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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title
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Bad Player wrote:
Are you saying you forgot what happened when I played Scapegoat already? ;)

You mean you have another 3000-word essay planned for Haunted? :keiko:
Just kidding, I always appreciate huge reviews.
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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title
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I have another problem problem, which I think, regards the game's script.
Spoiler:
Image
-I keep getting these messages as the one you can see in the left picture.
-Also, some of the evidence pictures are white, as you can see in the middle picture.
-And my last problem is that I can't read the bellboy's affidavit (as can be seen in the right picture) nor any other evidence I got after that one, like the bullet holes, the statue or the elevator.

I hope I didn't do anything wrong, and I certainly hope I don't have to start all over again.
BTW, I am at the second trial-part in the game. Just started questioning Maris.
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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title
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TvS wrote:
I have another problem problem, which I think, regards the game's script.
Spoiler:
Image
-I keep getting these messages as the one you can see in the left picture.
-Also, some of the evidence pictures are white, as you can see in the middle picture.
-And my last problem is that I can't read the bellboy's affidavit (as can be seen in the right picture) nor any other evidence I got after that one, like the bullet holes, the statue or the elevator.

I hope I didn't do anything wrong, and I certainly hope I don't have to start all over again.
BTW, I am at the second trial-part in the game. Just started questioning Maris.

The Penalty-Threat Problem
Are you running the latest version of PyWright (0.9861)? You may be running an older version that doesn't support the "penalty threat" codes. It's recommended to run the latest version for newer commands.

The Missing Evidence Problem
1: Did you replace ALL files and folders in the "PW - Contempt of Court" folder? Keep in mind that you need Turnabout Scapegoat already installed for Haunted to work correctly.
2: It may be something to do with the evidence.txt file. I know you don't want to start the game over, but sometimes starting a New Game "corrects" the evidence problem. You could try it out.
Spoiler:
In intro.txt, try adding the line "addev bellaffidavit" and then start a new game. See if you can read the affidavit now.

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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title
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Looking back in the thread a bit, what was the intended theme for the ghost hunter?
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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title
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Bad Player wrote:
Looking back in the thread a bit, what was the intended theme for the ghost hunter?

I didn't have one. I tried looking, but in the end I just settled with the Eccentric theme.
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Spoiler: stuck in investigation 2...
Got the strange key, and noticed room 106 doesn't exist. I imagine I'm supposed to somehow gain access to it, but... what do I do? ^^' The only person I can talk to is Maris.

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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title
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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler: stuck in investigation 2...
Got the strange key, and noticed room 106 doesn't exist. I imagine I'm supposed to somehow gain access to it, but... what do I do? ^^' The only person I can talk to is Maris.

Spoiler: Hint
There's something in the garden that contradicts the fact that Room 106 doesn't exist.

Spoiler: Answer
In the garden, examine the big first-floor window.

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Got it. Thanks for the quick reply :)
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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title
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Bad Player wrote:
Got it. Thanks for the quick reply :)

Lol you're welcome, I just happened to refresh in the same minute you sent it xD
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Unfortunately it's not quite as long as what I did for Scapegoat, but...

Spoiler: space saver
Here we gooooooooo~ Expect typos

That last sfx in the intro… Was that from the GK2-2 intro? I forget…

Interesting background o.O

You want a break? Well the cameras are on, so tough luck, Nick!

He doesn’t remember it being this far away? He’s been there before? O.o

Lolrain

Spooooookyyyyyyy~

April 1, eh…? Wonder what sort of pranks there will be :3

Your sprites always amaze, Cardy *_*

Her voice blips remind me of Animal Crossing :3

The hotel is all the way out here because that’s where the building was built, silly :P

What the…?! We’re staying in a hotel, and it’s NOT Room 215?! What kind of blasphemy is this?!

Don’t go to the first floor. It’s haaaaaunteeeeed~

“Up there”? I thought it was the ground floor xD

Zomg, I knew the hotel would be haunted! …And it DEFINITELY was because I’m so awesome, not b/c it’s in the title or anything!

Ghosts? Where’s Maya when you need her? :P

I want Maris’s profile alreadyyyyyyyyyy

Whenever I examine stuff, if I use the arrow keys to move, I get an error message… (but if I click through it, it works fine)

“is stood”? I didn’t know you could use it in the passive that way xD

The sofa looks moar hot pink to me…

Wait…………….. EUROPEAN FLOORING SYSTEM?! WHAT!?!?!?! …I give the case a 3/10.

A shadowwwwwwwww, oooooooooh

He’s goooone, spoooookyyyyyyy

Well, this isn’t the room from the intro. That’s a good sign :3 It looks kinda familiar though… what’s it from? (…Although I could just recognize it from looking through the giant background zip xD)

I think Nick might’ve said “hailway”…

How did they disappear? They took a step to the right, silly :P

And here we go…

Was Maris wearing gloves before…? I happened to randomly make a save in the middle of her conversation… good thing too. And the answer is no, she wasn’t. Change blindness has nothing on me!

Darn it, Nick… I noticed the new gloves all by myself! Don’t point it out so quickly! T_T

This guy isn’t freaky in the slightest.

I already know this guy and his theme from Turnabout of Courage xD His theme song always reminds me of The Pink Panther…

“What happened to Snow?” Because only one detective can exist on earth at any given time :3

And so Maris Ruben was accused of murder… by a fake policeman because she was kinda quiet. Uh… ^^’

Also. Spriteeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees *_*

Greisen is a guest, Nick. Not very difficult :P

Also. Who died? xD

No reference to April’s Fools? Awwwww

The books are just for decoration? *sadface*

The elevator graphic is nice, but… I hope it doesn’t get too annoying ^^’

LOLAAI

“or something” xD

“Stan Nyph”? Hmmmmmm

Vertical trajectory, but direction unknown? Eh? O.o I guess either he was laying in bed, and his shooter shot horizontally, or he was standing up and… Ceiling Cat shot him? xD

C’mon, how long until I meet the character named “Ghost”? :P

…So now what do I do?!

Oh present Terry okay.

I’ve seen plenty of murders where a gun went missing, but I think this is the first time a gun appeared out of nowhere xD

It sounds like this info is new to Brisbane… Hasn’t he heard this from the other guests yet? ^^’

Nuuuuu, Nick! What about the disappearing figure? Ofc it HAS to be related. Yay genre-saviness!

Crime scene door is ajar? Well… I’m calling it quits for now here.

Back~ Sorry for the wait :P

What would a detective be doing at a crime scene? I can’t imagine!

What’s so odd about it being fully loaded? O.o (And why is the empty round on the bottom…?)

Fingerprints on the cup? Obviously contradiction is obvious :P

“Do they think I did it?” Why do you think you’re locked up? ^^’

Very convenient amnesia :P

When the background inverts for the psyche-lock, Maris is in front of the detention center…

C’mon, there’s only one reason I’d show you my attorney’s badge!

A psyche-lock over that? ^^’

GRAPHICSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS *_*

lolHotel Dusk summaries xD

Really, Maris? You think you have it in you to kill someone? ^^’

An hour after the crime? Wouldn’t it take an hour for Terry to drop Maris off at the police station? O.o

The speed lines go the wrong way when you object…

She grabbed the cup, and then put on gloves, Nick… Didn’t we already figure that out? ^^’ (But I guess it’s more for the sake of making Snow flustered, so :P)

Yes, Nick, she WAS seen wearing them… You saw them yourself, remember? :P

“suggestive” kinky
“And in a hotel of all places!” you’re doing this on purpose aren’t you? xD

“Harry”? You haven’t even met Larry! xD

Had to cheat to find out I’m supposed to say suicide >_> But the gun was found too far away from the body! D:

The suitcase doesn’t back up the suicide theory? D: (He didn’t bring any luggage or anything b/c he was planning on killing himself, and the briefcase is empty b/c the only thing in it is the gun.)

In Snow’s third testimony, there’s no ‘back’ button when you go to present evidence D:

Nick, I thought you already knew what the witness saw xD

A hotel with the Bellboy and a forbidden floor…? xD

Another cup of coffee? Weeeeird O.o

I can’t get more testimony about the magically disappearing coffee? -.-‘

That gun couldn’t make a noise that loud… Maybe they took the bullet so they wouldn’t realize that that gun wasn’t used?

Of COURSE you remember shooting someone? It just makes the mystery more exciting! :3

Hole in the floor? The murderer shot up from below! …Possibly through the hole, so that they could see the victim. (Funny thing is… I actually also had an idea for a murder that had the tape of the body cover up a hole xD)

“Morning light”? :P

SPRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITES *_*

I wonder why it didn’t detect the spiritual energy of the magatama…

So… when was the victim’s gun fired? O.o And if the murderer was on the first floor and shot the victim from below, what was the ghost doing in the room…?

No one else believes her that the victim attacked her? Who else has she told?

Oh we can go to the police department now? :o

No funny examine convo for the chief and blue badger? D:

Cedric wasn’t there… OR WAS HE?!?!?? *DUN DUN DUNNNNNNNN*

Is that… the elevator from MSAT? :o

“Ronald”…? O.o But the ghost’s name is…

Because every time there’s some horrible incident, they must always leave it in the same condition! xD

I bet the bellboy wants us to return it because Cedric set a trap that’ll kill the guy who took his book! :D

And why can’t you get your phone, Cedric? ^^’

Gunpowder…?

“Surrounded by officers”? I thought nobody was there…

Why won’t Nick do anything about the strange spot? …Oh there we go :3

Yay, in Room 106! Inb4nursery. So to get in, you need that key…? When did the bellboy say he took the diary again?

This reminds me of Again… xD

So the ghost was in the room… but I thought they were below? And why didn’t get they hurt from the bullet? O.o

Darn it, Nick! This is a goldmine! Why aren’t you adding anything to the court record!?!

…Lol, he used the word “goldmine” too xD

What the heck… At the police station, at the ‘examine/talk/move/present’ menu, if I click on ‘talk’, Snow’s sprite changes… O.o

Randomly stopped at the first floor on its own? I saw that coming xD

Whoa five O.o And finally a psyche-lock! xD

Wait, where’d the big distracting thing go? D:

Three witnesses? Well if we’re getting Maris first… I think we’re getting Cedric after…….. So Vick is the murderer? O.o

Why he didn’t hear the scream? Well, if Cedric was on the ground floor, the gun was fired from the first floor, and Maris was on the second floor… Maybe the gunshot was close enough for Cedric to hear but Maris was too far away for Cedric to hear? Now… how exactly do I present that? xD

Nuuuuuuuu that wasn’t it? D:

“jumping the gun” xD

Please let Maris’ fingerprints be on the pistol <3

…Or Vick. That works too, I guess. Makes it kinda easy, though >_>

Wait… Didn’t Vick check in after Nick? But wasn’t the gun gone when Nick arrived? *checks* Yes it was :o

I’m assuming he didn’t get interviewed b/c he wasn’t with the other guests b/c he had just committed the crime and then escaped. Except… the crime was committed in Room 106. If he’s the killer, then he should know where Room 106 is. So either he isn’t the killer, or he wasn’t looking for Room 106 yesterday…

Take out Brisbane’s eye! xD

Cosine won’t help you now, Barrows!

“Lying under oath is a serious offense” yeah right xD

Wait… Barrows only spoke with his client on the phone, but he’d recognize the client if he saw him? xD

His right ear felt funny…? But it looks like that earpiece is supposed to go in the left ear D:

So he got in through the window that night…? But what about the key… hm…

In a hospital?! O.o But… who brought him there…? :o

Aw, someone pointing a gun at someone else at the exact same time right near each other? You missed the opportunity for a great 1-5-like intro xD Oh wellz~

I wonder… Was the murder… an accident? Did it accidentally go off during the struggle? That would be… pretty crazy O.o

He thinks Barrows is trying to pin the blame on someone else? In other words, he admits Maris is innocent? :P

Nick, you think Barrows is more suspicious than Cedric? C’mon, he’s not the one who’s been inserting “Heh” into every other sentence recently ^^’

Epic music for a pretty simple contradiction xD

Ohohoho, THAT is the sprite post of a killer, good sir!

Oh he admits it :o

Zomg Presto? :o …It’s not very fast for a presto ^^’ (And no Bloody Tears? xD)

Why would a ghost hunter have an interest in Cedric…? Inb4 we find out the grandpa accidentally killed both twins

Lol, Nick is perceiving xD

Wait… How did that statue get in room 106 anyway? The only entrance is that window xD

I’m assuming Cedric wiped his fingerprints and planted Barrows’ while he was unconscious, but why didn’t he put them on the trigger? ^^’

Aw, I couldn’t point out that a gun pointing upwards probably wouldn’t recoil into his nose? Oh well

They won’t get Cedric b/c he doesn’t have a motive, but they’re going to get Barrows despite not having a motive either? …Well what do I care? It still means Maris is innocent~

Only one piece of evidence? Well, like when I’m always in a pinch… ATTORNEY’S BADGE GO!

Jeez, there’s so much evidence I’d like Cedric to clarify on! Picking just one is hard :x

“Elaborate” Please don’t ^^’ (I just finished playing Turnabout of Courage, soooooooooo)

He built it overnight?!?!? O_O H-How did he do the molding and stuff to match the rest of the wall…?

“my” witness, Brisbane? >_>

…How did the bullet get from Room 206 to Room 106?! .__.

Okay, so he took the bullet… But why leave it in Room 106? Why not keep it of himself, or bury it in the garden or something? ^^’

Hmm… What exactly stopped Maris’s bullet, though? ^^’

I like all the detail on these side-view graphics xD

Whoaaaaaaaaaaaaa that picture of the ‘ghost’ falling is niiiiiiiiiiiiiiice. How’d you do those speed lines? :o

Uh… How did Cedric know that the hat and coat had been shot? O.o

I… think I got all that xD What was that Arceus thing (or w/e it’s called) that he mentioned, though? O.o

I thought he was confessing everything… Why can’t he say what business it was? ^^’

ANOTHER smuggling ring? xD

Gloves = poison? Uh…

Yay, a Not Guilt verdict! :D

A secret organization behind everything that’s revealed at the very end? Reminds me of NYT xD

Yep, we were due for a Terry scene…

Oh, Nick presents the card on his own? :o (I mean, it was obvious, but… ^^’)

Two members in prison? Maplethorpe and who? :o

Showing two pictures at the same time?! Whoa, I think you just overloaded my brain!!

Ohai Baldy

That looks like… a cross between Souta and Naitou xD



Well… It’s overrrrrrr! Simultaneous ‘yay’ and ‘oh noezzzzzz’!!! So, let’s see... The crime and mystery were pretty good… although I usually tend to like premeditated crimes and such rather than fortunate coincidences. Although I suppose the main coincidence was hitting Nyph with the bullet; a lot of the mystery was created when Cedric covered it up. Tbh, I thought Scapegoat was a bit better, since it was longer (I think… it had the flashback trial) and I also felt a bit more ‘invested’ in the plot, since it involved canon characters and the background of your new main OCs. The court sections were a bit easy tbh, but I thought all the contradictions and stuff were good. (…except for proposing the obviously-wrong suicide theory >_>) We found out in the end that this case IS tied to the overarching plot (which I like :3) but during the actual case it felt filler-y. The music was good and fitting. The writing were solid. All the graphics were absolutely fantastic. (*is very jealous*)

Can’t wait for episode 3!!~

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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title
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Spoiler:
Still I don't understand the meaning of room 106. Why are there so many toys if this room only a storage for fakes? Nostalgia?

It's now or never!
Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title
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Klon wrote:
Spoiler:
Still I don't understand the meaning of room 106. Why are there so many toys if this room only a storage for fakes? Nostalgia?

Spoiler:
It's the house's old nursery, where Cedric's grandfather shot himself. You'd recognise the images from the flashbacks when the Bellboy was telling the story of what happened.

And BadPlayer... I'll get round to reading it when I come back from uni. ;)

EDIT: Responses to BadPlayer's comments and whatnot:
Spoiler:
Here we gooooooooo~ Expect typos
I'll try not to point any out... :lana:

That last sfx in the intro… Was that from the GK2-2 intro? I forget…
Yep!

Interesting background o.O

You want a break? Well the cameras are on, so tough luck, Nick!

He doesn’t remember it being this far away? He’s been there before? O.o
Referring to the brochure :P

Lolrain

Spooooookyyyyyyy~

April 1, eh…? Wonder what sort of pranks there will be :3

Your sprites always amaze, Cardy *_*
-_Q

Her voice blips remind me of Animal Crossing :3

The hotel is all the way out here because that’s where the building was built, silly :P

What the…?! We’re staying in a hotel, and it’s NOT Room 215?! What kind of blasphemy is this?!
I had the urge. :gant:

Don’t go to the first floor. It’s haaaaaunteeeeed~

“Up there”? I thought it was the ground floor xD
You'll catch on seven comments later :P

Zomg, I knew the hotel would be haunted! …And it DEFINITELY was because I’m so awesome, not b/c it’s in the title or anything!
Old hotels MUST be haunted, it's the law... :gregory:

Ghosts? Where’s Maya when you need her? :P

I want Maris’s profile alreadyyyyyyyyyy

Whenever I examine stuff, if I use the arrow keys to move, I get an error message… (but if I click through it, it works fine)
I've no idea why it does that. Must be an update thing.

“is stood”? I didn’t know you could use it in the passive that way xD
It's correct... I think...

The sofa looks moar hot pink to me…

Wait…………….. EUROPEAN FLOORING SYSTEM?! WHAT!?!?!?! …I give the case a 3/10.
Bah, it's what I'm used to! :igarashi:
Even though I keep slipping into Americanised spelling in the case, but that's besides the point!
And P.S.: Told you. :keiko:


A shadowwwwwwwww, oooooooooh

He’s goooone, spoooookyyyyyyy

Well, this isn’t the room from the intro. That’s a good sign :3 It looks kinda familiar though… what’s it from? (…Although I could just recognize it from looking through the giant background zip xD)
The backgrounds zip, yes. It was a huge help when it came to making this case.

I think Nick might’ve said “hailway”…
...Really? :payne:

How did they disappear? They took a step to the right, silly :P

And here we go…

Was Maris wearing gloves before…? I happened to randomly make a save in the middle of her conversation… good thing too. And the answer is no, she wasn’t. Change blindness has nothing on me!

Darn it, Nick… I noticed the new gloves all by myself! Don’t point it out so quickly! T_T

This guy isn’t freaky in the slightest.

I already know this guy and his theme from Turnabout of Courage xD His theme song always reminds me of The Pink Panther…
Ohhh Blackrune's case? Yeah he asked me if he could use Greisen a few days ago. :gant:
And yeah, Pink-Panther-esque was what I was looking for. :)


“What happened to Snow?” Because only one detective can exist on earth at any given time :3
Lol of course!

And so Maris Ruben was accused of murder… by a fake policeman because she was kinda quiet. Uh… ^^’
There are reasons that you'll find out...

Also. Spriteeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeees *_*
Monacle face again. -_Q

Greisen is a guest, Nick. Not very difficult :P

Also. Who died? xD

No reference to April’s Fools? Awwwww
There is, but it's a bit later on.

The books are just for decoration? *sadface*

The elevator graphic is nice, but… I hope it doesn’t get too annoying ^^’

LOLAAI

“or something” xD

“Stan Nyph”? Hmmmmmm
Recognised the pun?

Vertical trajectory, but direction unknown? Eh? O.o I guess either he was laying in bed, and his shooter shot horizontally, or he was standing up and… Ceiling Cat shot him? xD

C’mon, how long until I meet the character named “Ghost”? :P

…So now what do I do?!

Oh present Terry okay.

I’ve seen plenty of murders where a gun went missing, but I think this is the first time a gun appeared out of nowhere xD

It sounds like this info is new to Brisbane… Hasn’t he heard this from the other guests yet? ^^’

Nuuuuu, Nick! What about the disappearing figure? Ofc it HAS to be related. Yay genre-saviness!

Crime scene door is ajar? Well… I’m calling it quits for now here.

Back~ Sorry for the wait :P

What would a detective be doing at a crime scene? I can’t imagine!

What’s so odd about it being fully loaded? O.o (And why is the empty round on the bottom…?)

Fingerprints on the cup? Obviously contradiction is obvious :P

“Do they think I did it?” Why do you think you’re locked up? ^^’

Very convenient amnesia :P
That's Ace Attorney for you ;)

When the background inverts for the psyche-lock, Maris is in front of the detention center…
I think it's happened before in the actual games but I'm not sure.

C’mon, there’s only one reason I’d show you my attorney’s badge!

A psyche-lock over that? ^^’

GRAPHICSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSSS *_*

lolHotel Dusk summaries xD

Really, Maris? You think you have it in you to kill someone? ^^’

An hour after the crime? Wouldn’t it take an hour for Terry to drop Maris off at the police station? O.o

The speed lines go the wrong way when you object…
I can't change that.
Oh wait of course I can, I can just flip the whole thing horizontally can't I? -_-


She grabbed the cup, and then put on gloves, Nick… Didn’t we already figure that out? ^^’ (But I guess it’s more for the sake of making Snow flustered, so :P)

Yes, Nick, she WAS seen wearing them… You saw them yourself, remember? :P

“suggestive” kinky
“And in a hotel of all places!” you’re doing this on purpose aren’t you? xD
What's that part?

“Harry”? You haven’t even met Larry! xD

Had to cheat to find out I’m supposed to say suicide >_> But the gun was found too far away from the body! D:
As Brisbane realises.

The suitcase doesn’t back up the suicide theory? D: (He didn’t bring any luggage or anything b/c he was planning on killing himself, and the briefcase is empty b/c the only thing in it is the gun.)

In Snow’s third testimony, there’s no ‘back’ button when you go to present evidence D:
I hate when that happens... :grey:

Nick, I thought you already knew what the witness saw xD

A hotel with the Bellboy and a forbidden floor…? xD
A hotel with a murder, it HAD to include the Bellboy. :gant:

Another cup of coffee? Weeeeird O.o

I can’t get more testimony about the magically disappearing coffee? -.-‘

That gun couldn’t make a noise that loud… Maybe they took the bullet so they wouldn’t realize that that gun wasn’t used?

Of COURSE you remember shooting someone? It just makes the mystery more exciting! :3

Hole in the floor? The murderer shot up from below! …Possibly through the hole, so that they could see the victim. (Funny thing is… I actually also had an idea for a murder that had the tape of the body cover up a hole xD)

“Morning light”? :P

SPRIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIITES *_*

I wonder why it didn’t detect the spiritual energy of the magatama…
It does... Have you actually presented it to him?

So… when was the victim’s gun fired? O.o And if the murderer was on the first floor and shot the victim from below, what was the ghost doing in the room…?

No one else believes her that the victim attacked her? Who else has she told?

Oh we can go to the police department now? :o

No funny examine convo for the chief and blue badger? D:
I got lazy when it came to the Examine script for the precinct... I thought I'd get round to it but I didn't.

Cedric wasn’t there… OR WAS HE?!?!?? *DUN DUN DUNNNNNNNN*

Is that… the elevator from MSAT? :o
The elevator from wha?! :eh?:

“Ronald”…? O.o But the ghost’s name is…
The ghost is the grandfather :P

Because every time there’s some horrible incident, they must always leave it in the same condition! xD

I bet the bellboy wants us to return it because Cedric set a trap that’ll kill the guy who took his book! :D
Haha no he's just a coward.

And why can’t you get your phone, Cedric? ^^’
Phoenix was closer...

Gunpowder…?

“Surrounded by officers”? I thought nobody was there…
Use your imagination ;)

Why won’t Nick do anything about the strange spot? …Oh there we go :3

Yay, in Room 106! Inb4nursery. So to get in, you need that key…? When did the bellboy say he took the diary again?

This reminds me of Again… xD

So the ghost was in the room… but I thought they were below? And why didn’t get they hurt from the bullet? O.o

Darn it, Nick! This is a goldmine! Why aren’t you adding anything to the court record!?!

…Lol, he used the word “goldmine” too xD

What the heck… At the police station, at the ‘examine/talk/move/present’ menu, if I click on ‘talk’, Snow’s sprite changes… O.o
:eh?:

Randomly stopped at the first floor on its own? I saw that coming xD

Whoa five O.o And finally a psyche-lock! xD
Shame I didn't elaborate on it... I just wanted to emphasise the lie he told. -_-

Wait, where’d the big distracting thing go? D:

Three witnesses? Well if we’re getting Maris first… I think we’re getting Cedric after…….. So Vick is the murderer? O.o

Why he didn’t hear the scream? Well, if Cedric was on the ground floor, the gun was fired from the first floor, and Maris was on the second floor… Maybe the gunshot was close enough for Cedric to hear but Maris was too far away for Cedric to hear? Now… how exactly do I present that? xD

Nuuuuuuuu that wasn’t it? D:
*Image*

“jumping the gun” xD

Please let Maris’ fingerprints be on the pistol <3

…Or Vick. That works too, I guess. Makes it kinda easy, though >_>

Wait… Didn’t Vick check in after Nick? But wasn’t the gun gone when Nick arrived? *checks* Yes it was :o

I’m assuming he didn’t get interviewed b/c he wasn’t with the other guests b/c he had just committed the crime and then escaped. Except… the crime was committed in Room 106. If he’s the killer, then he should know where Room 106 is. So either he isn’t the killer, or he wasn’t looking for Room 106 yesterday…

Take out Brisbane’s eye! xD

Cosine won’t help you now, Barrows!

“Lying under oath is a serious offense” yeah right xD
True xD

Wait… Barrows only spoke with his client on the phone, but he’d recognize the client if he saw him? xD

His right ear felt funny…? But it looks like that earpiece is supposed to go in the left ear D:

So he got in through the window that night…? But what about the key… hm…

In a hospital?! O.o But… who brought him there…? :o

Aw, someone pointing a gun at someone else at the exact same time right near each other? You missed the opportunity for a great 1-5-like intro xD Oh wellz~

I wonder… Was the murder… an accident? Did it accidentally go off during the struggle? That would be… pretty crazy O.o

He thinks Barrows is trying to pin the blame on someone else? In other words, he admits Maris is innocent? :P

Nick, you think Barrows is more suspicious than Cedric? C’mon, he’s not the one who’s been inserting “Heh” into every other sentence recently ^^’

Epic music for a pretty simple contradiction xD

Ohohoho, THAT is the sprite post of a killer, good sir!
Lol the hunched-with-crossed-arms one?

Oh he admits it :o

Zomg Presto? :o …It’s not very fast for a presto ^^’ (And no Bloody Tears? xD)

Why would a ghost hunter have an interest in Cedric…? Inb4 we find out the grandpa accidentally killed both twins
One of them. The other is Cedric, who is alive.

Lol, Nick is perceiving xD

Wait… How did that statue get in room 106 anyway? The only entrance is that window xD

I’m assuming Cedric wiped his fingerprints and planted Barrows’ while he was unconscious, but why didn’t he put them on the trigger? ^^’

Aw, I couldn’t point out that a gun pointing upwards probably wouldn’t recoil into his nose? Oh well

They won’t get Cedric b/c he doesn’t have a motive, but they’re going to get Barrows despite not having a motive either? …Well what do I care? It still means Maris is innocent~

Only one piece of evidence? Well, like when I’m always in a pinch… ATTORNEY’S BADGE GO!

Jeez, there’s so much evidence I’d like Cedric to clarify on! Picking just one is hard :x

“Elaborate” Please don’t ^^’ (I just finished playing Turnabout of Courage, soooooooooo)

He built it overnight?!?!? O_O H-How did he do the molding and stuff to match the rest of the wall…?
Magiiiiiic! :minuki:

“my” witness, Brisbane? >_>
?!

…How did the bullet get from Room 206 to Room 106?! .__.

Okay, so he took the bullet… But why leave it in Room 106? Why not keep it of himself, or bury it in the garden or something? ^^’
Bury it in the garden... Not a bad idea actually. And Phoenix could've stumbled upon it. Somehow.

Hmm… What exactly stopped Maris’s bullet, though? ^^’

I like all the detail on these side-view graphics xD
Despite it consists of silhouettes? :P

Whoaaaaaaaaaaaaa that picture of the ‘ghost’ falling is niiiiiiiiiiiiiiice. How’d you do those speed lines? :o
The zoom lines thing I found on Google Images, I then just faded it into the image.

Uh… How did Cedric know that the hat and coat had been shot? O.o
He saw it on the floor and found the bullet within the coat.

I… think I got all that xD What was that Arceus thing (or w/e it’s called) that he mentioned, though? O.o
Aha yeah, it was a lot to explain in one go but I couldn't find any other way to space it out. Like I said, I got stressed a lot with this case. xD
Aculeus is the newly reformed smuggling ring once led by Quercus Alba, but it was picked up again by a new leader (as foretold in AAI).


I thought he was confessing everything… Why can’t he say what business it was? ^^’
Because it would be very bad for him...

ANOTHER smuggling ring? xD
It's the same one, but under "new management" so to speak.

Gloves = poison? Uh…
It was meant to be like: so she didn't get any on her hands while supposedly putting it in his coffee.

Yay, a Not Guilt verdict! :D

A secret organization behind everything that’s revealed at the very end? Reminds me of NYT xD

Yep, we were due for a Terry scene…

Oh, Nick presents the card on his own? :o (I mean, it was obvious, but… ^^’)
Yeah I thought a Present moment would've been pointless xD

Two members in prison? Maplethorpe and who? :o
Whoever was watching him through the bars in the very last scene...

Showing two pictures at the same time?! Whoa, I think you just overloaded my brain!!
Impressed, aren't you? -_Q

Ohai Baldy
Baldy? Who? If you mean the guy on the bed, that's Maplethorpe and his orange hair.

That looks like… a cross between Souta and Naitou xD
Who does? :S


Well… It’s overrrrrrr! Simultaneous ‘yay’ and ‘oh noezzzzzz’!!! So, let’s see... The crime and mystery were pretty good… although I usually tend to like premeditated crimes and such rather than fortunate coincidences. Although I suppose the main coincidence was hitting Nyph with the bullet; a lot of the mystery was created when Cedric covered it up. Tbh, I thought Scapegoat was a bit better, since it was longer (I think… it had the flashback trial) and I also felt a bit more ‘invested’ in the plot, since it involved canon characters and the background of your new main OCs. The court sections were a bit easy tbh, but I thought all the contradictions and stuff were good. (…except for proposing the obviously-wrong suicide theory >_>) We found out in the end that this case IS tied to the overarching plot (which I like :3) but during the actual case it felt filler-y. The music was good and fitting. The writing were solid. All the graphics were absolutely fantastic. (*is very jealous*)

Can’t wait for episode 3!!~

Thanks for playing, I'm glad this case held up due to my initial worries when I first released it. :D
I tried to make it as mysterious as possible, in an almost creepy sort of way. (C'mon, children's toys are ALWAYS creepy xD)
It's true I ended up with the odd contradiction, but this was a really difficult plot for me to try and pull off. Unlike Scapegoat which was ad-libbed, this was my first planned case. Much harder than I thought too. :S
I've been planning Case 3 in my head for a while (the main antagonist being the only part I've truly worked on, and Ping' being the only one who knows who it is ;)) but it's still a bit of a mess at the moment.
Sneaky fact: It involves THREE victims! (Two being murder victims, the other being badly wounded but alive)
Thanks again for sharing your thoughts, I always look forward to long reviews and to see what people are thinking while playing it! Glad you enjoyed it! :keiko:


EDIT 2: LPTheGabriel has made a walkthrough of Scapegoat:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5RYfrcydsVY
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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title

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Hello, I just finished both cases and they were great!
Specially
Spoiler:
The plot twists, how everything is connected,the past references, I never thought I'd see Quercus Alba again

I 'd like to make a request: Can you please tell me wich Cornered theme plays in the court?
Thank you for your fantastic games!
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risingphoenix wrote:
Hello, I just finished both cases and they were great!
Specially
Spoiler:
The plot twists, how everything is connected,the past references, I never thought I'd see Quercus Alba again

I 'd like to make a request: Can you please tell me wich Cornered theme plays in the court?
Thank you for your fantastic games!

Thanks, glad you liked them! :garyuu:
Spoiler: Scapegoat and Haunted spoilers
Redd White and Quercus Alba are two of my favourite villains from the series, I wanted to include them and elaborate on them more in the game. Redd White blackmailing Vex Vulper, Alba's crime ring being picked up by a new leader as foretold in AAI.

The cornered theme I used in the game is a Cadenza remix of the first game's cornered theme.
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So, uh... any other favorite villains?
*is definitely not trying to fish for plot threads from case 3*
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Bad Player wrote:
So, uh... any other favorite villains?
*is definitely not trying to fish for plot threads from case 3*

...
Spoiler:
None that'll be included in Case 3. ;)
I already have the villain (or villains?) planned out.

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Cardiovore wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
So, uh... any other favorite villains?
*is definitely not trying to fish for plot threads from case 3*

...
Spoiler:
None that'll be included in Case 3. ;)
I already have the villain (or villains?) planned out.

Maybe Damont Gant? :phoenix:
It's now or never!
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Thank you very much Cardiovore for the music!

I'm looking forward for the next case :phoenix:
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I'm made of dumb and can't get it to work halp.

EDIT: Nudal helped me out and it's working now, yay! But for anyone who has the problem in the future, this is how you do it:

Go to PyWright, games, PW - The Contempt of Court, The Haunted Turnabout, intro, erase what's there and replace it with:

set _textbox_wrap false
set _textbox_lines 3
include evidence
set _allow_click_save false
set _allow_click_load false
set _menu_fade_level 0

script scene1

And then it should work.

EDIT2: Right so, for whatever reason, the new PyWright absolutely refuses to save anything ever. So whenever I die I have to start from the beginning. Of the entire case. .___________.

EDIT3: Unlessssss I cheat and change the starting scene. ^_^

EDIT4: ...ok damn that doesn't work either because I don't get any of the evidence. <___________________________<

EDIT5: OK! I just went in and manually added all of it in. At least, I hope I did. MEH.

EDIT6: Ok, this kind of made me angry...

Spoiler: Haunted
In Snow's third testimony, when asked if you have any proof that Nyph had intent to kill Maris, wouldn't the coffee be sufficient proof? I mean, it was cold. He didn't drink a sip of it. Which would imply that he didn't order coffee for the purpose of ordering the coffee, but rather to get Maris up there.


EDIT7: ...WUT. Ok so when I was pressing one of the statements in Snow's testimony, I went to the Court Record... and I couldn't get out of it. So I had to restart. ._.

EDIT8: NGHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO I FORGOT TO ADD THE SHIELD D:

EDIT9:
Spoiler:
You used Pitch Black Intrusion. I LOVE YOU


EDIT10: Finished. Will go into detailed thoughts tomorrow maybe.
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Gumpei wrote:
I'm made of dumb and can't get it to work halp.

EDIT: Nudal helped me out and it's working now, yay! But for anyone who has the problem in the future, this is how you do it:

Go to PyWright, games, PW - The Contempt of Court, The Haunted Turnabout, intro, erase what's there and replace it with:

set _textbox_wrap false
set _textbox_lines 3
include evidence
set _allow_click_save false
set _allow_click_load false
set _menu_fade_level 0

script scene1

And then it should work.

EDIT2: Right so, for whatever reason, the new PyWright absolutely refuses to save anything ever. So whenever I die I have to start from the beginning. Of the entire case. .___________.

EDIT3: Unlessssss I cheat and change the starting scene. ^_^

EDIT4: ...ok damn that doesn't work either because I don't get any of the evidence. <___________________________<

EDIT5: OK! I just went in and manually added all of it in. At least, I hope I did. MEH.

What was the problem? I've never heard of an error like that before. :eh?:
I'm sorry it wasn't working for you regardless.

Gumpei wrote:
EDIT6: Ok, this kind of made me angry...

Spoiler: Haunted
In Snow's third testimony, when asked if you have any proof that Nyph had intent to kill Maris, wouldn't the coffee be sufficient proof? I mean, it was cold. He didn't drink a sip of it. Which would imply that he didn't order coffee for the purpose of ordering the coffee, but rather to get Maris up there.

... *breakdown*
There's always the occasional contradiction or simpler way things could have gone... Unavoidable. :sadshoe:

Gumpei wrote:
EDIT7: ...WUT. Ok so when I was pressing one of the statements in Snow's testimony, I went to the Court Record... and I couldn't get out of it. So I had to restart. ._.

No matter how hard I try to eliminate all errors and bugs, there will always be at least one I overlooked. -_-

Gumpei wrote:
EDIT9:
Spoiler:
You used Pitch Black Intrusion. I LOVE YOU

Spoiler:
I just thought it was a good "final confrontation" theme for Cedric. He's been likened to a vampire before (the character I based his appearance on IS a vampire, funnily enough) and with that extra thought about a Castlevania track... :gant:


Gumpei wrote:
EDIT10: Finished. Will go into detailed thoughts tomorrow maybe.

Looking forward to them. :jake:
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Re: PW:CoC - Case 2: The Haunted Turnabout, full ver. availaTopic%20Title

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I'm stuck in case 2, nearly at the beginning:
Spoiler:
In the first time at the detention centre i have to break the psyche locks of Maris. At first I shown the coffe and said that she used gloves about service, thus i broke the first lock. But I'm stuck in breaking the second, beacuse i tried nearly everything in the record and didn't work. What I have to show?
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Nyan wrote:
I'm stuck in case 2, nearly at the beginning:
Spoiler:
In the first time at the detention centre i have to break the psyche locks of Maris. At first I shown the coffe and said that she used gloves about service, thus i broke the first lock. But I'm stuck in breaking the second, beacuse i tried nearly everything in the record and didn't work. What I have to show?

Spoiler:
Go back to the hotel and use the elevator to find it doesn't work, so Phoenix uses the stairs. There's something in the stairs that needs to be examined and added to the Court Record. Present that at the second lock.

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Awesome, Case 2. I played the first investigation already. Here are a few random thoughts:

Spoiler: Investigation 1
  • As soon as I entered the lobby and saw the gun on the wall, I knew it would literally be a Chekhov's Gun. I don't know if it's the murder weapon yet, but it's not on the wall anymore, so yeah.
  • When Maya called me, her picture was missing during two lines of dialogue, and there was a little white box there instead. I'm not sure why, because everything else from Case 1 like the badge and Maya's profile work perfectly, so I must've installed it correctly.
  • During the opening cutscene, there was a picture of a "ghost" standing at the window. The "ghost" was "wearing" a hat. At the crime scene, there's a coat stand lying on the floor at that exact spot. I'll just assume that the ghost is a coat stand.
  • If I had to guess who the murderer was, I'd say it was Cedric Maplethorpe.
  • I like the use of AAI sprites. All the sprites look very good. Backgrounds too. Good job as usual!
  • I need suggestions for other great fancases for when I'm done with this one. I already played Turnabout Substitution and Scapegoat. (And I actually liked Scapegoat more.)
  • I just love Detective Snow. Maybe even as much as Gumshoe. They are quite different, but I just want to be friends with both of them. He's just a cool guy.
  • Phoenix was very in-character. The dialogues in general seemed very Phoenix Wright - like. Well done!
  • I have a feeling that I'm not going to like this case as much as Scapegoat. WHERE'S VULPER CAN'T HE BE MY PARTNER IN THIS CASE OR SOMETHING
  • I will play the Trial in a few minutes because this is fun.


I will be back after I played the first trial.
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Pixlking wrote:
I need suggestions for other great fancases for when I'm done with this one. I already played Turnabout Substitution and Scapegoat. (And I actually liked Scapegoat more.)

You should probably check out AAO. TSub, TScape, and Haunted are the 'big 3' of PyWright games, I think
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nyannyannyan

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Cardiovore wrote:
Nyan wrote:
I'm stuck in case 2, nearly at the beginning:
Spoiler:
In the first time at the detention centre i have to break the psyche locks of Maris. At first I shown the coffe and said that she used gloves about service, thus i broke the first lock. But I'm stuck in breaking the second, beacuse i tried nearly everything in the record and didn't work. What I have to show?

Spoiler:
Go back to the hotel and use the elevator to find it doesn't work, so Phoenix uses the stairs. There's something in the stairs that needs to be examined and added to the Court Record. Present that at the second lock.

Thank you very much!
Spoiler:
I looked already on the stairs but I didn't notice the blood stain on the rail!
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Okay, I played half of the first trial and I gotta say: I thought it was kinda stupid. Here's why.

Spoiler: Second Case, First Trial
The thought of suicide crossed my mind, but I dismissed it because of the location of the gun and the fact that he ordered coffee before he died. How was I supposed to know I had to be wrong for once and wait for the prosecution to correct me? Also, suggesting suicide should have been possible right at the beginning when he said that "nobody else was in the room and it had to be her". But no, I had to present meaningless evidence, then wait for the prosecution to correct me, then suggest suicide and then wait for them to correct me again. Even Phoenix was like "oh also why was it fully loaded derp".

And I still don't get how "there were prints on the plate so she couldn't have been wearing gloves" was a contradiction. She WAS wearing gloves. That's a fact and even Phoenix saw it.


And here are some other thoughts:

Spoiler: Trial 1
  • It would be quite the twist if the bellboy was the killer and you made some awesome breakdown sprite for him.
  • The second half of the trial was great, but the whole suicide thing annoyed me.
  • I loved the little "Bellboy-was-Proto Badger-reference".
  • Damn, I really want to play AAI2 now.
  • Oh man, she remembers shooting someone? I bet she shot the "ghost" that was actually a coat stand. But wait, there would have been a bullet somewhere.
  • Maybe it was all a setup to make her think she shot someone?
  • This is going to be much shorter than Scapegoat, isn't it?


EDIT: And here's what I thought about the second investigation:

Spoiler: Second Case, Second Investigation
  • Damn, I don't know HOW you do it, but even the investigations are awesome, if not more awesome than the trials.
  • I loved Vick Burrows's sprite. Is he based on another PW sprite or did you make him from scratch? He looks really well done.
  • The bellboy story was really well done, and I just love the bellboy's personality. He's probably one of my favorite characters.
  • Also, this case is REALLY creepy.
  • I wonder if EVERYTHING in room 106 will have a meaning in some way or if there were some false leads in there.
  • ...I think my heart skipped a beat when the elevator stopped at floor one.
  • Whoever Vick was talking to, he and Vick must have been at the hotel some time ago, but Room 106 was probably still visible. They must be looking for something in there. Nobody even hired Vick as far as I know. He's just here to find something. (Something that they put there years ago?)
  • It's 1 a.m., but I really want to finish this case right now. It's just that great.
  • There's a coat and a hat in room 106? And the coat has a hole in it? Oh please tell me she shot the coat stand.
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Spoiler:
I can see how that part would come across as unnecessary and annoying. I had a really difficult time scripting this case, particularly the placement and timing of events. For the first trial loads of different scenarios didn't make the cut, much sillier than the suicide one too. :payne:
Quote:
I loved the little "Bellboy-was-Proto Badger-reference".

I occasionally make little cross-references to the other AA games to tie in with the timeline. :P
Quote:
Damn, I really want to play AAI2 now.

Wish I could. :sadshoe:
Quote:
This is going to be much shorter than Scapegoat, isn't it?

Yeah... I think the reason Scapegoat was longer was the flashback trial really. When I get round to Case 3 (*cough* IF *cough*) I want it to be the typically long grand finale of the game.
Quote:
Damn, I don't know HOW you do it, but even the investigations are awesome, if not more awesome than the trials.

Thanks! As frustrating as they are to script, I much prefer making investigations to trials. Coming up with all the filler dialogue for unimportant statements, making/finding contradictions, etc, seriously annoys/bores me.
Quote:
I loved Vick Burrows's sprite. Is he based on another PW sprite or did you make him from scratch? He looks really well done.

His sprite base was Luke Atmey. Seriously. His arm when gripping his cap was from scratch. His hands holding his "ghost-buster" are Valant Gramarye's.
Quote:
Also, this case is REALLY creepy.
...I think my heart skipped a beat when the elevator stopped at floor one.

Exactly what I was hoping to achieve. ^_^

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Cardiovore wrote:
(*cough* IF *cough*)

D:
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Bad Player wrote:
Cardiovore wrote:
(*cough* IF *cough*)

D:

Lol I'm not saying I WON'T make it, I'm saying I won't make it YET. ;)
I'm always jotting things down, playing scenes in my head and making the occasional sprite of a new character. No matter what I do, this game always creeps into my subconscious and gives me ideas for Case 3. This game has come too far for me to quit for good, I just don't have the time to properly work on it right now.
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Last edited by Mr. C on Mon Feb 13, 2012 5:06 pm, edited 2 times in total.
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Cardiovore wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
Cardiovore wrote:
(*cough* IF *cough*)

D:

Lol I'm not saying I WON'T make it, I'm saying I won't make it YET. ;)
I'm always jotting things down, playing scenes in my head and making the occasional sprite of a new character. No matter what I do, this game always creeps into my subconscious and gives me ideas for Case 3. This game has come too far for me to quit for good, I just don't have the time to properly work on it right now.

Oh, okay. I know you said that you were taking a break from CoC, and that's cool, but that 'if' made it sound like you might quit for good >_>
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Bad Player wrote:
Oh, okay. I know you said that you were taking a break from CoC, and that's cool, but that 'if' made it sound like you might quit for good >_>

Sorry for wording it that way. :pearl:
I mean god knows how long it'll be before it sees a release, but it's certainly not dead.
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Cardiovore wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
Oh, okay. I know you said that you were taking a break from CoC, and that's cool, but that 'if' made it sound like you might quit for good >_>

Sorry for wording it that way. :pearl:
I mean god knows how long it'll be before it sees a release, but it's certainly not dead.

...Phew. *Wipes sweat off forehead*
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Just something I did out of boredom, here's some official art of Vulper as he'll appear in Case 3. It was hand-drawn and coloured in Photoshop.
A minor complaint of mine is that he looks a bit squat due to not drawing his legs long enough. This won't matter in both case arts because they'll just feature his head/upper body. But I hope you like it regardless.

Yeah, Vulper wears converse now.
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Last edited by Mr. C on Fri Feb 17, 2012 8:21 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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I'm not sure why you put it in spoiler tags when it's your avatar :P
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Bad Player wrote:
I'm not sure why you put it in spoiler tags when it's your avatar :P

That was afterwards. Forgot to make the change...
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Hi, sorry to ask but can someone upload the second case to 4shared or dropbox? I connect via cellphone and I can't download files from rapidshare. :larry: Thx in advance.
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Xionix wrote:
Hi, sorry to ask but can someone upload the second case to 4shared or dropbox? I connect via cellphone and I can't download files from rapidshare. :larry: Thx in advance.

I might use dropbox if it's been unaffected by the megaupload incident.
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I've been a bit lax at updating the official downloads for games :( I updated the link to Contempt of Court on PyWright's official download server to the complete package containing turnabout scapegoat and haunted turnabout. The link again is: http://pywright.dawnsoft.org/updates3/games/PW%20-%20The%20Contempt%20of%20Court.zip, or download through PyWright itself.

Dropbox is great though and I doubt it will be affected by the megaupload thing. Dropbox is not run by crazy gangsters :P If anything will be next it will be rapidshare.
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saluk wrote:
I've been a bit lax at updating the official downloads for games :( I updated the link to Contempt of Court on PyWright's official download server to the complete package containing turnabout scapegoat and haunted turnabout. The link again is: http://pywright.dawnsoft.org/updates3/games/PW%20-%20The%20Contempt%20of%20Court.zip, or download through PyWright itself.

Dropbox is great though and I doubt it will be affected by the megaupload thing. Dropbox is not run by crazy gangsters :P If anything will be next it will be rapidshare.

There you are Xionix, the direct link to Case 2 :)
Thanks saluk, although the zip isn't the complete package; the Scapegoat part of the Haunted download only contains the script files and some images. Scapegoat initially installed is required.
Shame about Megaupload, it was where I originally uploaded my cases... Hope nothing happens to rapidshare. If it does, we still have the PyWright main site :)
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This zip should be the complete package. I already extracted everything together in the right place, so no extra installation should be required. Downloads from PyWright updater have to work from the interface alone with no extra steps required, so it had to be that way.
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