Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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Pierre wrote:
Hylian100 wrote:
Anyway, can we get past the whole "Serious fighter vs party game" attitude and get on to the real issue at hand...just what will Villager's Final Smash be?
Hmm summon Tom Nook and put all the other fights in horrible debt to him thus forcing them to retire from the fight to work to pay off his debt?
Nah, it'll be Resetti with a bursting-out-of-the-screen effect and yelling at you for Resetting the game, because he knows you'll do it cause his Final Smash is an Insta-KO.
C-A
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Luigi was different enough compared to Mario, though I'm kinda mixed on how much of a clone character he is really. He has a few unique moves compared to Mario, but not enough to warrant individuality in my opinion.
As for Lucas, I do feel he's quite different than Ness and is a character of his own. Really, the only similar moves they had were their PK Fire, Thunder, Starstorm, and Energy Absorb, and the first three were mixed up a bit. However, what separated Lucas for me were his smash attacks. He operated completely different than Ness to where he was his own character. This coming from a guy who was good at Lucas but sucked as Ness. They handle too differently for me.
Personally, I'm all for the exclusion of clone characters, but I'll accept it if it can be handled the way Lucas and Ness were. Their playstyles are too different to be deemed clone-worthy for my tastes. Also, I just glanced through some of the comments. Ike and Marth are clones? Really? To whoever said that, have you even played as those two characters? They're as different as Mario and Bowser, the only similarity is the blue hair, cape, and sword. Purely aesthetic.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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Emiko Gale wrote:
Am I the only one who doesn't see what's the big deal with "clone" characters?
Probably. Even Sakurai's said that he doesn't anymore clone characters in 4.
I'm all for more characters, but when they start playing the same as another character what's the point?
I wanted to play as Gannondorf. Not some slow version of Captain Falcon.
I'm Blak, and I have shit taste.
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Emiko Gale wrote:
Am I the only one who doesn't see what's the big deal with "clone" characters?
Well, what's the point of having a character that plays practically identically as another one? In certain cases and games, it might make sense* but in a fighting game, it's really not that fun to play a character, master him and then proceed to a next one or unlock a new one and see that it's basically the same character but the 'outer shell' is different.
* Dead or Alive has Kasumi and Hayate, both practitioners of the Mugen Tenshin style. They have similar move controls, but the way the moves... move... uh, get executed looks differently and, overall, the style is different. Tales of Symphonia has Kratos and Zelos, both learn the same techniques and the same magic spells, but the way they control in battle is different that you can still tell that they are, well, different. (I fight just fine with Kratos, but Zelos does too many pirouette-ish twists and turns while attacking, makes him feel slower to me)
Quote:
Honestly, I feel Melee had more useless clones than Brawl, but Brawl had them too, especially with the whole Fox characters and Ganondorf.
Ganondorf was in Melee as well and the moves were the same. I think... I currently have a screenshot of the Hyrule Temple from Melee in my head. As for saying Ike is a clone of Marth, I think I said that...? Maybe? They do play differently, but they still felt like the same character to me... or perhaps he was amongst my list of "I don't quite see why they put these characters in" list.
C-A
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And really, if they want to implement complete clone characters into Smash, why not just make them as alternate costumes for certain characters? Like Peach/Daisy or what not? It'd cut the initial roster down, yet in a way, you'd still have more playable characters. To me, this would be an effective way of making say both Fox and Falco available, but not necessarily having clone characters so to speak.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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And I'm with Blak on the reasons for disliking clone characters, Ganondorf could have a much more interesting moveset, given all his magical prowess, and skill with a blade. Things Captain Falcon is generally not known for.
As for who should be getting some love: Saki from Sin and Punishment, he only got Assist Trophy status last time, and with that laser sword/gun thing of his (and tendency to turn into a giant living mecha) he'd be a natural fit.
Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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dullahan1 wrote:
Ganondorf was in Melee as well. I was really hoping he would get a moveset change in Brawl, but to no avail. It's really insulting when you taunt with him and he brings out his sword. Why can't he use it in combat, I mean c'mon.
And really, if they want to implement complete clone characters into Smash, why not just make them as alternate costumes for certain characters? Like Peach/Daisy or what not? It'd cut the initial roster down, yet in a way, you'd still have more playable characters. To me, this would be an effective way of making say both Fox and Falco available, but not necessarily having clone characters so to speak.
And really, if they want to implement complete clone characters into Smash, why not just make them as alternate costumes for certain characters? Like Peach/Daisy or what not? It'd cut the initial roster down, yet in a way, you'd still have more playable characters. To me, this would be an effective way of making say both Fox and Falco available, but not necessarily having clone characters so to speak.
Peach does have an alternate costume that is Daisy I thought.
Though Lucas is WAAAY more of a clone than Luigi is. He has virtually identical special moves in execution and only his normals are really different. His PK Freeze is closer to a palette swap of PK Flash with slightly rejiggered stats. His moves still control in almost exactly the same way as Ness's and will be used in most of the same situations.
Luigi has his own unique Luigi Rocket special and his Luigi Tornado special. A unique final smash unlike Lucas and Ness AND his normals and specials are all functionally different.
Also unlike Mario, Luigi has a crawl there's no way Lucas is more 'individual' that Luigi.
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Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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Hylian100 wrote:
Anyway, we all know the real reason for including more characters: more hats for Kirby.
HATS FOR THE HAT GOD
HATS FOR THE HAT GOD
But... Kirby is low tier!
I'm Blak, and I have shit taste.
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Blak The Great wrote:
Hylian100 wrote:
Anyway, we all know the real reason for including more characters: more hats for Kirby.
HATS FOR THE HAT GOD
HATS FOR THE HAT GOD
But... Kirby is low tier!
Because they nerfed him from his own game to be fair.
Come now how many people come out alive from Kirby's stomach in his own games eh?
Bet Kirby is wondering what Blak tastes like about now.
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Pierre wrote:
Blak The Great wrote:
Hylian100 wrote:
Anyway, we all know the real reason for including more characters: more hats for Kirby.
HATS FOR THE HAT GOD
HATS FOR THE HAT GOD
But... Kirby is low tier!
Because they nerfed him from his own game to be fair.
Come now how many people come out alive from Kirby's stomach in his own games eh?
Bet Kirby is wondering what Blak tastes like about now.
He's waiting for you, Blak
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I'm Blak, and I have shit taste.
Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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Blak The Great wrote:
I'll just get triple S tier MetaKnight to protect me.
Oh yeah because he has such a good track record against Kirby in his own game series.
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Pierre wrote:
Blak The Great wrote:
I'll just get triple S tier MetaKnight to protect me.
Oh yeah because he has such a good track record against Kirby in his own game series.
It's okay, since this isn't a Kirby gaem.
I'm Blak, and I have shit taste.
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Pierre wrote:
dullahan1 wrote:
Ganondorf was in Melee as well. I was really hoping he would get a moveset change in Brawl, but to no avail. It's really insulting when you taunt with him and he brings out his sword. Why can't he use it in combat, I mean c'mon.
And really, if they want to implement complete clone characters into Smash, why not just make them as alternate costumes for certain characters? Like Peach/Daisy or what not? It'd cut the initial roster down, yet in a way, you'd still have more playable characters. To me, this would be an effective way of making say both Fox and Falco available, but not necessarily having clone characters so to speak.
And really, if they want to implement complete clone characters into Smash, why not just make them as alternate costumes for certain characters? Like Peach/Daisy or what not? It'd cut the initial roster down, yet in a way, you'd still have more playable characters. To me, this would be an effective way of making say both Fox and Falco available, but not necessarily having clone characters so to speak.
Peach does have an alternate costume that is Daisy I thought.
Though Lucas is WAAAY more of a clone than Luigi is. He has virtually identical special moves in execution and only his normals are really different. His PK Freeze is closer to a palette swap of PK Flash with slightly rejiggered stats. His moves still control in almost exactly the same way as Ness's and will be used in most of the same situations.
Luigi has his own unique Luigi Rocket special and his Luigi Tornado special. A unique final smash unlike Lucas and Ness AND his normals and specials are all functionally different.
Also unlike Mario, Luigi has a crawl there's no way Lucas is more 'individual' that Luigi.
For the Daisy/Peach thing, I was talking more along the lines of actual alternate character choices, not a Peach reskin with Daisy's colors.
As for the whole Lucas thing, as someone who mains Lucas, I highly disagree with you about Lucas being a virtual clone of Ness. Lucas handles so much differently than Ness. I admit that he shares PK Fire, which goes straight instead of an angle, PK Thunder, which controls more smooth, and PK Starstorm. But like I said earlier, his smash attacks set him so far apart from Ness. They're all completely 100% different than Ness's, and it's the main reason why I heavily prefer Lucas over Ness anyday.
Of course, I can argue the opposite point with Luigi. He has the Rocket, he has the Tornado, and he has a unique final smash and that crawl I guess. Aside from that though, what sets him apart from Mario? His basic attacks are pretty much initially the same as Mario's. Half of his specials are the same as Mario's as well. I just feel Lucas has a bit more going on for him solely for the purpose that his smash attacks offer much more versatility from Ness than Luigi's does from Mario's.
I'm not bashing Luigi by any means, the minor details that accompany him from Mario make me prefer him to Mario. I just feel that Lucas was more tweaked away from the clone status than Luigi, and it makes sense too since Luigi was initially just a carbon copy of Mario to begin with.
Honestly from a gameplay standpoint, I find it much easier to transition between Luigi and Mario than I do between Ness and Lucas which heavily sustains my opinion on why I feel Lucas isn't much of a clone character. Then again, when I play, I more heavily emphasize on doing smash attacks rather than specials, which is probably why I feel the way I do. If I played more with the special attacks, I'm sure I'd probably reevaluate my point to an extent.
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CatMuto wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Man...that looks dull...this actually makes me worried for KH3 (since that team worked on the battle system)
I feel the same
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BECOME A HAT SIMULATOR LIKE TF22222222222222222222?
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Granted, this is just crazy character thinking that'd never be implemented.
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Emiko Gale wrote:
Am I the only one who doesn't see what's the big deal with "clone" characters?
No. Everyone raves about Street Fighter, which has Ryu, Ken, Sagat, Sakura, Dan, Akuma, and probably a couple other similar characters, and Mortal Kombat literally has around 20 ninjas, but omg no colnz in smash broz gais fitign gaems r srs bzns
also SSB 4 needs Agent J and Fawful
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Franzise Deauxnim wrote:
Emiko Gale wrote:
Am I the only one who doesn't see what's the big deal with "clone" characters?
No. Everyone raves about Street Fighter, which has Ryu, Ken, Sagat, Sakura, Dan, Akuma, and probably a couple other similar characters, and Mortal Kombat literally has around 20 ninjas, but omg no colnz in smash broz gais fitign gaems r srs bzns
also SSB 4 needs Agent J and Fawful
This post is beautiful.
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First off, Snake. Two main reasons for this. One, we already have a third-party character in this one who is almost-entirely projectile-based. The other, of course, is that the story of Solid Snake is over now, and Konami wants to highlight Naked Snake's story specifically now, and I doubt they want to show him on Wii U, which seems like it can't support their new Fox Engine.
The second, to my dismay, is Mr. Game and Watch. All of the Villager's gameplay seems similar to Game & Watch's style, especially the fact that he's copied an incredibly specific ability of his: The ability to catch an opponent's attack, hold onto it, and throw it back at them when you choose to.
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PokerJoker811 wrote:
I can make a prediction right now on two characters who WON'T come back (Sakurai has said that he wants to keep a Brawl-sized roster, but no larger).
First off, Snake. Two main reasons for this. One, we already have a third-party character in this one who is almost-entirely projectile-based. The other, of course, is that the story of Solid Snake is over now, and Konami wants to highlight Naked Snake's story specifically now, and I doubt they want to show him on Wii U, which seems like it can't support their new Fox Engine.
The second, to my dismay, is Mr. Game and Watch. All of the Villager's gameplay seems similar to Game & Watch's style, especially the fact that he's copied an incredibly specific ability of his: The ability to catch an opponent's attack, hold onto it, and throw it back at them when you choose to.
First off, Snake. Two main reasons for this. One, we already have a third-party character in this one who is almost-entirely projectile-based. The other, of course, is that the story of Solid Snake is over now, and Konami wants to highlight Naked Snake's story specifically now, and I doubt they want to show him on Wii U, which seems like it can't support their new Fox Engine.
The second, to my dismay, is Mr. Game and Watch. All of the Villager's gameplay seems similar to Game & Watch's style, especially the fact that he's copied an incredibly specific ability of his: The ability to catch an opponent's attack, hold onto it, and throw it back at them when you choose to.
You don't think Villager is going to be a clone do you?
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Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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Franzise Deauxnim wrote:
Emiko Gale wrote:
Am I the only one who doesn't see what's the big deal with "clone" characters?
No. Everyone raves about Street Fighter, which has Ryu, Ken, Sagat, Sakura, Dan, Akuma, and probably a couple other similar characters, and Mortal Kombat literally has around 20 ninjas, but omg no colnz in smash broz gais fitign gaems r srs bzns
also SSB 4 needs Agent J and Fawful
Oh dear. You dun fucked up. Mortal Kombat had Scorpion, Sub-Zero, Noob Saibot, Smoke, Ermak, Reptile, Rain, and Cyrax and Sector before they became robots. Granted they were all ninjas, but each of them were radically different from each other.
I won't even touch that Street Fighter example you threw at me since I suck at the game.
Smash Clones are infamous for copying exact movesets with little variation. I'll use my Ganon example again. Is Ganon supposed to be a slower shittier version of Captain Falcon? Nope!
I'm Blak, and I have shit taste.
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Emiko Gale wrote:
This post is beautiful.
You're beautiful
Blak The Great wrote:
Oh dear. You dun fucked up. Mortal Kombat had Scorpion, Sub-Zero, Noob Saibot, Smoke, Ermak, Reptile, Rain, and Cyrax and Sector before they became robots. Granted they were all ninjas, but each of them were radically different from each other.
I won't even touch that Street Fighter example you threw at me since I suck at the game.
Smash Clones are infamous for copying exact movesets with little variation. I'll use my Ganon example again. Is Ganon supposed to be a slower shittier version of Captain Falcon? Nope!
I won't even touch that Street Fighter example you threw at me since I suck at the game.
Smash Clones are infamous for copying exact movesets with little variation. I'll use my Ganon example again. Is Ganon supposed to be a slower shittier version of Captain Falcon? Nope!
You forgot all the female ninjas.
So having a pile of characters that look the same is fine, but having two characters with similar moves is some kind of mortal sin? ok
Admittedly I'd be fine with Ganon getting a moveset overhaul, but I get the feeling he missed the chance for that in Brawl.
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Quote:
Konami wants to highlight Naked Snake's story specifically now
I just heard the word 'naked', what's going on here?
C-A
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Franzise Deauxnim wrote:
Blak The Great wrote:
Oh dear. You dun fucked up. Mortal Kombat had Scorpion, Sub-Zero, Noob Saibot, Smoke, Ermak, Reptile, Rain, and Cyrax and Sector before they became robots. Granted they were all ninjas, but each of them were radically different from each other.
I won't even touch that Street Fighter example you threw at me since I suck at the game.
Smash Clones are infamous for copying exact movesets with little variation. I'll use my Ganon example again. Is Ganon supposed to be a slower shittier version of Captain Falcon? Nope!
I won't even touch that Street Fighter example you threw at me since I suck at the game.
Smash Clones are infamous for copying exact movesets with little variation. I'll use my Ganon example again. Is Ganon supposed to be a slower shittier version of Captain Falcon? Nope!
You forgot all the female ninjas.
So having a pile of characters that look the same is fine, but having two characters with similar moves is some kind of mortal sin? ok
Admittedly I'd be fine with Ganon getting a moveset overhaul, but I get the feeling he missed the chance for that in Brawl.
Oh yeah. I forgot the boob ninjas.
Yes... yes it is. Why play a fighting game when a character has the same moveset as another? Plus, the Mortal Kombat ninjas don't even look similar to each other anymore, so you can't really use that example.
I'm Blak, and I have shit taste.
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Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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Hylian100 wrote:
Anyway, can we get past the whole "Serious fighter vs party game" attitude and get on to the real issue at hand...just what will Villager's Final Smash be?
The cutting-down-the-tree thing in the trailer looked pretty Final Smash-y to me.
And now to actually read this thread.
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I'm Blak, and I have shit taste.
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Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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Blak The Great wrote:
I'm going through withdraws. I really miss the Smash Dojo posts leading up to Brawl, and we haven't gotten any new info yet. Hopefully next week will fix that.
Yeah I loved the Smash Dojo, I kinda wish they just rebooted that site for information regarding the new game but yeah we'll just need to hold tight.
Though Franzise the Dojo for Brawl was pretty consistent for updates adding little trickles of information often so it might not be as long as you think.
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Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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CatMuto wrote:
Quote:
Konami wants to highlight Naked Snake's story specifically now
I just heard the word 'naked', what's going on here?
C-A
Naked Snake was the codename of the original Snake, who later became Big Boss.
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DoMaya wrote:
CatMuto wrote:
Quote:
Konami wants to highlight Naked Snake's story specifically now
I just heard the word 'naked', what's going on here?
C-A
Naked Snake was the codename of the original Snake, who later became Big Boss.
Given because he was going into a mission basically naked, no food and no real weapons, just had to procure things on site.
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Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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Re: Super Smash Bros. for Wii U/3DS
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Hylian100 wrote:
Naked Raiden, however...
Raiden? As in Mortal Kombat Raiden?
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