhelds are going to die out. The market won't care at all about its death, just like how it never cared about 3d in the end, or virtual reality, and just like how it never cared about the powerful Dreamcast, 3do, Neo-geo, etc.

That's awesome, guess who the 3DS took that idea from? xP xP
-----
To the person that made the latest post (@CP):
So you're not a fan of smartphones...But you're a fan of a team making a translation that could potentially be played...for free? You're talking about AAI2 aren't you?
So you're supporting piracy by saying that right...?


I'm not sure what you mean by the objection sounds...Court-records has those things ripped already...unless you mean the remakes/AAI2?

See, this "The X belongs on the handhelds only!" is what is going to kill the *portable* gaming sector, especially when the audience for handhelds barely exist in comparison to the mobile market.
Ace Attorney never belonged to the handhelds at all, it just so happened to appear there first.

...No one remembers the PC ports of the games from so many years ago D=

Legit, it comes off as one saying "Hmph, other people are going to play the game that I've only been able to play on my awesome console that no one else has! I'm no longer going to be cool anymore!"
What're we now, hipsters? :P

Well I don't know if everyone hates stylus' I for one hate touchscreen exclusives and look for phones with slide keyboards (irritatingly rare in Britain) or failing that a stylus however yeah I thought I made that point clear. I'm not willing to change with the times because the things I like are on handhelds what reason do I have to get something like this when it doesn't have things I'm interested in. If it got AA5 and it wasn't ported elsewhere that's not enough reason for me to get something expensive I already have a laptop for word processing, a phone and a 3DS so it's not so much changing with the times as having no need to such things, all of which (except possibly the phone, I hate my phone) are better in their specific tasks than a tablet is.



Well sure that's the rule for technology that means we'll all eventually have better tech, 3DS will probably drop in price with the XL version coming out but it's not really the same scale as the price of ipads I think.This link is a simple google search for ipad 2 with basic prices hitting 269+ pounds more than the cost of a new 3DS with the latest ipad hitting somewhere in the 400s. Though again I don't need a tablet or smartphone because of my last point.



I don't think anyone was particularly happy with the surge of casual games coming out on the DS and the but there's also been a great degree of excellent shining gems on the DS so it relatively balances out. However fine, iOS gaming hasn't had much time to prove itself as a library and while AA5 would certainly be a step towards that library, it wouldn't be enough to convince me to get one, especially when you class it as 'casual gaming'.



I'm aware of this, iOS is famous for how easy it is to get products going on which is why it's such a big hit for Indie developers.



I don't think you understood what I meant. I said reduction in quality titles...making games that aren't as high-quality or to the fans specifications in order to appeal to a more casual market. An example though not an iOS example would be the latest Silent Hill:Book of Memories, which is swapping the psychological horror for multiplayer-focused combat, the game is swapping out what the fans want and quality in favour of something which is less serious and will appeal to more people. I'm not just talking about changing existing franchises to be more casual though but it's this sort of reasoning that will mean publishers will opt for another Angry Birds over something brand new and interesting.



Alright I'm going to be clear since my last post wasn't clear and was meant to result in no more debate.
I am freaking selfish about this. It doesn't matter if they are making it more accessible to the average person, they would be taking it away from the people who could reliably enjoy their game, the people who followed it on DS/Wii. It's not a handheld thing it's a Nintendo thing. I'm worried this smart generation of gaming is going to destroy Nintendo or at least it's major handhelds and thus I would have wasted money while the iPad which I couldn't have realistically afforded. I am not so humanitarian to wish to share AA with everyone when I can't have it myself, indeed it's not even a matter of sharing, that would imply I had it in the first place when in actuality it would be made on a platform I could not experience. Besides I think you are overestimating how many people that own smart devices are gamers, to my understanding many people have them exclusively for work, in some circumstances work would even provide them. Then consider how many people would actually follow through on a game or just try the sample but when it comes to real money they don't cash out. I think you are vastly overestimating the audience here.

So yeah as I tried to say before but you ignored it.

I'm irrational.
I love my little 3DS, left it at my friends and I'm missing it for a week, need my Theatrhythm.
While the market is potentially much larger on smart devices the reliable market has been with Nintendo. Sure there was a PC port but to my understanding it was crap and rushed.
You make a GREAT sales pitch for gaming on these devices considering they can have a bigger market and low costs and the fact it's easy to produce on these are things I already knew about this platform.
However I don't see it as beneficial to me as I already have enough devices that can do what a smart device does except better than it can do. Smart devices won't replace my games consoles because of the benefits of buttons and interfaces, smart devices won't replace my phone because I don't need an extreme phone, smart devices won't replace my laptop because it's got greater memory capacity and a built in keyboard.

I don't want AA5 to go to smart devices because I don't have one and don't need one and would like to not be deprived of something I adore just because Capcom wants to get modern and go for mass appeal.

I don't particularly want to discuss this anymore.

---

@Pierre, I'm too lazy to requote you so I'll bulletpoint you...Also I'm not sure what reply you're referring to in the BIG quote that you...well quoted :P

Reading from your post, you're obviously a BIG *Nintendo* fanboy too. Your posts is more interesting since I know this now xP

-I'm having a hard time following your first part of your reply (the paragraph about the stylus), can you rephrase it so I can understand it better?
For now, I'm just going to reply in a way that I think I know what you're getting at:
Your wanting to keep a handheld would make sense if it were iOS specific, but there are smartphones out there (Sony's Xperia Play comes to mind) that actually has physical controls you can accustom yourself to and still experience the likeness of the DS.
You're "I like my handhelds because there are things on the handhelds I like and mobiles don't have things I'm interested in" comes off to me as "My handhelds actually have physical controls" :P
What is on a handheld *IN GENERAL* that a mobile device doesn't have/can't do? You were really vague on that. And please don't say "physical buttons" because not all smartphones dedicate themselves to being touchscreen only.

" I already have a laptop for word processing, a phone and a 3DS so it's not so much changing with the times as having no need to such things, all of which (except possibly the phone, I hate my phone) are better in their specific tasks than a tablet is."

-Okay, I get where you're trying to come from, but a couple of things here:
1) iOS/Androids don't have to be a tablet to run games.
2) A 3DS, phone, and laptop are emphasized on portability. They are not PCs, nor are they home phones, nor are they Nintendo Wiis/Xbox 360s. The point of a smartphone/tablet is to be able to do all those tasks that a Phone/Handheld/Laptop at the convenience of the user, and more depending on apps, *ON THE GO*. Apple's iOS devices in particular happen to be so powerful/well-designed that with proper support from 3rd parties, the device (be it a tablet/phone) can be a great entertainment device, or great productive device, while *on the go*. Same with Android. As Apple has stated many times in the past (I think it was Apple, not sure), tablets in particular are NOT supposed to replace gaming consoles, nor does it exist to replace PCs. It is its own categorical device that can be utilized for a variety of purposes. It so happens it can do gaming (casual or not) on the side real well and more powerfully than something like a DS/3DS...And the consumer population has eaten that gaming part up.
Good thing too, since the gaming industry has been slowly hopping on the gold mine here. That means more ports of niche titles=potential new extension of fanbase/more money on a *mobile* level.
And because of the majority consumer market's expectation for how *mobile* gaming should be, you yourself have to convince them on why they should waste money on a handheld with a tacked-on 3d gimmick? You constantly bash iOS in particular but you don't show any reason for THAT audience on why it's worth buying a 3DS.

-----
"Well sure that's the rule for technology that means we'll all eventually have better tech, 3DS will probably drop in price with the XL version coming out but it's not really the same scale as the price of ipads I think.This link is a simple google search for ipad 2 with basic prices hitting 269+ pounds more than the cost of a new 3DS with the latest ipad hitting somewhere in the 400s. Though again I don't need a tablet or smartphone because of my last point."

-I'm not sure what 269+ pounds is in comparison to American dollars (too lazy to do calculation), but the iPad 2 was originally 699 dollars for the lowest hard-drive space (I could be wrong now), but that dropped significantly low to 100-299 dollars (for whatever model it was...Legit can't remember now, sorry).
I'm not even going to discuss the models of 3DS because of the complications of the circle pad "accessory" and the way the newest model will force older cart games to upscale at an uglier resolution, plus I don't own a 3DS so I know very little about it...
I as a mobile user certainly don't need a 3D gimmick+controller accessory to play games properly on the go, because of my last point. ;P
See here? Everytime you try to say you're not interested in something like a smartphone because it just does everything, I can turn it around and say I'm not interested in something like the 3DS because it only does one thing that my smartphone can do equally, and better (on a technical scale). That's what 300 million of those users that are most likely thinking this way (that don't own a handheld).

All the more reason to port mobile games so they can be played anywhere and have more exposure, isn't it?

-------
"I don't think anyone was particularly happy with the surge of casual games coming out on the DS and the but there's also been a great degree of excellent shining gems on the DS so it relatively balances out. However fine, iOS gaming hasn't had much time to prove itself as a library and while AA5 would certainly be a step towards that library, it wouldn't be enough to convince me to get one, especially when you class it as 'casual gaming'."
Your first part of your sentence, thank you for admitting that the iOS wasn't the only one (and wasn't the first) to have to deal with crapware. Thank you for also admitting that my argument about the whole oversaturation of the casual market for iOS in particular isn't fair. Thank you for at least understanding this part of my post as you were almost close to being called out by a hypocrite regarding the stances on crapware on iOS vs. DS.
AA5 would definitely be a better step towards a good library for iOS, but you must still remember: Mobile gaming is not the priority of a smartphone! Of course there will be loads and loads of casual games on a mobile platform, it's meant to kill-time while on the go.
I'm not trying to convince you to buy an iOS device and hope and pray that AA5 will come on it or anything in case Capcom makes it exclusive there. From your first post in this thread, all I've been trying to show you is that the mobile platform won't take away from main consoles, and that the mobile platform is simply a more accessible place for the mass market to consume niche titles that would otherwise not have appeared anywhere else, and it's been bringing serious competition/serious shift in the portable gaming world.
When you say "especially when you class it as 'casual gaming'." do you mean me classifying AA? Or iOS gaming in general?
--------
"I'm aware of this, iOS is famous for how easy it is to get products going on which is why it's such a big hit for Indie developers."

Want to know why? Because iOS is arguably the easiest mobile AND portable platform to develop for. It's not just a big hit for Indie developers, it's been a big hit for big companies too (like our beloved Capcom and Square Enix).
It became such a big hit to Square Enix especially that their profitability from the mobile world was one of the reasons they started making a profit as a *whole* instead of a loss this year:
https://docs.google.com/viewer?url=http://www.square-enix.com/eng/news/pdf/12q4earnings.pdf&embedded=true
http://www.insidemobileapps.com/2012/05/14/mobile-helps-square-enix-back-to-profitability-75-9-million-in-net-income/

So logically it would be financially viable to develop for one of the easiest platforms (or port, your pick) right?
...Much more easier to attempt than trying to develop all assets to be 3D compatible wouldn't it? :D

---------
"I don't think you understood what I meant. I said reduction in quality titles...making games that aren't as high-quality or to the fans specifications in order to appeal to a more casual market. An example though not an iOS example would be the latest Silent Hill:Book of Memories, which is swapping the psychological horror for multiplayer-focused combat, the game is swapping out what the fans want and quality in favour of something which is less serious and will appeal to more people. I'm not just talking about changing existing franchises to be more casual though but it's this sort of reasoning that will mean publishers will opt for another Angry Birds over something brand new and interesting."

People used to think the DS's success in its time would produce a reduction of quality titles from main consoles in order to appeal to a more casual market.
...Obviously not true, as it supplemented the gaming market in general, not take away anything.
"Fan's specifications" has to do more with the outrage of loyal fanbase itself than the "casual" market. Think Mass Effect/Capcom's poor releases of certain titles thanks to listening to its "loyal" fans.
The multiplayer focused combat is meant to appeal to a hardcore FPS/TPS audience, same with Resident Evil now...what does that have to do with mobile gaming in particular? Seems irrelevant.

Your throwing around the term "casual" loosely is quite detrimental to the points your making. When people say "casual" for a mobile device, they're not talking about a COD game that's turned into Rated E for everyone shooting candy at bunnies. They're talking about games/time-killers with quick satisfying, or easy effortless gameplay (like Canabalt, Jetpack Joyride, Solitaire, Doodle Jump, Angry Birds, Ghost Trick, Phoenix Wright etc.).
Changing a game to be more *age-appropiate* friendly casual is the result of a company's decision to appeal to a mass market that exists mainly of 12-year old ragequitters on xbox live whose parents try to make informed decisions on appropriate games to play or not. Not because of the existence/popularity of the mobile market.
That's why Call of Duty: Zombies is considered a mature, hardcore FPS game on the mobile platform. The gameplay itself is much more violent-based/harder to pick up on.
Don't get "casual" games on the App store mixed up with "Games turning more casually friendly" :P

Your point about "This will make publishers opt in to more Angry birds than something new and interesting" is laughable, because you've been talking about *main* console games regarding this. The market in the main console world would be apalled if only casual mobile/portable games started being the only titles being released on a 360/PS3/Wii. No FPS player would be a happy camper knowing this, and no publisher would be stupid to go in that direction.
Wanna know why? Because unlike the theoretical points you bring up of the dangers of the mobile market, publishers/studios have the sense to know that the expectations/audience of the main console gaming right now is completely different than that of the portable world. They'll cater/adapt to that with their *mobile divisions*.

-------
Alright I'm going to be clear since my last post wasn't clear and was meant to result in no more debate.
I am freaking selfish about this. It doesn't matter if they are making it more accessible to the average person, they would be taking it away from the people who could reliably enjoy their game, the people who followed it on DS/Wii. It's not a handheld thing it's a Nintendo thing. I'm worried this smart generation of gaming is going to destroy Nintendo or at least it's major handhelds and thus I would have wasted money while the iPad which I couldn't have realistically afforded. I am not so humanitarian to wish to share AA with everyone when I can't have it myself, indeed it's not even a matter of sharing, that would imply I had it in the first place when in actuality it would be made on a platform I could not experience. Besides I think you are overestimating how many people that own smart devices are gamers, to my understanding many people have them exclusively for work, in some circumstances work would even provide them. Then consider how many people would actually follow through on a game or just try the sample but when it comes to real money they don't cash out. I think you are vastly overestimating the audience here."

You have a selfish mentality...Ok, that's fine if you think that, but as I've said many times already, the world doesn't revolve around you, nor does it revolve around game companies/the gaming industry.

What the hell is the mobile platform taking away from portable gaming? If anything that I've shown you so far, they've been *adding* to portable gaming because of that accessibility.
And how are they taking away from handhelds? So far, all Capcom (specifically Capcom) has done with almost all of their titles so far is port their games to the iOS. With the GS HD remakes, all they've done is upscale the games with little other effort and are making the entire series available for the audience that was established on iOS 2 years ago, and expanding on it due to the new audience that occurred on Ghost Trick just last year.

So it's no longer a handheld thing...It's a Nintendo thing? By saying that, you've just lost the credibility of your entire arguments/posts here. Considering you're a fanboy, I will apologize to you ahead of time that the single, portable handheld that does only one thing that your precious Nintendo pioneered last generation has started to become irrelevant in this world at this point in time right now. So much that the 3DS had to have a huge price drop just months after it was released to entice people to buy it. So much that the CEO of Nintendo (the Japanese guy I forget his name now) voluntarily cut his salary so more resources could be invested into trying to get the 3DS out there in the world.
If you want to get technical, it's your fault and only your own that you blindly stuck to a single-purpose device and wasted money/didn't save any money buying a smartphone/tablet because of your "loyalty" to the Nintendo brand. Not trying to be rude here, but that's the logical conclusion I'm coming to on that part of your post.

...But that's ok, because as I pointed out many times already, the mobile platform is its own thing supplementing portable gaming and increasing competition in general. I doubt Capcom would want to make only exclusive titles on a platform that would obviously be popular on the 3DS as well. They just know that if it does reasonable well on the 3DS/DS, then it will logically do pretty damn well (if not BETTER) on the iOS/Andoird (which btw, it has).
Nintendo has been threatened for a long time even before the 3DS came out since the App Store was released. IMO they're doing pretty ok considering the threat of Apple, the only ones that have anything to be concerned about is Sony and its Vita (THAT is a company you should be backing regarding its portable gaming handheld, as it's the closest comparison to what true quality game titles can be like on the go).
But I digress, you're a fanboy and this "debate" was clearly won by me awhile back now xP xP

You're saying I'm overestimating on the audience that exists for the gaming portion of the mobile platform. But I've already given you sample numbers of a few companie's success (in terms of downloads, AND PROFITS!), you've just completely ignored the facts/stats I gave regarding the "they don't cash out" point!
And that was just scratching the surface! Like I said in a few posts ago, this "audience" on the mobile platform is a multitasking bunch, you can't explicitly/traditionally say that X amount of people use the smartphone for work only.
The variables could get tricky to a point where you can argue "X amount of people use the smartphone for leisurely reading+gaming, while sometimes using it for
web-browsing, and may a little working on the side when away from home". There's a reason smartphones are called multi-purpose devices.

And it so happens Apple's iphone is the first smartphone which the mass population bought/used their first time worldwide. Completely mixed motivations as to why they're getting a tablet/smartphone that's different than buying a handheld solely used for gaming.

But those mixed motivations tends to include *A LOT* of things. And gaming is one of them. And knowing how powerful an iOS device gets overtime specifically, these multitasking audience is expecting quality products/service in EVERYTHING they get from the app store...not just games, but EVERYTHING. From movie streaming apps, to word processing apps, to book apps, to gaming apps, EVERYTHING.

And that has been proving VERY true since its short 4 years. The content is larger/longer in games now, quality has ever increased, and it's going to continue that way until Apple's smartphone/the mobile sector dies out (which probably won't be in a LONG time).

So yeah I never ignored it, I merely skimmed over it because your personal "I'm selfish Nintendo fanboy" doesn't reflect upon the entire market.

-----
"I'm irrational."
-Your points are, but I don't know about you personally :P

"I love my little 3DS, left it at my friends and I'm missing it for a week, need my Theatrhythm.
While the market is potentially much larger on smart devices the reliable market has been with Nintendo. Sure there was a PC port but to my understanding it was crap and rushed. "
"Potentially"?
You need to re-read my statistics post again, there already *IS* a larger AND reliable market in the mobile sector. 300+ million multitasking users vs. 20+million 3DS users (or whatever number I stated previously).
Yep, Capcom's mobile division Beeline Interactive got more total downloads (40+ million) than there exists 3DS owners at the moment. Does that tell you something right now?

Who cares if the PC port was crap/rushed, my point about it being ported to PC was to show that Capcom has never made the AA series an exclusive Nintendo-only branded hardware title. I've proven you wrong on that and you just admitted it just now. As a matter of fact, there were complaints about the Wii port being hard to use the controller to use for objection. It doesn't make sense to port to these titles because of the control scheme right? Yet people are going to bash the touchscreen iOS device in particular because it's a touchscreen device (like the DS) that is more mainstream and popular to own? Or what? I just don't get the logic here.

"You make a GREAT sales pitch for gaming on these devices considering they can have a bigger market and low costs and the fact it's easy to produce on these are things I already knew about this platform."
It's not a sales pitch, it's fact, reality, and all true. The numbers don't lie dude LOL.


"However I don't see it as beneficial to me as I already have enough devices that can do what a smart device does except better than it can do."
Fine, that's your choice to miss out on the next big shift. Your "I have enough devices that can do what a smart device does except better than it can do" is completely flawed btw. But I don't want to waste time debating that.



"Smart devices won't replace my games consoles because of the benefits of buttons and interfaces, smart devices won't replace my phone because I don't need an extreme phone, smart devices won't replace my laptop because it's got greater memory capacity and a built in keyboard."

-Smart devices are not intended to replace your games consoles. I've proven this already and have told you countless times that it couldn't be able to anyway. Touchscreen or not :/
I don't get why you keep acting like smart devices are supposed to be some "main" console". It's not! It's its OWN thing separated from what a PC/console/handheld is.

-I don't know how smartphones are "extreme" phones when it's just a device that does phone capabilities. Flawed lgoic.

-You can buy a keyboard accessory and the memory capacity is only needed to do essential productivity (as its intended).

"I don't want AA5 to go to smart devices because I don't have one and don't need one and would like to not be deprived of something I adore just because Capcom wants to get modern and go for mass appeal."

-you don't want AA5 to go to devices because it's you don't have one? Capcom is not stupid enough to make it exclusively on a smart device LOL, so you'll most likely not be deprived/affected at all. Capcom is already modern with the times regarding mobile and is not attempting to change the experience of the game in anyway (except for whatever necessary physical port exists) but to simply get it out there in more people's hands.


----
"I don't particularly want to discuss this anymore."

That's fine, I think you lost this debate the minute you said "it's not a handheld, but a Nintendo thing" anyways ;P

Last edited by SevenCarrots on Mon Aug 06, 2012 1:56 am, edited 1 time in total.

Might wanna cut your tone a bit there pal, I'm not a crazy fanboy, don't have a big Link statuette in my room or a life size Mario outfit and you are coming across as crazy condescending and pretentious (like a couple of other debaters I know, maybe it's a trend). Even when I try to be reasonable in explaining I still get met with mockery, condescention and insults. I'm a human being too man I may be a nintendo fan but I also like Sony own a PSP and I'm getting increasingly involved with PC gaming. Nintendo's also let me down more than most companies but yeah I still keep them close to my heart. Anyway by not talk about this anymore I didn't mean "see a whole page of retort to a mostly nonsensical post". I won't post further after this since that seems to be the only way to get you to stop. I was living in hope from before you even arrived, knew the odds were stacked against it coming to 3DS based on stats already it's the whole reason for this topic's existance though I still hoped, didn't need you to come in and provide a big rundown on why it should because I don't really care about the arguments for to the extent that it'll change my belief.



You'll probably just throw "CAPCOM WON'T MAKE IT JUST ON SMART DEVICES LOL" back at me for this but as I was before you started talking, I'm critically afraid they'll only put it on one device in spite of your reassurances. It's easy to talk statistics and facts because they are in your favour, statistically sure Smart pads and phones are major hits now while the 3DS is slowly pulling itself out of it's awful launch but...

How would you like it if AA5 or AAI2 it was ported to 3DS and not your Smart devices in that choice?

Would you feel angry? Betrayed? Disappointed? Only difference (in this case) 'tween us is that you are on the side it s likely to be ported to and thus have less reasons to worry.

I'm worried and you are coming in and essentially going "LOL HERE'S MORE REASONS TO WORRY BECAUSE THE FUTURE IS SMARTPHONES AND TABLET PCS!"

So just step back for a second man, cause no one wanted this debate but you, I didn't even consider it a debate you were the one who brought in your "debate club" membership. I just wanted you to understand how it'd be upsetting to me if it went to iOS and similar devices instead of 3DS.

---

First Pierre, I want to apologize if I offended you in anyway. I was being playful with the whole "fanboy" because of how you're so clearly intent on defending *Nintendo* themselves more than you're defending portable gaming handhelds in general. It wasn't supposed to be an attack on your character, but just the flawed logic/statements you kept providing.
If I'm being mockful/pretentious, then sorry, it wasn't meant to be an attack on you, but on the ridiculousness of some of the points you made (again no offense).

Those trained in debate naturally have a tendency to try to prove you wrong completely/make you look stupid as an instinct. You're not supposed to take anything we say *personal*. You haven't budged even though your case has blown apart and fell, and I commend you for that. :)

If you have a Link statuette/Mario outfit, you're not some fanboy, you're clearly an obsessed gaming otaku of sorts :P. Fanboys are just guys that defends the one brand they're loyal about to the death and the posts you make come off as that of a fanboy for Nintendo particularly. That's all, it wasn't supposed to be insulting, just pointing off how you're coming off as. Same with how you say I'm coming off as a pretentious prick. No offense taken.

Hey, guess what? I used to own a GBA, Game Gear, PSP Fat, PSP Slim, an ipod touch, and now an iPad for my portable gaming goodness. I've owned a Genesis, N64, Dreamcast, PS2, and an Xbox. PC is still my favorite platform to play on because technical-wise it is superior to all other consoles IMO xP xP
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I don't quite get "I was living in hope from before you even arrived, knew the odds were stacked against it coming to 3DS based on stats already it's the whole reason for this topic's existance though I still hoped, didn't need you to come in and provide a big rundown on why it should because I don't really care about the arguments for to the extent that it'll change my belief."

You seem to assume that I was making an argument that AA5 *Won't* come to 3DS. There's nothing indicating that will happen so far (20 million users on the 3DS is still a large number for Capcom to make profit on). I'm simply been showing you that a)The mobile platform isn't taking away from any main consoles. B) The mobile platform is making a huge dent in the portable gaming world only. C)The large userbase on the mobile platform would be stupid on Capcom's part to ignore (meaning mobile is going to be pretty guaranteed of having a port/title of AA5.) And D.) Your downplaying of the mobile platform/smart devices (iOS specifically) is just completely flawed/wrong to ignore.
If you never cared about the arguments, then it means you never cared about how ridiculous some of the points you were making either. Don't waste mine or other people's time making bold claims and putting in half the effort to defend yourself/attack me if you're not serious on bracing for a counter-attack on your claims...C'mon, I put over 3+ hours worth writing all those posts man, I thought everything was cool b/e us the entire time. :P

------
"You'll probably just throw "CAPCOM WON'T MAKE IT JUST ON SMART DEVICES LOL" back at me for this but as I was before you started talking, I'm critically afraid they'll only put it on one device in spite of your reassurances. It's easy to talk statistics and facts because they are in your favour, statistically sure Smart pads and phones are major hits now while the 3DS is slowly pulling itself out of it's awful launch but..."

-The 3DS had a rough launch, I mean VERY rough launch, you're right about that.
A company like Capcom doesn't bother to do exclusivity with some of their titles (or should I say all of their titles? xP).
Just think of Street Fighter II appearing on almost every type of console in existence (even PCs!) decades ago, even today. They're not really ones to care about exclusivity most of the time because exposing more games to more people everywhere=more profit. It's just logical based on their release history to assume they won't make it only to one device.
----------------------------
"How would you like it if AA5 or AAI2 it was ported to 3DS and not your Smart devices in that choice?"

If AA5 was only for 3DS, I would just shrug and say "tough", and move on with my life.
AA5 alone is not enough of an enticement for me to want to own a 3DS. I can live without playing one video-game. That's Capcom's loss of a potential sale by not having it out on a platform I and 300 other million people own. Not my loss that Capcom didn't want to cater to me for whatever reason. It's a business decision at the end of the day and I can rage all I want at them for keeping it on one measly platform...But at the end of the day, *the world doesn't revolve around me*. I have plenty of other games to keep me company and not have to worry about one game in particular.
If it was intended to remain exclusive, I'll just look at Walkthroughs/LPs to follow along what's happening in the story, since there isn't much gameplay to the visual novel that is the AA series anyway.

As for AAI2, LOL I wouldn't care anyway because I don't particularly like the AAI series in general...It's just pure investigations(that I hate) with a cross-examination mechanic+tacked on "logical connection" gimmick, with crappy perversion of orchestration+rock music based on old iterations of music that's completely unfitting of the character Miles Edgeworth and/or his theme songs.
But that can be saved for another thread, haha, that's just IMO.
The demo of the first case alone bored me in the first 10 minutes playing it, and since its time era occurs before AJ, I have even more reason not to care if it never came to the mobile platform, since I wouldn't be missing anything important.
If it DID come to the mobile platform though, I would be more than willing to try it out again just because it would be convenient AND cheap to get it at the App-Store.
Oh and for ripping assets possibilities (Which C-R beat me to for GS HD remakes because I'm not japanese >.> LOL) :D
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"Would you feel angry? Betrayed? Disappointed? Only difference (in this case) 'tween us is that you are on the side it s likely to be ported to and thus have less reasons to worry. "

None of the above. I'd feel indifferent about it. With Capcom specifically, I'd remain optimistic that in the near future they will consider a port without telling anyone (that's basically what they almost did for Ghost Trick, LOL).
I think it's safe to say Capcom's developing GS5 for 3DS, and plans to port the 3DS version to the iOS without the 3D gimmick.

"Porting" something means you're literally copying the game and modifying it to work on another system with a different hardware/physical control set-up. It's safe to say Capcom is building it from the *ground up* for the 3DS. If Capcom does a port of any game from a particular system to another, that means exclusivity doesn't exist ;)

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"I'm worried and you are coming in and essentially going "LOL HERE'S MORE REASONS TO WORRY BECAUSE THE FUTURE IS SMARTPHONES AND TABLET PCS!"

You're worried about a shift in change in particular aspect of the gaming community. So is Nintendo and Sony. No one else in the industry really cares about it except for them, as they have been really the only companies (1st party hardware makers) to complain about the new direction the portable gaming world is taking. I wonder why?
Hmm...Oh wait! Because they are the only 2 major portable game handheld makers that has everything to lose in this in the portable market vs. the mobile market!
...Makes sense why most of the handheld community is crying foul on that ;P

Even Microsoft doesn't care (considering their first party hardware makers as well), and their smartphones marketability/selling has failed countless times to hit a dent against Apple iOS+Google Android.
But guess what Microsoft is doing that Nintendon't?
Their Smart Glass technology, where physical barriers of consoles gaming of any kind *does not exist* in their world. Play on your 360, and if you have to leave, play the continue where you left off on the same game on your iPad or iPhone or Android while you are away. Guess what? It's already out for awhile and has been a success so far. And you know Apple and M$ are big rivals to each other.

If Nintendo wants to do better then it has so far in this new era they better stop trying to act old-generational and let go of their pride and start integrating technology similar to M$ and get on the mobile bandwagon. They're usually the first to innovate/pioneer directions like this. M$ beat them to the punch.
But this is a very irrelevant point anyways since my points about M$ are making assumptions that people who own a mobile device actually/already owns a main console device of any kind.
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"So just step back for a second man, cause no one wanted this debate but you, I didn't even consider it a debate you were the one who brought in your "debate club" membership. I just wanted you to understand how it'd be upsetting to me if it went to iOS and similar devices instead of 3DS."

Sorry Pierre, you can't say "no one wanted this debate but you", I simply disagreed with the first post you made strongly. You kept this debate going by replying back constantly and replying to everything as short as you could, and are now officially admitting defeat with your latest post. Don't try to act like you're some victim here ;P, you should have known someone was eventually going to disagree with your points and call you out on it.

I didn't mention about a "debate club", I simply told you why I was being so detailed/why I provided those links/stats/facts-it just comes naturally as a former high-school debater that I *must* provide proof/evidence of any claims I make...something you haven't really done except for the pricing of an ipad on a google search :P

I still haven't really understood why you're personally upset that the game could potentially be going to other devices BESIDES the 3DS, when there's no legitimate reason to worry about any of that at this point in time. If you did your research, you knew the risks you were taking by buying a product that has been shown so far not doing well, where another product (like the iOS) has been consistently doing well EVERY year LOL.
...Also considering that you have repeatedly agreed with some of the major points I made too :P ("sure your stats support your claims, but..")

You're just someone not susceptible to change, and those that don't adapt, tend to die out/become irrelevant in life. Just ask SNK, Atari, Apple, AOL, Blockbuster, or even Sega for that matter.

Btw, I'd go personally reflect on myself if you're really getting upset over one video-game potentially being on other platforms/potentially not being on a platform that you own. It's just video-games, they're for entertainment...It shouldn't be something that takes over your life :s, no offense or anything on that, just honest.

I would be quite surprised if it was ported to a video game console - here in the US I am always under the impression that the localizations are just obligatory sloppy seconds because we're bitchy fans. Which is fine with me of course :P BUT! I can't help but feel like it's just not even feasible anymore - I was BLOWN AWAY I was able to play Trials and Tribulations on my own terms, on my own DS! And even MORE surprised that the Investigations got localized. Hell - it's a friggin' EDGEWORTH SPINOFF. So while Capcom has been surprisingly generous with the localizations, I can't help that my suspicions still linger that it'll never happen...

Hence why I'm thoroughly expecting the buck to stop here - at least in terms of DS games. I think if anything it'd be an iOS game, which is convenient enough for me to buy but not even near the level of satisfaction and money I'd pay for a DS or 3DS port.

Again, to me no one's thinking about the DS and much less 'that weird lawyer game' on the shelf. A localization would merely appease the immediate ring of fans - not a profitable venture. iOS, now that's feasible. No cartridges, art, packaging, shipping...just my thoughts though. I'd much rather pay the 30 for the DS experience than 5 - 10 for an iPhone experience.

In regards to that whole iOS v Console bit earlier though: While the consoles (handheld in this case) offer the "proper" experience for a video game, and for many offer that traditional, analog experience, it is quite true that handhelds and smartphones are slowly fusing, software wise...I've turned my head to the reality mostly because I've abandoned games for the most part, save the few gems I can't keep myself from (the Zelda and Mario series, a handful of others such as the AA of course!) But this IS a sad truth.

To me, this means that any producer can put up a .99 cent game that's fun for "a little while" and become a sleeper hit - an overnight sensation. But that's all it is to me - a forgettable game that was fun for a day because it 'seemed cool,' and after all, who could pass it up at a mere 1$...it's like a bag of potato chips. All of these sleeper hits get sensational one day and are forgotten the next - and that's all they need, they've made their million. The iOS market shortens and expedites the life of games, whilst generating comparable revenue in shorter time than long term console games. I'm sure many who bought the iOS Phoenix Wright had treated it similarly, as "a bag of potato chips..." but never finished it and since deleted it because "they didn't expect all the reading."

I'm of course aware this isn't the case all the time, I'm sure hardcore fans are born out of iOS games such as yourself Huddini, which I am surprised by. However I believe that's more to attribute to the nature of the game rather than how it was bought - and that's to say I'm sure I can expect you not to be on an Angry Birds forum simultaneous to this one.

That being said, Phoenix Wright is just a good game - maybe too good for iOS, maybe too big for iOS, despite being very cookie cutter and simple in terms of programming. But I think the reason it's so good is because...

...Phoenix Wright started on a console - it was built for a console, and gained fans ON CONSOLES. The iOS versions are ports that take advantage of this 'potato chip' effect I believe in - but why wouldn't you, if you were Capcom? If all you ask for is for people to buy your game, even if they mistakenly buy it "not realizing they wouldn't play through it," then wouldn't you port it? Perhaps even satisfying the hardcore fans if they keep up the jig and keep up the franchise this way? Beats the hell out of sending the fancied up DS/PSP/Whatever versions that might just scratch by in sales.

Conclusion: The iOS market is NOT BULLSHIT, and is NOT A WASTE OF TIME, and has very PROFITABLE POSSIBILITIES. HOWEVER, especially from the POV of the type of fans Ace Attorney garners, the games being sold through there are QUITE IMPERSONAL and just won't do it for them like it WOULD ON A CONSOLE, or, specifically, "a Nintendo console," where they feel at home. I just want to make this distinction - the fans being born out of the console experience are largely hardcore - I can't really speak for the iOS fans (except for you Huddini,) but I can't help that Capcom will be okay with letting this series become a bag of potato chips - sell more copies, but to people that care less. *shrugs.* Just how I view it, not necessarily the exact case and point.

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Agreed with the above strongly. The fact that iOS devices are a bit too versatile may add to this "potato chip" effect, especially on the Iphone, I have AA on it but I've yet to complete it (for a second time) I ended up replaying it on my DS, I can't treat it the same way I do with Fruit Ninja for example, a perfect and quick game I can easily get into as well as being a perfect time killer which is what the majority of iOS owners use these games for, something like Ace Attorney I need to be way more immersed into, it just begs to be on my DS a device that invites this state of mind of playing such a game, and I really love the series and didn't even bother completing the game, imagine a casual gamer who's new to AA, will they ever even finish the game after their purchase? Will they really lay down and dedicate a an hour or two playing a visual novel with 2 sentences on every tap? Or is that already stepping into hardcore gamer territory? Sure there's SOME folks like Huddini who did get into the series through iOS, but I can't imagine a large amount of players who got into the series in the same fashion.

Also.

Am I the only one who thought this wasn't necessary?

I know it's "instinct" or whatever but did a tiny bit of you ever thought this might be a wee bit too.... personally insulting for Pierre just because he had an opposing opinion? I don't know maybe I'm wrong and it's just me.

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Yes, the console experience certainly encourages the very solitary, immersed experience. For example, you don't play Words With Friends and feel like you had your own personal experience with the game, or even a connection with it. With Ace Attorney, you get that - it's not, 'in so many words' a game to be enjoyed by more than one person at a time.

While I realize that Ace Attorney on iOS doesn't strip it of that immersive effect, I do think it's a step away from it if any. No, it's not turning it into a social game, it is still very much the same game, but I don't know. It's this big story, with lots of characters to love - frivolously downloading it on the App Store will not make you appreciate it as much as you would paying 30 in the store, itching to get home to play it, while viewing all the wonderful art that comes with it!

I think there's no question there is a degree of depersonalization on the iOS medium in this case, even if in so many facets it is a LITERAL, EXACT PORT. I reaffirm, though, that this is probably not Capcom's worry...like anyone else, it's money. And if money's in iOS, which there is, then that's where they'll go. Maybe that means series like Ace Attorney that are very textual and easy to port WILL die out on consoles in lieu of iOS - but we're only talking one genre here...and a specific GAME at that.

I doubt we'll see a paradigm shift from handhelds to iOS, but it's certainly claiming it's own large niche chunk in that market - perhaps enough to rope in AA with it.

But - playing it at all is better than not.

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