Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Guess there's no more point in hiding it:
I am an Esper. I know Doctor Nanjo is Zero. However, I cannot reveal this information. Implying or directly stating that I know this information, or revealing that I am forbidden from revealing it, would result in my immediate penalization.
Seeing as the game is over now, it's time for me to leave. Screw you guys, I'm outta here!
With that, Trace's body limped pitifully to the floor as the consciousness inside of it leapt upward. It flew through the walls of the large building, turning back just in time to see it become engulfed in a massive conflagration.
'Pretty fireworks...' "Trace" thought before being pulled back through the 3DS screen, on which the following was displayed:
- GAME OVER -
Jumpfight END
Result: TPK
Confirming return of user's consciousness... Done.
Terminating all open connections.
Locking memories... Complete.
Goodbye, Trace.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Using his forearms, Neptune tried to pull himself towards the exit. A calm hand placed on his shoulder, though.
"Don't exert yourself, friend. It's over." Jumpy said.
Neptune smiled at him, tears welling up at the corner of his eyes. He sat himself up and intertwined his fingers around Jumpy's. They expected this, they were facing it, and now they were embracing it.
Fire was engulfing the room. Across the area, he sees Nanjo, his ol' ally. Nanjo spits out some teeth and gives a smile at Neptune. Neptune nods his head up, the smallest show of respect his body can muster.
The ceiling cracked and collapsed, and then all Neptune knew was the void.
End or Beginning?
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All I could do now is wait for the status report on all the other players. I reopened the 3DS and left it sitting on the desk. The statistics ought to appear at any moment now.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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JesusMonroe wrote:
If you guys are telling the truth about your roles, then it would've been a lot easier if you guys just said so after I said I solved the game >.>
If this is your "Solution" then you clearly hadn't solved the game at all.
Also I already explained why I didn't unveil to you and I told you that Trace had already implied his Esper role to me.
You got the information you wanted.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Pierre wrote:
JesusMonroe wrote:
If you guys are telling the truth about your roles, then it would've been a lot easier if you guys just said so after I said I solved the game >.>
If this is your "Solution" then you clearly hadn't solved the game at all.
Also I already explained why I didn't unveil to you and I told you that Trace had already implied his Esper role to me.
You got the information you wanted.
No, I didn't. I honestly think the reason you and Slezak didn't tell me at the beginning was because you didn't understand
Regardless of your reasons, you can't deny the game would've turned out differently if you had just trusted me from the beginning
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And Pierre, if you had really trusted Slezak from the beginning with his implied suspicion of Nanjo, then you would've realized that your own role PM was wrong. So either you didn't realize it at the beginning or you never truly suspected Cold but kept acting like you thought he was Zero so you didn't seem like a bad guy
I thought you were Zero by the way, Pierre. According to my role of esper though.
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jumpfight5 wrote:
So either you didn't realize it at the beginning or you never truly suspected Cold but kept acting like you thought he was Zero so you didn't seem like a bad guy
It's this one
I never believed him when he was saying it, or at least got the feeling that he didn't fully believe it himself
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Also I CAN deny that things would've gone differently, because I DID trust you at the beginning.
So it looks like a bunch of people got this "Esper" role. I guess we'll find out who the real Zero is when our lovely host makes the write-up.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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jumpfight5 wrote:
Pierre/Slezak, you guys can't deny that any outcome where you one of you won would've been unfair to everyone else
And Pierre, if you had really trusted Slezak from the beginning with his implied suspicion of Nanjo, then you would've realized that your own role PM was wrong. So either you didn't realize it at the beginning or you never truly suspected Cold but kept acting like you thought he was Zero so you didn't seem like a bad guy
I thought you were Zero by the way, Pierre. According to my role of esper though.
And Pierre, if you had really trusted Slezak from the beginning with his implied suspicion of Nanjo, then you would've realized that your own role PM was wrong. So either you didn't realize it at the beginning or you never truly suspected Cold but kept acting like you thought he was Zero so you didn't seem like a bad guy
I thought you were Zero by the way, Pierre. According to my role of esper though.
I trusted Trace but I never did the whole "hey are you VANILLA *wink wink*"
All along throughout the whole game I was actually believing that the above method was TOO obvious and would be a violation resulting in punishment. So I never did that dance with Trace until recently. I trusted Trace because...well because I knew who Zero was and by Zero's choice of companions (you and JM) I thought his assistant was one of you.
Besides me and JM were discussing a theory where rather than the role pms being "wrong" that everybody had their own individual Zero and if they escaped with them they would lose. By killing Cold I just covered my bases. By killing Cold if the "Multiple Zero" theory panned out I'd be safe (and Giggles would be screwed by virtue of wasting his kill) or if the "PMs Lie" theory turned out to be true I could still keep working on uncovering the villains afterwards.
Also yeah one person winning is a bit unfair...but like I said there's a big bomb in the way and before that you and me could have given out points and still been able to leave. I'd say you killing everyone without any consultation except with your crazy partner who has no chance of escaping is the most unfair thing of all.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Pierre wrote:
Also yeah one person winning is a bit unfair...but like I said there's a big bomb in the way and before that you and me could have given out points and still been able to leave. I'd say you killing everyone without any consultation except with your crazy partner who has no chance of escaping is the most unfair thing of all.
It wouldn't have happened if Slezak just gave me the input device. Because he didn't, I had to fear the worst and take drastic measures
Not saying I don't blame Slezak for not trusting me and hindsight is 20/20 but....yeah
Look at it from our perspective and just say if you agree with this statement: everybody losing is better than Zero winning, right?
Anyway, I still had fun but it was just slow at some parts and I don't think we should've been flat out lied to in our role PMs
I hope everybody learned an important lesson: always all-betray the first round
(Kind of kidding but not kidding about that last statement. Seriously think about how much that could've helped)
Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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JesusMonroe wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Also yeah one person winning is a bit unfair...but like I said there's a big bomb in the way and before that you and me could have given out points and still been able to leave. I'd say you killing everyone without any consultation except with your crazy partner who has no chance of escaping is the most unfair thing of all.
It wouldn't have happened if Slezak just gave me the input device. Because he didn't, I had to fear the worst and take drastic measures
Not saying I don't blame Slezak for not trusting me and hindsight is 20/20 but....yeah
Look at it from our perspective and just say if you agree with this statement: everybody losing is better than Zero winning, right?
Anyway, I still had fun but it was just slow at some parts and I don't think we should've been flat out lied to in our role PMs
I hope everybody learned an important lesson: always all-betray the first round
(Kind of kidding but not kidding about that last statement. Seriously think about how much that could've helped)
Speaking of the first round...it's exactly what bothers me about you and Jumpy ending this game.
Basically early on in this game....JM lectured Ami on how martyring oneself was a terrible idea and against the spirit of the game.
Quote:
Ami
Losing is defined by "not-winning." You dying=you losing. In a real Nonary Game, you'd try to survive
Losing is defined by "not-winning." You dying=you losing. In a real Nonary Game, you'd try to survive
Or something along those lines.
Franzise later on confirmed your words:
Quote:
That's right! Don't go throwing your precious lives away!
Since things didn't go your way, you went ahead and screwed it up for everyone, possibly because you'd grown tired of the game and wanted answers sooner than later.
As a result: MAMA
MAMA knows best wrote:
I will always pursue the victory of my faction. I will not knowingly and/or willingly assist other factions, unless it does not interfere with my chances of victory. I will make no attempts, through any action or inaction, to knowingly hinder the efforts of others within my faction to achieve victory.
I will not, through any action or inaction, attempt to ruin the game's experience for others. I will not be arrogant in victory, nor contemptuous in defeat. I will be respectful toward all other players of any background and skill level.
I will not, through any action or inaction, attempt to ruin the game's experience for others. I will not be arrogant in victory, nor contemptuous in defeat. I will be respectful toward all other players of any background and skill level.
So yeah...I might be violating the second part of the MAMA I put in there but since this game has already wavered out of MAMA's control I think that's alright.
You actively chose to lose the game.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Pierre wrote:
Since things didn't go your way, you went ahead and screwed it up for everyone, possibly because you'd grown tired of the game and wanted answers sooner than later.
You actively chose to lose the game.
You actively chose to lose the game.
It's really just semantics
You can choose whether or not to believe me, but I honestly thought you or Slezak was Zero and I therefore had to make sure neither of you escaped. Like I said (again), there was no reason for me to think Slezak wouldn't just enter the passcode at PC so you could leave
I'll pose this again: it's better to have everybody lose than have Zero win if you're not Zero, right?
The MAMA rule that says "I will pursue the victory of my faction" is there to prevent players from trolling during a mafia game. For example, a townie confessing to be mafia would be violating MAMA. A mafia that's about to be lynched who names all his scumbuddies out of contempt is a violation of MAMA
Making it possible for jumpfight to escape so Zero could lose (when I was already definitely going to lose the game) is not a violation of MAMA. It can be construed that way but that's only if you follow the rule to the letter and not the spirit of it
And I don't want to sound mean here, but I'm gonna say it anyway: I think it's bullshit if you're trying to say that I wasn't trying to win the game. I was trying the entire game to win. I was trying harder than any other player at some points. Things got a little messed up Day 3 and I STILL TRIED TO WIN. I decided on the "kill everyone" plan because it was literally the only option left. I was pushed into a corner. You're acting like I thought, "Wah, nobody sided with me. I'm gonna kill everyone and ruin the game."
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"Everyone losing is better than Zero winning?" Seriously?
You messed up the spirit of the game and that is irredeemable. Enjoy your "victory," sore loser.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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JesusMonroe wrote:
Pierre wrote:
Since things didn't go your way, you went ahead and screwed it up for everyone, possibly because you'd grown tired of the game and wanted answers sooner than later.
You actively chose to lose the game.
You actively chose to lose the game.
It's really just semantics
You can choose whether or not to believe me, but I honestly thought you or Slezak was Zero and I therefore had to make sure neither of you escaped. Like I said (again), there was no reason for me to think Slezak wouldn't just enter the passcode at PC so you could leave
I'll pose this again: it's better to have everybody lose than have Zero win if you're not Zero, right?
The MAMA rule that says "I will pursue the victory of my faction" is there to prevent players from trolling during a mafia game. For example, a townie confessing to be mafia would be violating MAMA. A mafia that's about to be lynched who names all his scumbuddies out of contempt is a violation of MAMA
Making it possible for jumpfight to escape so Zero could lose (when I was already definitely going to lose the game) is not a violation of MAMA. It can be construed that way but that's only if you follow the rule to the letter and not the spirit of it
And I don't want to sound mean here, but I'm gonna say it anyway: I think it's bullshit if you're trying to say that I wasn't trying to win the game. I was trying the entire game to win. I was trying harder than any other player at some points. Things got a little messed up Day 3 and I STILL TRIED TO WIN. I decided on the "kill everyone" plan because it was literally the only option left. I was pushed into a corner. You're acting like I thought, "Wah, nobody sided with me. I'm gonna kill everyone and ruin the game."
Well it certainly seems like the latter. also "Everybody lose" is not greater than "Zero wins" like it was said at the start "Don't throw your lives away." like you tried to emphasise at the start when Ami was talking about how she'd be willing to sacrifice herself if it helped the town "It's not not the TOWN vs Zero it's you yourself you are looking out for."
You can pick a stance and stand by it. The Flash drive already proves there were more options as we have no idea what was on it, there was still two more rooms to search to get options. There is nothing to say that this was "literally" the only option left. In the end you opted for a rather out-of-character approach for you and adopted at "everyone against Zero" stance which doesn't correspond with your attitudes earlier which was more individualistic.
What's done is done now. You might have been trying to win the whole game, but if losing the game is the best outcome you can think of (and you are a smart fellow) while there's still other options on the field then yeah I think you'd have a severely warped idea on what constitutes "winning" the game.
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However, "taking drastic measures" to ensure a no-win situation is definitely something I'd consider breaking MAMA.
Well I don't know. It was Jumpfight who opened the door in the end, so maybe he's to blame for violating MAMA. I really don't know.
MAMA's been stretched to her limits here. I believe next time we really need to sit down and discuss a perhaps revised MAMA to account for situations in this new type of game. That's what playtesting is all about, after all.
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Pierre wrote:
Well it certainly seems like the latter. also "Everybody lose" is not greater than "Zero wins" like it was said at the start "Don't throw your lives away." like you tried to emphasise at the start when Ami was talking about how she'd be willing to sacrifice herself if it helped the town "It's not not the TOWN vs Zero it's you yourself you are looking out for."
You can pick a stance and stand by it. The Flash drive already proves there were more options as we have no idea what was on it, there was still two more rooms to search to get options. There is nothing to say that this was "literally" the only option left. In the end you opted for a rather out-of-character approach for you and adopted at "everyone against Zero" stance which doesn't correspond with your attitudes earlier which was more individualistic.
What's done is done now. You might have been trying to win the whole game, but if losing the game is the best outcome you can think of (and you are a smart fellow) while there's still other options on the field then yeah I think you'd have a severely warped idea on what constitutes "winning" the game.
You can pick a stance and stand by it. The Flash drive already proves there were more options as we have no idea what was on it, there was still two more rooms to search to get options. There is nothing to say that this was "literally" the only option left. In the end you opted for a rather out-of-character approach for you and adopted at "everyone against Zero" stance which doesn't correspond with your attitudes earlier which was more individualistic.
What's done is done now. You might have been trying to win the whole game, but if losing the game is the best outcome you can think of (and you are a smart fellow) while there's still other options on the field then yeah I think you'd have a severely warped idea on what constitutes "winning" the game.
I don't have to say the town if that's what bothers you, then. I decided that I'd rather lose than let Zero win. Jumpfight decided the same thing. Hell, we don't even know if that's what he decided. He could've thought Cold or Ami was the bomber for all we know. Ami being the bomber is a theory that was thrown around a lot, actually
Jumpfight ended the game before I even did anything with the flash drive. So, that's irrelevant
You can't tell me not to act in the interest of everyone but then also reprimand me for not consulting everyone before ending the game. Again, I can easily say that I was acting in my own self-interest and that ending the game was my own self-interest. I'm not saying I believe that but I'm saying you should pick a stance on me as well
Slezak wrote:
"Everyone losing is better than Zero winning?" Seriously?
How is this unreasonable?
And if you want to throw blame around, then I was 100% willing to consult with people about ending the game if I had the input device. You refused to give it to me, so any attempt of consultation on my part could've just resulted in you defusing the bomb
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I do agree that we need a revised MAMA, though. I don't think most MAMA rules can apply here because technically there isn't a single faction in the game if everybody's a team of one
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Quote:
I don't have to say the town if that's what bothers you, then. I decided that I'd rather lose than let Zero win. Jumpfight decided the same thing. Hell, we don't even know if that's what he decided. He could've thought Cold or Ami was the bomber for all we know. Ami being the bomber is a theory that was thrown around a lot, actually
Jumpfight ended the game before I even did anything with the flash drive. So, that's irrelevant
You can't tell me not to act in the interest of everyone but then also reprimand me for not consulting everyone before ending the game. Again, I can easily say that I was acting in my own self-interest and that ending the game was my own self-interest. I'm not saying I believe that but I'm saying you should pick a stance on me as well
Jumpfight ended the game before I even did anything with the flash drive. So, that's irrelevant
You can't tell me not to act in the interest of everyone but then also reprimand me for not consulting everyone before ending the game. Again, I can easily say that I was acting in my own self-interest and that ending the game was my own self-interest. I'm not saying I believe that but I'm saying you should pick a stance on me as well
Well you did enable him to escape by paralysing Giggles...judging by the fact you aren't mad at him for killing everyone I am making the assumption that it was either your idea or you were in support of it. Time will tell because I'm sure that confirmation can be found in the Quicktopic. Additionally you already described this as your "only option" so claiming it was all on Jumpfight for leaving so hastily? Well even if the flash drive hadn't shown up there were still two more rooms to search in the hope that something might turn up. The only danger you would have that would warrant such immediate action is me leaving, which as I'm not the bomber I wouldn't have and if I was the bomber then your actions would just appear spiteful.
Quote:
You can't tell me not to act in the interest of everyone but then also reprimand me for not consulting everyone before ending the game. Again, I can easily say that I was acting in my own self-interest and that ending the game was my own self-interest. I'm not saying I believe that but I'm saying you should pick a stance on me as well
Actually I can. I can tell you not to act in the interest of everyone, because you need to pursue a victory for yourself (or those you consider your 'faction'. The GM and yourself had defined this victory condition as not dying and surviving.
Then I can reprimand you for not consulting anyone before ending the game because your path was self-destructive to your own earlier victory condition and everyone else. No one benefited from this outcome, unless they were tired and wished the game to be over and done with.
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It's nobody's fault everyone lost the game. Hereafter, I won't try to throw blame onto anyone, and neither should you.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Slezak wrote:
It's nobody's fault everyone lost the game. Hereafter, I won't try to throw blame onto anyone, and neither should you.
Lets not be hasty now.
We can hardly say they set the bomb off by accident now after all, especially when we have people confessing it as the "only and preferable option to Zero winning."
I'm not really mad I'm just disappointed
I was quite enjoying the game and looked forward to seeing the finale beyond the last two rooms (plus I'll be damned if I wasn't leaving without ever getting an item)
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Regardless of who opened the door, setting off the bomb, whoever had that idea was pulling the equivalent of taking their ball and going home. They robbed everyone else of the game just because things weren't going their way.
Look, people have been on the edge of violating the rules this whole game. We've had to be warned TWICE in-thread.
I know I'm not one to talk because I bailed out on a game over at V-S just because there was an initial spat between two players which made me almost quit. However, I believe that my bailing out of the game did not change the enjoyment of the rest of the people playing.
JesusMonroe, I'm going to be straight with you here: I like you because you put on the first Nonary Game which got me interested in the Zero Escape series. However, I don't like your attitude, especially throughout this whole game.
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Pierre wrote:
Well you did enable him to escape by paralysing Giggles...judging by the fact you aren't mad at him for killing everyone I am making the assumption that it was either your idea or you were in support of it. Time will tell because I'm sure that confirmation can be found in the Quicktopic. Additionally you already described this as your "only option" so claiming it was all on Jumpfight for leaving so hastily? Well even if the flash drive hadn't shown up there were still two more rooms to search in the hope that something might turn up. The only danger you would have that would warrant such immediate action is me leaving, which as I'm not the bomber I wouldn't have and if I was the bomber then your actions would just appear spiteful.
I was gonna knock out Giggles anyway, as I said before
I was in support of the idea. And I'm not blaming jumpfight, but here's an example:
I tell you to kill yourself, Pierre. You decide to break your restriction and do so. Who broke MAMA? The person who told you to kill yourself or the person who killed himself?
But again, I'm not blaming jumpfight. I don't consider what happened to be a MAMA violation
The "two more rooms" thing could've been solved by the all-betray
Quote:
Actually I can. I can tell you not to act in the interest of everyone, because you need to pursue a victory for yourself (or those you consider your 'faction'. The GM and yourself had defined this victory condition as not dying and surviving.
Then I can reprimand you for not consulting anyone before ending the game because your path was self-destructive to your own earlier victory condition and everyone else. No one benefited from this outcome, unless they were tired and wished the game to be over and done with.
Then I can reprimand you for not consulting anyone before ending the game because your path was self-destructive to your own earlier victory condition and everyone else. No one benefited from this outcome, unless they were tired and wished the game to be over and done with.
For the record, I don't consider what I did to be a victory in any shape or form. I was gonna lose anyway, though, and figured it was best to at least ensure Zero didn't win. Since I believed you to be Zero, I didn't think I was ruining the game for anyone since they would've lost anyway
Slezak wrote:
In the end, you weren't leading the town, you were attempting to control the game to suit your interests. Look where that got you in the end: Blown up, just like everyone else.
Not true. I was fully committed to helping certain people escape. Had you and Pierre trusted me from the beginning, I would've been committed to you as well
Quote:
It's nobody's fault everyone lost the game. Hereafter, I won't try to throw blame onto anyone, and neither should you.
You literally said "Thanks for ruining the game, JM"
Pierre wrote:
We can hardly say they set the bomb off by accident now after all, especially when we have people confessing it as the "only and preferable option to Zero winning."
I'm not really mad I'm just disappointed I was quite enjoying the game and looked forward to seeing the finale beyond the last two rooms (plus I'll be damned if I wasn't leaving without ever getting an item)
I'm not really mad I'm just disappointed
I was quite enjoying the game and looked forward to seeing the finale beyond the last two rooms (plus I'll be damned if I wasn't leaving without ever getting an item)The bomb is here for a reason and it's not solely for the bomber's advantage
Sorry if you're disappointed. I did have good intentions and wasn't trying to ruin the game for anyone
Slezak wrote:
I know I'm not one to talk because I bailed out on a game over at V-S just because there was an initial spat between two players which made me almost quit. However, I believe that my bailing out of the game did not change the enjoyment of the rest of the people playing.
Except you had access to the dead thread and a dead player that had flipped mafia was claiming to be town. You could've lied about a power saying that you realized the role PM was fake and TwiGav was innocent, but you stayed quiet and let another townie get killed (with mafia taking more of a lead) just because Chris said "stop talking" and you got upset. That was integral to the mafia victory and you could've stopped it, but you didn't because you were upset
Quote:
JesusMonroe, I'm going to be straight with you here: I like you because you put on the first Nonary Game which got me interested in the Zero Escape series. However, I don't like your attitude, especially throughout this whole game.
[/quote]
I like you too, Slezak. And I do think some people on VS can be unreasonable
However, I do think you can be a tad hypocritical at times. You personally know the effects of being bullied and you were being pretty toxic during this game
I'm not saying I'm not guilty of this, but I just expected better of you
I'm sorry I tried to kill you. Blame the role PM that said you were Zero because that can't exactly be ignored
You might've not liked my attitude since I was pursuing your death, but you can't say I wasn't playing the game to my fullest
Slezak wrote:
And actually, JM, I did do as you asked: I gave the input device to Cesar.
But you never told me
Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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That's my cue to leave.
I look forward to seeing the Grand Masterplan Behind the Scenes.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Also I didn't tell you because I expected the game to go on, me to die, and have the keyboard not show up with my bracelet.
Yes, I was actively working against you, but that's because I thought you were on the Zero team.
Thank you for reading. I hope you have a wonderful day.
100% pure Joy.
Excellent source of puns.
Refrigerate after opening.
100% pure Joy.
Excellent source of puns.
Refrigerate after opening.
Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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I'm really sorry. I shoulda realized when there was supposedly four or five espers that Lucky and Trace were probably innocent. Their behavior had me genuinely suspicious. I tried to stay open to anybody being Zero, but I do admit that I didn't talk to Trace+Lucky+Cesar enough to figure out the truth. Guess every X is Zero role was 100% misleading
I guess it was:
Giggles->Jumpy->Lucky->Cold->Trace->Nanjo->Ami->Neptune->Cesar->(Giggles again?)
We actually played with every other person on the chain as a team.
I agree that JM and Jumpy should've waited things out.
I hope I can be in the next game. This was really fun.
Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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I guess I just took my "apparent knowledge" that Nanjo was Zero, connected some false dots, and arrived at a Nanjo + Neptune/Jumpfight Zero team.
As was said before, hindsight is 20/20 and if I hadn't been so self-serving against JM, I probably would've given him the keyboard and the game could've gone on.
Incidentally, what WAS the item you got behind the [8] Door, JM? If it was a clue to Zero's identity, what did it really say? It's clear that our PMs were circular and therefore untrue.
Thank you for reading. I hope you have a wonderful day.
100% pure Joy.
Excellent source of puns.
Refrigerate after opening.
100% pure Joy.
Excellent source of puns.
Refrigerate after opening.
Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Franzise Deauxnim wrote:
Under one of the pillows, you find a page that looks to be torn from a diary.
"There are some who are born with an extraordinary way of thinking. There are some who are born with an extraordinary amount of untapped potential. Rarely is one gifted with both of these things, but that was the case in regards to the one who would eventually become known as Zero.
"Zero had a vision for the world. Most would consider it too extreme, or even insane, but to Zero, it made perfect sense; what didn't make sense was the way the world was now. Zero had the ability to make that vision a reality. However, there existed several others with a similar amount of potential who had the capacity to stop Zero. If Zero acted hastily, those who opposed the vision would likely move to end it before it could become a reality.
"Therefore, Zero came up with a plan that would bring those that would stand in the way together for a test. If Zero defeated those gifted individuals, it would not only eliminate Zero's rivals, it would prove Zero's intelligence and logic was superior and that Zero's vision must be the correct path for the future.
"This is why Zero created the Nonary Game."
"There are some who are born with an extraordinary way of thinking. There are some who are born with an extraordinary amount of untapped potential. Rarely is one gifted with both of these things, but that was the case in regards to the one who would eventually become known as Zero.
"Zero had a vision for the world. Most would consider it too extreme, or even insane, but to Zero, it made perfect sense; what didn't make sense was the way the world was now. Zero had the ability to make that vision a reality. However, there existed several others with a similar amount of potential who had the capacity to stop Zero. If Zero acted hastily, those who opposed the vision would likely move to end it before it could become a reality.
"Therefore, Zero came up with a plan that would bring those that would stand in the way together for a test. If Zero defeated those gifted individuals, it would not only eliminate Zero's rivals, it would prove Zero's intelligence and logic was superior and that Zero's vision must be the correct path for the future.
"This is why Zero created the Nonary Game."
I wonder if Zero and the bomber were one in the same?
Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Plus, the bomb didn't appear until Day 3. If someone successfully betrayed twice on Day 1 and 2, then they could've escaped and the bomb would've blown up
The bomber is just sort of stupid, I know it was in the first game, but still. I know it's a VLR reference but it's unnecessary when you make the game like this.
And I also liked the game too, Nanjo. I probably shouldn't have gotten ahead of myself but Jesus found a note that basically said zero would rule the world if they won the game and it seemed like that would be a bigger 'lose' than all of us dying.
*something something about motorcycles and people dying in a crash and turning back time so that everyone can live but all the good memories are lost yadda yadda*
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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jumpfight5 wrote:
How's it a mama violation when there is a bomb in the game with the purpose of being exploited by the players and with the purpose of ending the game?
Plus, the bomb didn't appear until Day 3. If someone successfully betrayed twice on Day 1 and 2, then they could've escaped and the bomb would've blown up
The bomber is just sort of stupid, I know it was in the first game, but still. I know it's a VLR reference but it's unnecessary when you make the game like this.
And I also liked the game too, Nanjo. I probably shouldn't have gotten ahead of myself but Jesus found a note that basically said zero would rule the world if they won the game and it seemed like that would be a bigger 'lose' than all of us dying.
*something something about motorcycles and people dying in a crash and turning back time so that everyone can live but all the good memories are lost yadda yadda*
Plus, the bomb didn't appear until Day 3. If someone successfully betrayed twice on Day 1 and 2, then they could've escaped and the bomb would've blown up
The bomber is just sort of stupid, I know it was in the first game, but still. I know it's a VLR reference but it's unnecessary when you make the game like this.
And I also liked the game too, Nanjo. I probably shouldn't have gotten ahead of myself but Jesus found a note that basically said zero would rule the world if they won the game and it seemed like that would be a bigger 'lose' than all of us dying.
*something something about motorcycles and people dying in a crash and turning back time so that everyone can live but all the good memories are lost yadda yadda*
The bomb showed up as the plot required it. Likely if such betrayals had went through we'd have simply found it taped to the escape door instead as we returned from the AB game.
Also you are making assumptions about the bomb. The bomb is not for run-of-the-mill players to use. It's a bargaining chip for the bomber. It is an obstacle to be overcome.
Additionally you detonating the bomb early assumes...we couldn't have stopped Zero why is that when there was still days to be played?
Were you both just so set on me being Zero you wanted to spite me and deny "Zero" a victory?
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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The roleplay is freaking awesome and you were pretty good at staying in character. You and Jesus were the only ones I trusted and I definitely should have allied alongside you turn 2. I would have, if it were anyone else, told everyone that they were the one who pressed betray, but I couldn't throw you under the bus like that. I have a feeling you're gonna play the next game and I have a feeling that I am too so I don't want this to be like a thing that makes us enemies next game even if we have no reason to
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The idea is that since it is anti-mama for a player to make an action that leads to their lose condition, i.e. opening the number nine door while bombs still haven't been defused, players will be trapped in the facility until they defuse the bombs. This could presumably prevent Zero from escaping as well.
The bombs are NOT there to be blown up because the lose condition of every player is their death. No players should ever activate the bombs because that means their own failure.
Opening the door was a definite fail-state, whereas continuing to play the game could have had a winning scenario theoretically (and in actuality it did).
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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jumpfight5 wrote:
Oh no no I did not want to spite you I love you dude
The roleplay is freaking awesome and you were pretty good at staying in character. You and Jesus were the only ones I trusted and I definitely should have allied alongside you turn 2. I would have, if it were anyone else, told everyone that they were the one who pressed betray, but I couldn't throw you under the bus like that. I have a feeling you're gonna play the next game and I have a feeling that I am too so I don't want this to be like a thing that makes us enemies next game even if we have no reason to
The roleplay is freaking awesome and you were pretty good at staying in character. You and Jesus were the only ones I trusted and I definitely should have allied alongside you turn 2. I would have, if it were anyone else, told everyone that they were the one who pressed betray, but I couldn't throw you under the bus like that. I have a feeling you're gonna play the next game and I have a feeling that I am too so I don't want this to be like a thing that makes us enemies next game even if we have no reason to
Aw it's fine man I didn't mean "Me" personally I meant "Me" as your suspected "Zero."
Like you were so afraid that I was Zero and escape you just wanted to blow everything up so that I couldn't? That's more what I was getting at. We'd all confirmed I hadn't found an item all game and so couldn't have the hidden bomb code. I'd even been playing ball and co-operating with JM to work towards solving the game. I just had hope for the remainder of the game, like pieces were starting to come together.
BTW Nanjo what was your Role? Me and Neptune figured you weren't an Esper.
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Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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That's why I betrayed Neptune in the second round actually. I was lying about the other stuff.
Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Doctor Nanjo wrote:
The bomb is in the game so the bomber can prevent people from escaping before the bomber does.
The idea is that since it is anti-mama for a player to make an action that leads to their lose condition, i.e. opening the number nine door while bombs still haven't been defused, players will be trapped in the facility until they defuse the bombs. This could presumably prevent Zero from escaping as well.
The bombs are NOT there to be blown up because the lose condition of every player is their death. No players should ever activate the bombs because that means their own failure.
Opening the door was a definite fail-state, whereas continuing to play the game could have had a winning scenario theoretically (and in actuality it did).
The idea is that since it is anti-mama for a player to make an action that leads to their lose condition, i.e. opening the number nine door while bombs still haven't been defused, players will be trapped in the facility until they defuse the bombs. This could presumably prevent Zero from escaping as well.
The bombs are NOT there to be blown up because the lose condition of every player is their death. No players should ever activate the bombs because that means their own failure.
Opening the door was a definite fail-state, whereas continuing to play the game could have had a winning scenario theoretically (and in actuality it did).
Take this from someone who ran the first Nonary Game
I made it so the bomb could only be defused in the computer room (Door 9). In the same door, there was a gun. I was anxious for a player to grab the gun, shoot ShameNinja (the person with the input device), and reactivate the bomb, threatening everyone to not leave without him. Essentially, any player could've been the bomber
ShameNinja had a [0] bracelet in the last game. He could've given it to any player and they could've killed someone even if they weren't a serial killer
Items and mechanics like these are meant to be exploited. If Franzise didn't feel that way, she wouldn't have put in the game or would at least impose some way to circumvent it
And as I've said, hindsight is 20/20. Jumpfight and I believed Pierre to be Zero (he killed his opponent in the AB Game, come on. Not unreasonable to come to this conclusion) and believed it would be prudent to prevent Zero from winning
We felt that if we didn't act, the game wouldn't advance past phase 1 anyway because Slezak would just defuse the bomb and Pierre would lose
We didn't see a possibility of winning beyond Day 4, Phase 1 because we believed Pierre would get out regardless, which would mean that everyone loses anyway and the game would end
If you don't believe me, I could have easily grabbed Cold's bracelet and killed Pierre behind Door 1 if I believed he wouldn't escape. I didn't believe he wouldn't escape, so...yeah. Here we are
It's not out of spite. I don't know why everyone thinks jumpfight and I are being so petty. Especially jumpfight, since nothing went wrong for him all game
And regarding betraying me in the second round...come on. Really?
Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Don't feel bad about it, though. I don't think it was petty, but I don't think anyone should do something like that just because they think they might lose. Our very misleading roles played into it, obviously.
On the topic of betraying you, your partner was Zero according to my role, and that was before I had any whiff of anybody else having the same role.
That's why I asked you the question about "what would you do if your biggest Zero candidate were playing against you and likely to ally?"
You said betray if their partner wasn't 100% innocent, so I did.
Re: The Second Nonary Game (Day 3, Phase 4)
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Doctor Nanjo wrote:
I mean you can be as sure as you want to be, but opening the door was 100% failure (well, you had even MORE reason to believe it was 100% failure, at least). No two ways about it.
Don't feel bad about it, though. I don't think it was petty, but I don't think anyone should do something like that just because they think they might lose. Our very misleading roles played into it, obviously.
On the topic of betraying you, your partner was Zero according to my role, and that was before I had any whiff of anybody else having the same role.
That's why I asked you the question about "what would you do if your biggest Zero candidate were playing against you and likely to ally?"
You said betray if their partner wasn't 100% innocent, so I did.
Don't feel bad about it, though. I don't think it was petty, but I don't think anyone should do something like that just because they think they might lose. Our very misleading roles played into it, obviously.
On the topic of betraying you, your partner was Zero according to my role, and that was before I had any whiff of anybody else having the same role.
That's why I asked you the question about "what would you do if your biggest Zero candidate were playing against you and likely to ally?"
You said betray if their partner wasn't 100% innocent, so I did.
Ah, fuck. That's dirty as hell but I respect it haha
It ended up being kind of useless though since Ami wasn't even in the game--I think that's another thing that kind of messed things up
Anyway, my main point is you can call me a shitty person for ending the game but I don't think it was a MAMA violation
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