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Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
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Author:  Jibo [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
(First let me say this is not an offense to gays of any kind, just an observation, I'm not trying to offend anyone.)

Am I the only one who noticed the amount of camp and/or gay characters?

Let's look that them by game:

GS1
Larry Butz; acts very emotional and friendly toward Nick in a bi way. (As of now... convinced against this, well pretty much xD. Sorry =[ Too chumy to be straight, DAMN YOU!
Red White; Has a naked statue of himself, wears a camp suit and has camp hair. (Still totally for)

GS2

Richard Wellington; looks like a fashion model, :wellington: <--- that smiley.
Franzika von Karma; doesn't like men (as stated), whips girls
Maximillion Galactica; refers to Phoenix as "sweetie", just look at him!!
Adrian Andrews; doesn't like the only men she knows proir the game, trusts women and... stuff, CFTFs drawings

GS3
Young Phoenix
Jean Armstrong. I am NOT justifying this!
As of evidence in the game, Phoenix Wright, but he's bi though, methinks. =D

So... corrections? Comments? Agree or disagree with anything?
Author:  musouka [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:32 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
No Edgeworth?
Author:  Jibo [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
musouka wrote:
No Edgeworth?
I almost put him in but the amount of Objections would be huge. Tea set and frilly cravat.... THAT'S not sugggestive...
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
I lol'd big time when I learned that Max, the most FAAAABULOUS character ever, is in love with Regina. Pshhh...

Goes to show that you can't always judge a book by it's cover... XD
Author:  Happiness Punch! [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
I totally disagree... I think you're prejudicing too much.

It's more of a culture difference, since PW is Japanese, and Japanese people have developed a far more acceptable culture.

Wellington, White, Max : Since PW is a Japanese serie, looking flamboyant but still being straight is more accepted there in the country of the rising sun than here in west.

Adrian, Franzi: Girls depending on one of the same sex isn't considered lesbianish in Japan.
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:39 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Happiness Punch! wrote:
Wellington, White, Max : Since PW is a Japanese serie, looking flamboyant is more accepted there in the country of the rising sun than here in west.

Adrian, Franzi: Girls depending on one of the same sex isn't considered lesbianish in Japan.

I think you make a good point. If you notice, the majority of yaoi/yuri fans are from the West; we jump to conclusions about sexuality more than other cultures.
Author:  Jibo [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Riku wrote:
Happiness Punch! wrote:
Wellington, White, Max : Since PW is a Japanese serie, looking flamboyant is more accepted there in the country of the rising sun than here in west.

Adrian, Franzi: Girls depending on one of the same sex isn't considered lesbianish in Japan.

I think you make a good point. If you notice, the majority of yaoi/yuri fans are from the West; we jump to conclusions about sexuality more than other cultures.
I agree. But you can't deny the whole sweetie thing with Phoenix. That creeps "him" out too.
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:49 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Jibo wrote:
I agree. But you can't deny the whole sweetie thing with Phoenix. That creeps "him" out too.

That leaves us with the dilemma of what to call Max. I mean, he's not gay - he openly expresses interest in Regina. But the "sweetie" thing... XD
Author:  musouka [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:55 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Riku wrote:
That leaves us with the dilemma of what to call Max. I mean, he's not gay - he openly expresses interest in Regina. But the "sweetie" thing... XD


Bi?
Author:  Android 21 3/7 [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 7:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
musouka wrote:
Riku wrote:
That leaves us with the dilemma of what to call Max. I mean, he's not gay - he openly expresses interest in Regina. But the "sweetie" thing... XD


Bi?


Not to mention pedo... Regina's 16.
Author:  Jibo [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Android 21 3/7 wrote:
musouka wrote:
Riku wrote:
That leaves us with the dilemma of what to call Max. I mean, he's not gay - he openly expresses interest in Regina. But the "sweetie" thing... XD


Bi?


Not to mention pedo... Regina's 16.
Have you forgotton Ema and Phoenix potential relationship? Or Maya?
Author:  Android 21 3/7 [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
yeah, but Max is open about it.
Author:  Busterella [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
I'm pretty sure Max is straight, just...you know...fabulous. XD It's part of his entertainer persona, I guess.
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Android 21 3/7 wrote:
yeah, but Max is open about it.

Yeah, and while he calls men "sweetie" it's not like he's saying he's interested in them. He calls EVERYONE "sweetie." So I don't think bisexual works either.
Author:  Mrs. Edgeworth [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Jibo wrote:
Android 21 3/7 wrote:
Not to mention pedo... Regina's 16.
Have you forgotton Ema and Phoenix potential relationship? Or Maya?

But it's not like Phoenix is hitting on them or engaged to them. XD It's totally different. Besides, Maya's 18 in JfA, right?
Author:  Jibo [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Mrs. Edgeworth wrote:
Jibo wrote:
Android 21 3/7 wrote:
Not to mention pedo... Regina's 16.
Have you forgotton Ema and Phoenix potential relationship? Or Maya?

But it's not like Phoenix is hitting on them or engaged to them. XD It's totally different. Besides, Maya's 18 in JfA, right?
But Phoenix ages too! ;D
Author:  Kali [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Pedophilia is a sexual interest in children, not teens. I assure you, a 20-something's interest in a 16-17 year old is not that abnormal.
Author:  Raelle [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:24 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Riku wrote:
I think you make a good point. If you notice, the majority of yaoi/yuri fans are from the West; we jump to conclusions about sexuality more than other cultures.


I'm sorry if this comes off as rude, but HA HA HA HA, oh god, you're joking, right? Right?
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:26 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Raelle wrote:
Riku wrote:
I think you make a good point. If you notice, the majority of yaoi/yuri fans are from the West; we jump to conclusions about sexuality more than other cultures.


I'm sorry if this comes off as rude, but HA HA HA HA, oh god, you're joking, right? Right?

Nope. Just because Japanese yaoi/yuri fans draw better fanart doesn't mean there are more of them. Godot
Author:  Raelle [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Riku wrote:
Nope. Just because Japanese yaoi/yuri fans draw better fanart doesn't mean there are more of them. Godot

I'm sorry again, but the suggestion that the western fandom has a larger slash fanbase than the Japanese one is so hysterical I seriously cannot stop laughing. Have you browsed the general index of the Japanese fansites? Seriously.
Author:  Apeman1813 [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:31 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
"Larry Butz; acts very emotional and friendly toward Nick in a bi way."
I found Larry to be very straight compare to most people in the game, he's just the type of person to blow things out of perportion of how things really are (his (bad) luck, love, fear, graditude)

"Red White; Has a naked statue of himself, wears a camp suit and has camp hair."
Who said that's a statue of himself??? And how would that make you gay???

"Richard Wellington; looks like a fashion model, Wellington <--- that smiley."
Yea, he's pretty snobby and flamboyent (sp?)

"Franzika von Karma; doesn't like men (as stated), whips all genders, CFTFs drawings"
I think she just doesn't like Phoenix, until she decides to help him at the end and keeps the 4th evidence that is

"Maximillion Galactica; refers to Phoenix as "sweetie", just look at him!!"
I found him to be very metrosexual

"Adrian Andrews; doesn't like the only men she knows proir the game, trusts women and... stuff, CFTFs drawings"
... honestly, I'm not sure what to think of her anymore... she really does scream lesbian...


What about Lana? Who was attracted Mia.
Phoenix and Edgeworth... nuff' said.
Author:  musouka [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:33 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Are you talking about generally or specifically in the PW fandom? Either way, I would say the Japanese have more. Unless you're counting slash into the equation, which would probably make it about equal.
Author:  Jibo [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Apeman1813 wrote:
"Red White; Has a naked statue of himself, wears a camp suit and has camp hair."
Who said that's a statue of himself??? And how would that make you gay???
Phoenix said it was and it looked a lot like him. Gay is liking the same gender as yourself and having something NAKED that's of yourself is gay. Hobohodo
Author:  Happiness Punch! [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:37 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
I find those sweetie moments cute, But still...

I don't actually see anything gay about Max at all. He may call Phoenix sweetie, but at the same he say sweetie to Maya. He maybe loves his fans so much, he calls them sweeties. He may be so nervous, and don't mention the tight spot he was in 2-3, being the defendant.

And jumping to conclusions that he is bi only because he says sweetie to a man or talks too much Fabulous... seems a little unfair. He lives in a circus, and his speech may be a little exaggerating, but that's what circus people are. He've been dreaming and working as a magician for a long time, being a little bit away from the "real, unacceptable" world.

And thinking Max is pedophile because he loves a 16 year old girl is overreacting. He seem to love her like in a typical childrens fairy tale, like a prince and a princess. Thinking only that Max would want Regina only for sex isn't what I'd expect. They may only give small kisses and hugs and that's it. Sex isn't so important in everyones life.

I don't have something against gays... but I find yaoi is disgusting, because there is simply too much of it, and it's so tasteless. If a character says something suggestive, for even once, hundreds of yaoi fics will emerge. It's like... disrespecting the male gender, keeping them from not being as free as females.

Like I've always thought, let them talk before you judge them. Sometimes sexualities doesn't exist in the world of cartoon, and sometimes people don't want to create gay characters.

And think also about Takumi, does he like yaoi? If he doesn't and finds them offensive, then people should really learn a lesson and respect him.
Author:  Croik [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:38 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Jibo I think you're totally reaching on this one.

Larry - the straightest guy in the series. He only dates female fashion models. Ever wonder why he's not in JFA? He was chasing women. He goes weeks and months without speaking to Phoenix because he's chasing women. What about that is even remotely bisexual?

I won't discount anyone's pairing preference, but I've never thought Larry "acted gay" around anyone, let alone Phoenix.

Redd's statue is modeled after Atlus. I guess he's rather pink but I've always associated that with being eccentric rather than gay. He's also got his arm around April in the case art.

I won't combat Franziska and Adrian. Edgy

But Max, despite his flamboyance, is clearly in love with Regina. And Yuusaku, one of the girliest looking guys in the series, is also also the only married one.

So no, I don't think there's "a lot of gay characters" in PW. Eccentric and odd, sure. But otherwise, naw.
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:41 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
musouka wrote:
Are you talking about generally or specifically in the PW fandom? Either way, I would say the Japanese have more. Unless you're counting slash into the equation, which would probably make it about equal.

And if you want to get really technical, combine all the countries that make up the "West" and compare the total population to that of Japan.

...I know they're packed like sardines on that island, but c'mon.
Author:  Apeman1813 [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:43 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Jibo wrote:
Apeman1813 wrote:
"Red White; Has a naked statue of himself, wears a camp suit and has camp hair."
Who said that's a statue of himself??? And how would that make you gay???
Phoenix said it was and it looked a lot like him. Gay is liking the same gender as yourself and having something NAKED that's of yourself is gay. Hobohodo

It makes you gay if like yourself, but emo if you don't??? WTF, I MUST BE GAY THEN
Author:  Raelle [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:45 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Happiness Punch! wrote:
I find yaoi is disgusting, because there is simply too much of it, and it's so tasteless. If a character says something suggestive, for even once, hundreds of yaoi fics will emerge. It's like... disrespecting the male gender, keeping them from not being as free as females.

And... do you really think this doesn't apply to the male-female, or even a female-female dynamic? We have a considerable amount of Phoenix/Mia, Phoenix/Maya, Phoenix/Franziska, and Adrian/Franziska shippers on here. How much real canon basis do you think those have? Does it make sense if I say het in general disgusts me, because it's so mainstream, and so tasteless?

I think it's really, really unfair that reading into perceived subtext is somehow disrespectful with it's two men, but it's jolly good if it's between a man and a woman.

(I'm really sorry if I'm coming off as overly abrasive, but this did bother me.)
Author:  Jibo [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:46 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Apeman1813 wrote:
Jibo wrote:
Apeman1813 wrote:
"Red White; Has a naked statue of himself, wears a camp suit and has camp hair."
Who said that's a statue of himself??? And how would that make you gay???
Phoenix said it was and it looked a lot like him. Gay is liking the same gender as yourself and having something NAKED that's of yourself is gay. Hobohodo

It makes you gay if like yourself, but emo if you don't??? WTF, I MUST BE GAY THEN
In a sexual way! (Nude self come on!) Geebuz some people need it spelled out for them.
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:52 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Raelle wrote:
Happiness Punch! wrote:
I find yaoi is disgusting, because there is simply too much of it, and it's so tasteless. If a character says something suggestive, for even once, hundreds of yaoi fics will emerge. It's like... disrespecting the male gender, keeping them from not being as free as females.

And... do you really think this doesn't apply to the male-female, or even a female-female dynamic? We have a considerable amount of Phoenix/Mia, Phoenix/Maya, Phoenix/Franziska, and Adrian/Franziska shippers on here. How much real canon basis do you think those have? Does it make sense if I say het in general disgusts me, because it's so mainstream, and so tasteless?

I think it's really, really unfair that reading into perceived subtext is somehow disrespectful with it's two men, but it's jolly good if it's between a man and a woman.

(I'm really sorry if I'm coming off as overly abrasive, but this did bother me.)

I'm not a yaoi fan, and it even bothered me.

It isn't "disrespectful" to ship a homosexual couple. You're entitled to ship any couple you want, regardless of whether or not it is "canon" or "official." Hell, look at me, Shoe x Shelly forever.

You claim you have nothing against gays, but that entire post screams otherwise. :/
Author:  musouka [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 8:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Happiness Punch! wrote:
And think also about Takumi, does he like yaoi? If he doesn't and finds them offensive, then people should really learn a lesson and respect him.


If Takumi found BL so offensive, I highly doubt he would have granted an interview to a BL magazine. I think there is a certain--if relatively slight--degree of purposeful pandering to fangirls in the GS games. You don't have to like it, but I would be wary of assuming too quickly that those involved with the games share your disgust.
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:01 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
musouka wrote:
I think there is a certain--if relatively slight--degree of purposeful pandering to fangirls in the GS games.

Hahaha, awesome, someone else noticed that. Godot

And you can't overlook the T&A offered to male gamers through characters like Mia and April, either. There's a TON of fanservice, both for girls who enjoy guy-on-guy action, and guys who like big boobs. Sal
Author:  Chinese Infantry [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:04 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Naw, the guy-on-guy stuff is purely fan-created. *Looks at certain people*
Author:  Mrs. Edgeworth [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:05 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
musouka wrote:
Happiness Punch! wrote:
And think also about Takumi, does he like yaoi? If he doesn't and finds them offensive, then people should really learn a lesson and respect him.


If Takumi found BL so offensive, I highly doubt he would have granted an interview to a BL magazine. I think there is a certain--if relatively slight--degree of purposeful pandering to fangirls in the GS games. You don't have to like it, but I would be wary of assuming too quickly that those involved with the games share your disgust.

Hasn't Takumi stated that he thought Phoenix/Edgeworth and Phoenix/Maya were going to happen in the fandom? I don't remember where I saw it, but I'm sure someone posted something along those lines.
Author:  Dr. Mancusio [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Jibo wrote:
(First let me say this is not an offense to gays of any kind, just an observation, I'm not trying to offend anyone.)

Am I the only one who noticed the amount of camp and/or gay characters?

Let's look that them by game:

GS1

Larry Butz; acts very emotional and friendly toward Nick in a bi way.
Red White; Has a naked statue of himself, wears a camp suit and has camp hair.

GS2

Richard Wellington; looks like a fashion model, Wellington <--- that smiley.
Franzika von Karma; doesn't like men (as stated), whips all genders, CFTFs drawings
Maximillion Galactica; refers to Phoenix as "sweetie", just look at him!!
Adrian Andrews; doesn't like the only men she knows proir the game, trusts women and... stuff, CFTFs drawings

I wasn't gonna include GS3 but Fat Gay Chef too.... I don't need to say anything.

So... corrections? Comments? Agree or disagree with anything?

....You honestly take that perception of them?
Beef
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Chinese Infantry wrote:
Naw, the guy-on-guy stuff is purely fan-created. *Looks at certain people*

It may not be in-your-face, but it is VERY easily inferred.

A lot of guy-on-guy relationships in games/anime are inferred to begin with (because there are very few openly homosexual characters, and when there are, they just aren't as interesting to ship, I guess). The whole Phoenix/Edgeworth dynamic can be considered fanservice because the creators made it so easy to find reasons to pair them up.
Author:  Raelle [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Chinese Infantry wrote:
Naw, the guy-on-guy stuff is purely fan-created. *Looks at certain people*

Well, considering there were jokes about P/E in the Naruhodo Gyakuten fanbook, I'd say the writers are at least aware of it. And no, that doesn't indicate canon - the context really isn't romantic - but again, there's at least awareness and good humor about it.
Author:  Jibo [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:11 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Dr. Mancusio wrote:
Jibo wrote:
(First let me say this is not an offense to gays of any kind, just an observation, I'm not trying to offend anyone.)

Am I the only one who noticed the amount of camp and/or gay characters?

Let's look that them by game:

GS1

Larry Butz; acts very emotional and friendly toward Nick in a bi way.
Red White; Has a naked statue of himself, wears a camp suit and has camp hair.

GS2

Richard Wellington; looks like a fashion model, Wellington <--- that smiley.
Franzika von Karma; doesn't like men (as stated), whips all genders, CFTFs drawings
Maximillion Galactica; refers to Phoenix as "sweetie", just look at him!!
Adrian Andrews; doesn't like the only men she knows proir the game, trusts women and... stuff, CFTFs drawings

I wasn't gonna include GS3 but Fat Gay Chef too.... I don't need to say anything.

So... corrections? Comments? Agree or disagree with anything?

....You honestly take that perception of them?
Beef
I considered that there is quite a possibility and wanted to know if anyone agreed. (I assume you were talking generally)
Author:  Riku [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Mrs. Edgeworth wrote:
Hasn't Takumi stated that he thought Phoenix/Edgeworth and Phoenix/Maya were going to happen in the fandom? I don't remember where I saw it, but I'm sure someone posted something along those lines.

If you ask me, he doesn't support one or the other - he just accepts the inevitability that there will be relationships of every sexuality in any fandom... regardless of whether or not the creators intended for it to be there.

Smart man. Edgy
Author:  Apeman1813 [ Wed Mar 28, 2007 9:13 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Anyone notice the amount of camp/gay PW characters?
Jibo wrote:
Apeman1813 wrote:
Jibo wrote:
Phoenix said it was and it looked a lot like him. Gay is liking the same gender as yourself and having something NAKED that's of yourself is gay. Hobohodo

It makes you gay if like yourself, but emo if you don't??? WTF, I MUST BE GAY THEN
In a sexual way! (Nude self come on!) Geebuz some people need it spelled out for them.

So if you're comfortable with your body and you want a statue of it so other people can admire your "splendiferous pectoriorials," that makes you gay? Even if your intentions are to get ladies to see your body?

If he got the statue for himself, but I'm not sure that would qualify as gay rather than a plot device showing he has a really big ego.

And even if it's not a statue of himself, it does look rather impressive.

Now, if he were to be looking at the statue and fondling himself or bad touching the statue, THEN WE CAN SAY HE'S GAY AS YOU WOULD LIKE HIM TO BE.


Seriously, this statue thing has got to be one of the studpidest reasons to call him gay, what about his "vocabulary" if anything.
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