Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 12:33 am

Vista_YoshXP

I object to everything objectional!

Gender: Male

Rank: Desk Jockey

Joined: Sun May 13, 2007 12:42 am

Posts: 57

One thing I have thought would be really cool for a while is a game where you play as a prosecutor rather than a defense attorney.

Spoiler: Case 3-5

It would certainly be different. I could imagine having to set the scenerios up first before beggining the trials. And then fighting against defense's statements. Perhaps you could select wheather or not to object to the defense's statements while in cross examination? But when it comes down to presenting evidence, I'm not sure how to exactly go through with it. In a real court system, a defendant in Innocent until proven Guilty. So a prosecutor in real life has a much harder role in real life than in the game. I wonder if Capcom could make a game based around the whole idea and reverse Guilty until proven innocent to innocent until proven guilty just for that particular game? It would be difficult but I think it could make a good game if it is thought out enough.

What is your take on the idea? Do you have any suggestions or your own ideas for this concept?

Join the Rebellion (7>_>)7

And before you trash my Inbox, RevFirst doesn't care that I'm doing this =P. But people still might hate me for this xD.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 12:53 am

Croik

nuuuuu, stoooooop

Gender: Female

Location: America

Rank: Admin

Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:16 am

Posts: 5255

It's been brought up before, and I still think there's one major problem with a prosecutor oriented game: you have to pick the guilty party way in advance. As the defense attorney, you can bluff through part of the case and gradually uncover the truth. As a prosecutor, you're expected to know it in advance.

I don't think it would be nearly as exciting to play the whole case knowing who's guilty. It's not like the prosecutor can switch who it's charging halfway through.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 1:13 am

Vista_YoshXP

I object to everything objectional!

Gender: Male

Rank: Desk Jockey

Joined: Sun May 13, 2007 12:42 am

Posts: 57

I thought of a lack of excitement myself. But "figuring out the murderer first beforehand" actually could make up for this. Perhaps there could be a detective's investigation section where a list of suspects is given. Then this is where all the evidence is gathered and the suspect has to be figured out. This is where the suspect is unknown. Then the trial begins and rather than contradictions, the correct evidence has to be presented to prove a defendant guilty. It would certainly be different but it could work.

Oh and one more thing, things could be twisted around and the Prosecutor might have to do Phoenix's job for a little while.

Spoiler:

There could be something like that in the game just to throw you for a loop.

Join the Rebellion (7>_>)7

And before you trash my Inbox, RevFirst doesn't care that I'm doing this =P. But people still might hate me for this xD.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 1:20 am

SilverZephyr

Science: It's cuter than ever

Gender: Female

Location: Michigan

Rank: Prosecutor

Joined: Thu Mar 01, 2007 3:25 am

Posts: 999

Hmm...the only way I see it working is if there's only one long trial day and one long investigation day. That way, you wouldn't know the guilty party for /too/ much of the game. I think it's interesting as a concept, but it would take a lot of thought to make it work right. The cross-examinations could work like you said, deciding which statements are worth objecting to and still presenting evidence...also, there would be a phase where you would be preparing the case, the witnesses and testimonies.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 1:30 pm

Phalangie

Untitled

Gender: None specified

Rank: Suspect

Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 3:34 pm

Posts: 17

Croik wrote:

It's not like the prosecutor can switch who it's charging halfway through.

What about 1-2? I think Redd White swaps the defendant from Maya to Phoenix on day two and Nick has to defend himself.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 1:45 pm

Ryuko

Live life to the full

Gender: Female

Location: England

Rank: Decisive Witness

Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 10:52 pm

Posts: 184

I could picture it actually:

-You start with a file containing the murder details, witnesses and suspect.
-You can examine the evidence to see if there is anything the police overlooked, if there is sufficient grounds for doubt, you could go to the scene to look for any other possible elements
-In court, you select a witness to present, during the defendant's and the officer's cases, you can ask them questions from a list of options and choose to present evidence to the court.

The result depends on whether or not you have chosen the right options.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 2:12 pm

Croik

nuuuuu, stoooooop

Gender: Female

Location: America

Rank: Admin

Joined: Fri Feb 23, 2007 5:16 am

Posts: 5255

Phalangie wrote:

What about 1-2? I think Redd White swaps the defendant from Maya to Phoenix on day two and Nick has to defend himself.

Yeah, but that was supremely lame. Sadshoe

Doing that would negate all the work you did in the first case. Your prosecutor would have to be a nitwit for that to go over more than once. And the only reason it was allowed in the first place was because Redd had leverage over the District Attorney (or Chief Proseuctor, what have you). Normally, the first defendant would have just been declared Not Guilty and the trial would have to start all over.

And even if you had an extended investigation phase, it would still have be very closely scripted to make sure you end up with the right defendant. It would be a complete waste of time if you ended up picking the wrong person, and spent the next half hour flubbing through court only to lose the case and start over.

In PW, it works because the defense spends the entire time proving the prosecution wrong. But in a prosecution game, drawing out the case that way would just make your character look like an idiot. If in every case you had to admit that you were originally wrong and change your ideas mid-case, I think it would just be discouraging and frustrating. But if the defense didn't prove you wrong, the trial would be too easy and too fast.

It'd probably be better just to have a straight Detective game and not worry about the prosecution too much.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 4:19 pm

SailorTaurus

Official Chinami Fan

Gender: None specified

Rank: Decisive Witness

Joined: Mon Apr 23, 2007 1:33 pm

Posts: 197

One thing to consider though, is that the defendant (to my knowledge) is never picked out by the prosecution, but was rather arrested on the spot at the crime scene (or somewhere nearby), which more or less solves the problem of 'choosing the defendant'.

Props to Clicky for the avatar! =3

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 5:04 pm

Miles Wright 114

Put that cookie down!

Gender: Male

Location: North East England

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Sun May 20, 2007 12:24 pm

Posts: 1167

They would have to change the title to something like "Perfect Prosecuter" or something like that. Von Karma

Check out my site @
http://retromoddreams.blogspot.com/

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 7:06 pm

Malice

Opressed Writer

Gender: None specified

Rank: Suspect

Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 9:14 pm

Posts: 15

I guess they could do something like in "Shark" (TV series, pretty awesome btw). Often they know the guilty party from the start, so it's less of a whodunit and more of a howtocatchem.

I think it'd be quite cool as the extent as to how much of a sentence the defendant gets; if you've done a good job, and uncovered most of the mystery, they may get 25 to Life, whereas if you only managed to partially persuade the court of their involvement with the murder, they might get 8 years for Accessory to Murder or Manslaughter, something like that.

Another cool aspect that'd have to be added would be a jury system, where the more people you convince, the better chance you have of locking people away for good.

My two pence, anyhoo.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 8:24 pm

UltraSaint4121

US!

Gender: Male

Location: Here.

Rank: Medium-in-training

Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 4:39 pm

Posts: 491

it would be quite good actually as a prosecutor, for example, you have to shoot down all the defenses statements and accusations, whilst collecting enough evidence to pin down the accused...
however, there can be some cases where you uncover what really happened and do like edgeworth did in 1-3... etc.

or you could, as people have said, be judged on your performance... and how well you persude the jury, as to the accuseds sentance from guilty(execution) to not guilty
it could work, but it would be hard and long, and confusing....

Matt DeMasque!
*Currently playing Spirit of Justice*

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 21, 2007 9:40 pm

Mikker

Struck by a blunt objection

Gender: Male

Location: Denmark

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Sun Feb 25, 2007 5:12 pm

Posts: 1472

Croik wrote:

It's been brought up before, and I still think there's one major problem with a prosecutor oriented game: you have to pick the guilty party way in advance. As the defense attorney, you can bluff through part of the case and gradually uncover the truth. As a prosecutor, you're expected to know it in advance.

I don't think it would be nearly as exciting to play the whole case knowing who's guilty. It's not like the prosecutor can switch who it's charging halfway through.

^^^^ This is a good point.

HOWEVER, it might work in a single case. But NOT more than that. Not enough plot-twists for more than a one-timer.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 28, 2007 12:37 am

Thorn

Gender: None specified

Rank: Decisive Witness

Joined: Sun May 27, 2007 10:27 pm

Posts: 299

I agree. It would be a LOT HARDER but there would be some benefits. You'll know who the witnesses are ahead of time, you'll have more connections with the police department, and you can lower Gumshoe's pay even more :sadshoe:

. Lol just kidding about that last one.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 28, 2007 12:04 pm

The_Raptor

RAWR

Gender: None specified

Rank: Suspect

Joined: Sun May 27, 2007 11:47 pm

Posts: 15

SailorTaurus wrote:

One thing to consider though, is that the defendant (to my knowledge) is never picked out by the prosecution, but was rather arrested on the spot at the crime scene (or somewhere nearby), which more or less solves the problem of 'choosing the defendant'.

That's true. But in Japan the prosecutors always do everything including that. Since this game styles more of a Japan court, that may not work.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 28, 2007 4:31 pm

Ultimate Prosecutor

Shake it up, baby, now, TWIST AND SHOUT!

Gender: Male

Location: Back in the U.S.S.R.

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2007 5:19 pm

Posts: 1914

Well, you don't HAVE to know whether the defendant is guilty.
When playing PW, the defendant is always NOT GUILTY with the exception of Matt Engarde, and it is with that knowledge that they are innocent that you proceed.

If this were reversed, i.e. you presume that defendants are guilty, maybe the defense could attempt to pin the witnesses as Phoenix does, and it is your (the prosecutor's) job to prove otherwise, whilst providing evidence to land the defendants verdict.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 28, 2007 5:27 pm

Cookie~Ace

Nope

Gender: None specified

Rank: Desk Jockey

Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:47 pm

Posts: 133

Heh. It'd be pretty funny to investigate a case as Edgeworth and Gumshoe as the assistant. XD

:edgeworth:

Hmph. It will take forever to search for evidence in this pile of junk.

:gumshoe:

Ahah! I found it!

:edgeworth:

What is it Detective? Did you find a weapon..?

:gymshoe:

Actually... I found my broken watch. I don't know how it ended up here though...

:edgeworth:

There's a tag that reads "Dick" on the back. It's not yours...

:eh?:

..

...

That....sort of hurts, Sir..

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Mon May 28, 2007 5:56 pm

Ultimate Prosecutor

Shake it up, baby, now, TWIST AND SHOUT!

Gender: Male

Location: Back in the U.S.S.R.

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2007 5:19 pm

Posts: 1914

AHA! That's better!!!

:edgeworth:

What's that, a photo, blood stains, what?

:eh?:

No, pal. These are the batteries from my watch. A key ingredient I'd say.

:wacky-edgy:

...

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Wed May 30, 2007 5:43 pm

Ultimate Prosecutor

Shake it up, baby, now, TWIST AND SHOUT!

Gender: Male

Location: Back in the U.S.S.R.

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2007 5:19 pm

Posts: 1914

Maybe there isn't a link between prosecutor and victim, but you caould make it so that you build a bond with your witnesses and the detectives, no?

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Wed May 30, 2007 10:26 pm

KerimEelots

Folger's in your cup!!!!1one1!

Gender: Male

Rank: Desk Jockey

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 12:41 am

Posts: 128

I think during the trial, you have access to both the prosecution's and defense's life bar type thing, and you try to get the defense's bar to go boom, while trying to maintain yours, by making the least amount of mistakes possible. Also, there should be a way to connect with Ace Attorney, and play trials against your friends. During that, the prosecution could hide craploads of evidence, and the defense tries to find them and they start the trial. Or, if you are in a hurry, you could just go straight to the trial, with preset evidence. The multiplayer would have to feature customizable cases to be any fun though... :sadshoe:

^Click to go to my sigs^

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Thu May 31, 2007 12:35 am

Konran

That kid nobody likes.

Gender: Female

Location: Earth.

Rank: Decisive Witness

Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:52 pm

Posts: 197

Plus, if you were a prosecutor, you wouldn't be able to fight FOR GREAT JUSTICE!

..Well, you probably could. But it would be more like... great vengence. Or something.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Thu May 31, 2007 1:47 am

KerimEelots

Folger's in your cup!!!!1one1!

Gender: Male

Rank: Desk Jockey

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 12:41 am

Posts: 128

With the prosecutors like they are, I'm leaning towards the latter.

^Click to go to my sigs^

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Thu May 31, 2007 1:43 pm

Ultimate Prosecutor

Shake it up, baby, now, TWIST AND SHOUT!

Gender: Male

Location: Back in the U.S.S.R.

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2007 5:19 pm

Posts: 1914

If the tables are turned on PW series and the defendants ARE Guilty, then you would be fightin for justice.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Thu May 31, 2007 4:59 pm

Ryuko

Live life to the full

Gender: Female

Location: England

Rank: Decisive Witness

Joined: Sat Apr 21, 2007 10:52 pm

Posts: 184

But then, isn't half the point behind the series that the law screwed up and arrested the wrong person and you have to prove that's the case?

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Thu May 31, 2007 5:09 pm

Ultimate Prosecutor

Shake it up, baby, now, TWIST AND SHOUT!

Gender: Male

Location: Back in the U.S.S.R.

Rank: Ace Attorney

Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2007 5:19 pm

Posts: 1914

The point behind the series in which you play as the defense, yes. No doubt that would have to change if you were to play as the prosecution.
They would have it that the defense is screwed up and trtying to get a perfect Not-Guilty record or something.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Thu May 31, 2007 9:39 pm

KerimEelots

Folger's in your cup!!!!1one1!

Gender: Male

Rank: Desk Jockey

Joined: Mon Mar 05, 2007 12:41 am

Posts: 128

I can imagine phoenix von karma... No wait, I can't.

^Click to go to my sigs^

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Thu May 31, 2007 10:58 pm

Mr. Wright

Attorney at daytime, Detective at night

Gender: None specified

Rank: Suspect

Joined: Sun Apr 22, 2007 2:01 pm

Posts: 24

DeKiller could be a defendant on that game.

Re: Concept: Playing as the prosecution

Sat Jun 02, 2007 4:40 pm

squints1318

Commander Shepard

Gender: Male

Rank: Decisive Witness

Joined: Tue Feb 27, 2007 10:19 pm

Posts: 221

Playing as a prosecutor is a really interesting concept, and would be really fun if it is done right. You would have to investigate the scene with the police, gather important evidence, and interview the witnesses, and decide if their testimony is good enough for court. There could be a life bar, showing how convinced the Judge is. If it fills up, he will declare the defendant "Guilty". If it goes down to nothing, he declares the defendant "Not Guilty." You could even have the chance to alter the testimonies if your witnesses, if anything sounds bad for your case.
However, if done wrong, a prosecutor game would be really tedious and boring.