Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Happy Maria
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FenrirDarkWolf wrote:
Southern Corn wrote:
Spoiler: Culprit
Spoiler:
Yes.
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Happy Maria
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linkenski wrote:
I really don't like Ellen's design. She reminds me of Katherine from AAI2. So generic-looking and her theatrical mannerisms is cringeworthy to me even if it's part of her theme as being an actress :/
Would be way funnier if she was a mean B---- in real life or horribly depressed or something OR JUST NORMAL FOR ONCE >.<, without making her a Will Powers clone or anything of course.
Would be way funnier if she was a mean B---- in real life or horribly depressed or something OR JUST NORMAL FOR ONCE >.<, without making her a Will Powers clone or anything of course.
But she's a servant.
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Gettin' Old!
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Also I felt they kinda gave up too easily.
Also I wish there were more "whodunnit" as opposed to "howdidit" murders in this game. It irks me when there's only like....one reasonable suspect in a case.
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
迷探偵
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The whodunit, in a game form, is about basically making a list of characteristics of the culprit based on the crime scene, and then comparing those to the suspects. So you based on the crime scene you conclude the murderer was left handed, the murderer did action A, implying he had knowledge of B, the murderer had access to C. And then look who of the suspects is left handed, and who knew about B, and who had access to C. It's a different way of solving the problem: it's elimination, not pulling the string. It's obviously not impossible to do a whodunnit with the contradiction mechanic, but there's no synergy, as they work along different lines. That's whenever the AA games do do the whodunit, it's never done with the main game mechanics, but with either other mechanics, or through the 'normal' dialogue.
There are both novels and games that do the whodunnit very good. Many of the early Ellery Queen novels are like that. As for games, you'd be surprised how good of a mystery game the Diagnosis part of Trauma Team (Wii) is: you look symptoms of a patient, check out possible causes for them ("suspects") based on that list of symptoms, do further checks to eliminate 'suspects' and then identify the culprit.
"One dumbbell, Watson! Consider an athlete with one dumbbell! Picture to yourself the unilateral development, the imminent danger of a spinal curvature. Shocking, Watson, shocking!" - The Valley of Fear
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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Spoiler:
Also, Columbo is awesome. And the first episode was directed by Steven Spielberg. For a TV show. I mean, can you beat that?
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
"I'm so sick of Khura'in!"
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Uh, noooh, and now we have an overview map of two imaginatively constructed plot-objects (the bull thingies) and that's going to be important to solve the case, huh? This is going to be a terrible case. Why should i care if one object is shaped like a bull or a cow or whether it's male or female and whether the broken one was in the right spot (or whatever they'll be driving at in the trial). So lame.
This is the Dark Age of the Ace Attorney
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Happy Maria
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linkenski wrote:
The whole time before the case released I believed the characters were dressed up and using "time travel pendants" because they were actors in a movie and the mystery would revolve around that. Are you kidding me, that we are actually exploring a crime scene to disprove the supposed time travel of a girl almost out of random? The characters and their designs are beyond terrible in this case. I can't believe this is supposed not to be staged. The crime also reminds me too much of I2-3 with the way the body was found.
Uh, noooh, and now we have an overview map of two imaginatively constructed plot-objects (the bull thingies) and that's going to be important to solve the case, huh? This is going to be a terrible case. Why should i care if one object is shaped like a bull or a cow or whether it's male or female and whether the broken one was in the right spot (or whatever they'll be driving at in the trial). So lame.
Uh, noooh, and now we have an overview map of two imaginatively constructed plot-objects (the bull thingies) and that's going to be important to solve the case, huh? This is going to be a terrible case. Why should i care if one object is shaped like a bull or a cow or whether it's male or female and whether the broken one was in the right spot (or whatever they'll be driving at in the trial). So lame.
Yeah,honestly the mystery here is the worst in all of SOJ. Very flat and too simplistic for my liking.
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Gettin' Old!
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Ash wrote:
Well, the series was never conveived as a whodunit game, partly because the main mechanic doesn't really lend itself well for that. It's great for cornering a suspect you know is guilty of something, as you keep catching them on one lie after another, like Columbo (which was a great influence on the series).
The whodunit, in a game form, is about basically making a list of characteristics of the culprit based on the crime scene, and then comparing those to the suspects. So you based on the crime scene you conclude the murderer was left handed, the murderer did action A, implying he had knowledge of B, the murderer had access to C. And then look who of the suspects is left handed, and who knew about B, and who had access to C. It's a different way of solving the problem: it's elimination, not pulling the string. It's obviously not impossible to do a whodunnit with the contradiction mechanic, but there's no synergy, as they work along different lines. That's whenever the AA games do do the whodunit, it's never done with the main game mechanics, but with either other mechanics, or through the 'normal' dialogue.
There are both novels and games that do the whodunnit very good. Many of the early Ellery Queen novels are like that. As for games, you'd be surprised how good of a mystery game the Diagnosis part of Trauma Team (Wii) is: you look symptoms of a patient, check out possible causes for them ("suspects") based on that list of symptoms, do further checks to eliminate 'suspects' and then identify the culprit.
The whodunit, in a game form, is about basically making a list of characteristics of the culprit based on the crime scene, and then comparing those to the suspects. So you based on the crime scene you conclude the murderer was left handed, the murderer did action A, implying he had knowledge of B, the murderer had access to C. And then look who of the suspects is left handed, and who knew about B, and who had access to C. It's a different way of solving the problem: it's elimination, not pulling the string. It's obviously not impossible to do a whodunnit with the contradiction mechanic, but there's no synergy, as they work along different lines. That's whenever the AA games do do the whodunit, it's never done with the main game mechanics, but with either other mechanics, or through the 'normal' dialogue.
There are both novels and games that do the whodunnit very good. Many of the early Ellery Queen novels are like that. As for games, you'd be surprised how good of a mystery game the Diagnosis part of Trauma Team (Wii) is: you look symptoms of a patient, check out possible causes for them ("suspects") based on that list of symptoms, do further checks to eliminate 'suspects' and then identify the culprit.
Hmm you raise a fair point. If the games aren't intended as whodunnits then perhaps I'm judging it unfairly. Then again part of me feels that reveals and conceals have been done well and more often in previous games. I didn't see Kristoph coming or Acro. Maybe this says more about me than the games though.
Part of my fear is that greater effort required of making 3D models means less characters are available. Which would result in cases where there isn't really enough suspects. In which case it would be an intrinsic problem with the platform that couldn't be fixed. I suppose I would need to crunch the data to determine whether the average number of characters in Sprite games compared with those in Model games. Still your explanation does make a lot of sense.
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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I actually have a theory about the lack of characters:
Spoiler: SoJ
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
"I'm so sick of Khura'in!"
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Also, one reason why this case is decidedly boring on the mystery and story-department is that this is actually the first court segment entirely since 5-1 to not have a main gimmick like Mood Matrix or the Seances to replace regular testimonies. They have to work their way around not being able to rely on visually stunning gimmicks to take over and they have to do more "GYAKUTEN" moments just with text, and they're not managing it that well. Even GK had the luxury of regularly switching up a couple of arguments with some investigation stuff at its leisure.
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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I actually prefer when there isn't a circular focus on the gimmick, but I admit that removing them can leave the cases feeling a bit... too ordinary, for lack of a better word? It worked for the first game, but AA is the kind of series that relies on new and different elements each time to draw interest from a wider audience. The novellas, manga, and stage adaptations don't require any gimmicks because they're independent, individual stories. Once you tie everything together, a lot of those cases don't stand out when compared to the canon. (Granted, some of those stories are meh to kinda iffy in the first place.)
So I tend to look forward to new gimmicks in coming games to see what new thing they're introducing aside from more characters, stories, mysteries, and developments.
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
What did he do this time...?
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Spoiler:
Want to play my custom-made Ace Attorney case made on Ace Attorney Online? (you must be using Firefox to run it)
Turnabout Destiny
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Otter
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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linkenski wrote:
The whole time before the case released I believed the characters were dressed up and using "time travel pendants" because they were actors in a movie and the mystery would revolve around that. Are you kidding me, that we are actually exploring a crime scene to disprove the supposed time travel of a girl almost out of random? The characters and their designs are beyond terrible in this case. I can't believe this is supposed not to be staged. The crime also reminds me too much of I2-3 with the way the body was found.
Uh, noooh, and now we have an overview map of two imaginatively constructed plot-objects (the bull thingies) and that's going to be important to solve the case, huh? This is going to be a terrible case. Why should i care if one object is shaped like a bull or a cow or whether it's male or female and whether the broken one was in the right spot (or whatever they'll be driving at in the trial). So lame.
Uh, noooh, and now we have an overview map of two imaginatively constructed plot-objects (the bull thingies) and that's going to be important to solve the case, huh? This is going to be a terrible case. Why should i care if one object is shaped like a bull or a cow or whether it's male or female and whether the broken one was in the right spot (or whatever they'll be driving at in the trial). So lame.
I...quite honestly can hardly understand this. Not trying to be a Grammar Nazi, but this argument legitimately escapes me. Are you upset because...the characters aren't movie actors? And...that wooden cows are included?
"I can't go to hell, little weirdo. I'm all out of vacation days."
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Happy Maria
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TheBlarghMan wrote:
linkenski wrote:
The whole time before the case released I believed the characters were dressed up and using "time travel pendants" because they were actors in a movie and the mystery would revolve around that. Are you kidding me, that we are actually exploring a crime scene to disprove the supposed time travel of a girl almost out of random? The characters and their designs are beyond terrible in this case. I can't believe this is supposed not to be staged. The crime also reminds me too much of I2-3 with the way the body was found.
Uh, noooh, and now we have an overview map of two imaginatively constructed plot-objects (the bull thingies) and that's going to be important to solve the case, huh? This is going to be a terrible case. Why should i care if one object is shaped like a bull or a cow or whether it's male or female and whether the broken one was in the right spot (or whatever they'll be driving at in the trial). So lame.
Uh, noooh, and now we have an overview map of two imaginatively constructed plot-objects (the bull thingies) and that's going to be important to solve the case, huh? This is going to be a terrible case. Why should i care if one object is shaped like a bull or a cow or whether it's male or female and whether the broken one was in the right spot (or whatever they'll be driving at in the trial). So lame.
I...quite honestly can hardly understand this. Not trying to be a Grammar Nazi, but this argument legitimately escapes me. Are you upset because...the characters aren't movie actors? And...that wooden cows are included?
Someone's been playing too much Layton :P
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Objection!
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The mystery was uninteresting and barely a mystery at all. I think this easily lands on my bottom 3 of cases in the entire series. Disappointing, since Turnabout Reclaimed was actually pretty decent.
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
The video game boy; the one who wins
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Spoiler:
(......Ack! I've run out of snide comments!)
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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Going for Miles wrote:
Hahaha, yes, the Thought route.
Spoiler:
Spoiler:
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
"I'm so sick of Khura'in!"
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TheBlarghMan wrote:
I...quite honestly can hardly understand this. Not trying to be a Grammar Nazi, but this argument legitimately escapes me. Are you upset because...the characters aren't movie actors? And...that wooden cows are included?
I think the premise is so out there that I expected the mystery to be about some fake-out time-travel like a movie being shot by a studio with actors or something. I just think as a premise it feels stupid to have "time travel" as a mystery out of nothing. Why does that lady have some dorky device that makes her believe she can time travel... in reality (that is reality of Ace Attorney... >_>)? I just feel like they are stretching Ace Attorney really thin with this idea.
I don't know exactly how it would've made more sense within the real world of AA if time-traveling would've still been a mystery had it been movie actors and the time-traveling was part of the script, but regardless that would've still felt less dorky to me. This whole case and its cast is just dorky AF, and I don't even think AA cases are usually dorky, except maybe I2-5 (Premise: Is that boy a godzilla monster that transforms?).
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Enoshima Junko-chan!
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Contrast that with Reclaimed, where the game went through a lot of effort of setting up Crab as a suspect.
11037
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
What did he do this time...?
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MBr wrote:
I know the games are howdidit as opposed to whodunit, but the games usually have enough of a mystery that it can misdirect you as to who the real killer is. I think they did a poor job in trying to make Sorin suspicious.
Contrast that with Reclaimed, where the game went through a lot of effort of setting up Crab as a suspect.
Contrast that with Reclaimed, where the game went through a lot of effort of setting up Crab as a suspect.
That's actually something I really liked about DD's DLC case - I actually bought that Crab was going to be the killer, so there was a legitimate surprise when we learned that Crab didn't do it. In this DLC case, I didn't believe Sorin did it for one second.
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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Danchat wrote:
MBr wrote:
I know the games are howdidit as opposed to whodunit, but the games usually have enough of a mystery that it can misdirect you as to who the real killer is. I think they did a poor job in trying to make Sorin suspicious.
Contrast that with Reclaimed, where the game went through a lot of effort of setting up Crab as a suspect.
Contrast that with Reclaimed, where the game went through a lot of effort of setting up Crab as a suspect.
That's actually something I really liked about DD's DLC case - I actually bought that Crab was going to be the killer, so there was a legitimate surprise when we learned that Crab didn't do it. In this DLC case, I didn't believe Sorin did it for one second.
Personally, I knew from a mile away that Crab was innocent. They made him WAAAAY to suspicious, on par with how the original games made people suspicious IMO. I absolutely loved Crab as a character, but I didn't suspect him.
Spoiler: AA6 DLC
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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Maya looks so odd from this perspective
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Otter
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Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
Is there something wrong with it? She's not actually that short. It's just the very skewed perspective. :v
I know that, it's the perspective honestly. It's the only time we've seen her in that sort of attorney view and it's new and somewhat odd to me :P
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Otter
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Spoiler:
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Happy Maria
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
I've felt worse.
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"It's never too late to learn that growing old doesn't have to mean growing up. Stay curious, stay weird, stay kind, and don't let anyone ever tell you you aren't smart or brave or worthy enough." -Stanford Pines, Gravity Falls
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Happy Maria
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sumguy28 wrote:
Because then there wouldn't be enough room for two Larrys. Or three Mayas.
Along with other such classics like the yak,the coffin!the war'not good,and the speakers.
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
A Kirby and AA fan
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Secondly, almost everything I wanted to say about this case has already been said, so I'll refrain from that. There's only one specific thing I didn't see mentioned, though the subject of Edgeworth's OOC did come up...
Spoiler: 6-DLC
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
The cape is self-fluttering
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Nurio wrote:
I don't understand the people in the first few pages who want to know everything about the case without playing it themselves... Isn't that something you want to find out by yourself?
Secondly, almost everything I wanted to say about this case has already been said, so I'll refrain from that. There's only one specific thing I didn't see mentioned, though the subject of Edgeworth's OOC did come up...
Secondly, almost everything I wanted to say about this case has already been said, so I'll refrain from that. There's only one specific thing I didn't see mentioned, though the subject of Edgeworth's OOC did come up...
Spoiler: 6-DLC
Spoiler: AAI, AAI2
"Descole? You don't mean Mr. I-Like-to-Wreck-Things-with-Mechanical-Monsters-and-Dress-Up-as-Posh-Ladies Descole?" -Emmy Altava
...NAILED IT
...NAILED IT
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
The video game boy; the one who wins
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Jean Descole wrote:
Spoiler: AAI, AAI2
Spoiler:
(......Ack! I've run out of snide comments!)
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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Going for Miles wrote:
Jean Descole wrote:
Spoiler: AAI, AAI2
Spoiler:
Spoiler: :D
But really, that both Phoenix and Edgeworth are portrayed inconsistently over the games is no news. Yet this game did save grace by officially introducing alcohol into the universe, so we can conclude within the realm of plausibility that they do in fact drink before they go to court.
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
The video game boy; the one who wins
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Rubia Ryu the Royal wrote:
Spoiler: :D
Spoiler: x)
(......Ack! I've run out of snide comments!)
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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All Lives Matter
Just Do It
Keep It Classic
Equality
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Celebrate Each New Day
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Xenoblade Chronicles 2
Kingdom Heats 3
Xenoblade Chronicles
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I'm interested in mechanics,so I would be happy to learn about snake traps.
Good isn't a thing you are Its a thing you do
Just Do It
Keep It Classic
Equality
Dream Big
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#Autism Speaks
#Mamba Mentality#8#24#2
Celebrate Each New Day
#WNBAAllDay
Xenoblade Chronicles 2
Kingdom Heats 3
Xenoblade Chronicles
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I'm interested in mechanics,so I would be happy to learn about snake traps.
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Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Beauty and grace.
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Spoiler:
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
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scarlet-flowers wrote:
Unlike everyone else, I found the whole Athena and Trucy skit to be boring and dumb. Like, it would have been funny if it was just done once, but they kept doing it over and over and over... I GET IT, WE'RE SHOVING ATHENA TO THE SIDE.
Not unlike me. I also disliked it a lot. Having it happen just once is fine. But they were really beating a dead horse here. It's also stupid because it makes Trucy look like a tyrant and Athena like a pushover. It would've been better if they had Athena willingly but begrudgingly help Trucy because she promised to prior to this case happening and can't back down on a promise
Now I'm taking it a bit too seriously, but... What Trucy did was literally illegal. And her dad, a lawyer, is just like "haha oh well". That just doesn't sit well with me. Also, how does Trucy keep catching up to Athena, someone who is incredibly athletic. (Athena's physical prowess is something else I dislike, but that's a whole other discussion.)
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
The video game boy; the one who wins
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The spiritual power of this magatama allows me to see...
... these mystical locks that appear when someone trying to hide something from me.
They're called "Psyche-locks" and when I see them...
... I simply touch the magatama to try my hand at breaking them.
If I can unlock them,
I'm sure to finally get a straight answer out of him!
Take that!
(......Ack! I've run out of snide comments!)
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Happy Maria
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Rank: Ace Attorney
Joined: Mon Sep 26, 2016 11:42 am
Posts: 4741
Re: DLC case discussion thread (tagged spoilers)
Gender: Male
Rank: Ace Attorney
Joined: Fri Jan 31, 2014 8:13 pm
Posts: 1546
I caught up on the thread and read some of the complaints and definitely think a lot are very valid. The music cues definitely seemed off and the animations were way too long (especially Ellen turning back into a bride). I presented the pendant to Sorin when we first met and was just treated to the generic "useless evidence" dialogue. Then I talked to him and was told I needed to present something. It turns out this was the pendant, but I ended up presenting almost everything to him and having to wait forever for him to fold a plane each time :/
There were also complaints that the courtroom sections were too bland without gimmicks and I dunno, they were fine to me. But maybe this is because I've gone a month without an AA case so I had an itch
Spoiler:
So yeah, I'd say this is my 4th favorite case in the game which might not seem that high considering I said I loved this case, but I also loved 6-1, 6-2, and 6-5 :p
And yes, worst Thought Route ever
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