...Are there any black characters in PW?*Possible Spoilers*
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Re: ...Are there any black characters in PW?*Possible Spoilers*
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There tend to be less black characters in Japanese entertainment because there are less black people in Japan. But just have a look at the profile pictures. They do exist, albeit more so in recent releases.
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FabuVinny wrote:
Godot, the Marshalls, the Gramaryes...
There tend to be less black characters in Japanese entertainment because there are less black people in Japan. But just have a look at the profile pictures. They do exist, albeit more so in recent releases.
There tend to be less black characters in Japanese entertainment because there are less black people in Japan. But just have a look at the profile pictures. They do exist, albeit more so in recent releases.
What the fuck. None of the characters you mentioned are black. They're just tanned. Several of my friends are tanned but that doesn't mean they're black.
fuck
Re: ...Are there any black characters in PW?*Possible Spoilers*
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As Darzie said, all those characters are tanned, either from getting a tan or having it naturally from being latino/native american/whatever; I don't think any of them are African.
(I noticed this too, a while ago, 'cause for my fanfic I had an African American victim, so I wanted to make a profile pic, so I tried to get a profile pic of an African American PW character to edit it, and then I realized that there were none...)
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Re: ...Are there any black characters in PW?*Possible Spoilers*
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Johnny Rotan wrote:
The only one i know of is Lotta.
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I'd like for them to do it sometime, as long as they didn't feel the need to make a big deal about the character's origin and reason for being there and such. It could get really stereotypical really fast.
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Croik wrote:
It's got nothing to do with prejudice or controversy - the games take place in Japan, so while you sometimes get characters that are foreign, they're more likely to be American, European, or East Asian. There just isn't a large population of African Americans in Japan.
I'd like for them to do it sometime, as long as they didn't feel the need to make a big deal about the character's origin and reason for being there and such. It could get really stereotypical really fast.
I'd like for them to do it sometime, as long as they didn't feel the need to make a big deal about the character's origin and reason for being there and such. It could get really stereotypical really fast.
Dito. You can guess some of the character's origin countries by their names (for example "Diego Armando"; Diego is a common Spanish name and Diego is tanned, so he's most likely from Spain or at least his parents) and looks, but none of them seem to come from Africa.
And IF they have an African person in the series one day - It shouldn't be too important in the game. The personality is still more important.
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But you are correct, almost none of the characters appear to have been of African anscestory, with the exception of Lotta Hart.
The Gramarye clan, if they are indeed from the African continent, appear to be from either from Morocco or Egypt.
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Kimia wrote:
But you are correct, almost none of the characters appear to have been of African anscestory, with the exception of Lotta Hart.
Where is this idea of Lotta as a foreigner coming from? In the Japanese version she's from the Kansai region, and in the American she's a southerner. Or is this just a fro reference?
Re: ...Are there any black characters in PW?*Possible Spoilers*
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Croik wrote:
Kimia wrote:
But you are correct, almost none of the characters appear to have been of African anscestory, with the exception of Lotta Hart.
Where is this idea of Lotta as a foreigner coming from?
Probably Morgan.
Zak might be Egyptian/Moroccan. I don't get any vibe like that from any other characters (definitely not from Valant, it's more difficult for Magnifi). But that's still not as "black" as people usually image when you talk about blacks...
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Croik wrote:
It's got nothing to do with prejudice or controversy - the games take place in Japan, so while you sometimes get characters that are foreign, they're more likely to be American, European, or East Asian. There just isn't a large population of African Americans in Japan.
I'd like for them to do it sometime, as long as they didn't feel the need to make a big deal about the character's origin and reason for being there and such. It could get really stereotypical really fast.
I'd like for them to do it sometime, as long as they didn't feel the need to make a big deal about the character's origin and reason for being there and such. It could get really stereotypical really fast.
A lot of dialogue suggests that the game takes place in America...
I always thought it was written by Japanese people, and followed a lot of Japanese Law, but took place in America. I remember quotes from 1-2 and 2-4 specifically re-inforcing this point.
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Bad Player wrote:
Zak might be Egyptian/Moroccan. I don't get any vibe like that from any other characters (definitely not from Valant, it's more difficult for Magnifi). But that's still not as "black" as people usually image when you talk about blacks...
I think Zak is Indian. (as in India)
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Well, as stated above, consider that the story takes place in Japan, and in norther Japan, you don't see a lot of different colors--I know, I've been. So I think its interesting to see how Capcom Japan has interpreted a lot of different races and ethnicities in the game.
For example, even though its Japanese, you know the von Karmas are German.
And how Lotta Heart in the Japanese version was from southern Japan (somewhere around Osaka, but I can't remember off the top of my head) and how she was a southern American in the American version.
The Garyuus/Gavins should make plenty of sense if you know about culture and subculture of both America and Japan. Like, their tan skin? I can argue that they are modern day ganguro, like moi
(since there are two kinds, the natural bred and fashion statement). As far as their American reference, well...considering Klavier's rock star life and such, I just assumed he presided somewhere sunny and enjoyed tanning--who knows 
The Marshals were just southern cowboys to me, so their skin doesn't surprise me due to the reference.
Acro and Bat were Natives (to their respective parts depending on the version you played) but if most of their referencing comes from the stereotypical American Native, then that should answer that question.
Or how Godot/Diego was interpreted as an American Latino, and that showed in both versions.
Also, I never considered a Middle East influence with the Troupe, but now that I hear it, it would make sense. I could also say southern Italy or around there maybe?
Also, the more south you go in Asia, the darker skin you tend to have. And due to emigrating patterns and natural interest and blah blah blah--the point is, it isn't all that surprising to see the many different shades and multiculturality you do in the game.
However, sadly I would say there are no people who you refer to as "American Black." I'd honestly say the closest you COULD get was the Judge, but then you saw his no-nothing brother who was clearly not Black. Hey, GS isn't done yet, who knows, it might happen!
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Enter The Jaws Theme wrote:
However, sadly I would say there are no people who you refer to as "American Black." I'd honestly say the closest you COULD get was the Judge, but then you saw his no-nothing brother who was clearly not Black. Hey, GS isn't done yet, who knows, it might happen!
...since when was the Judge black?
I'd say the closest we have to a black person (at the moment) would be Lotta. Judging by the combination of facial features and skin tone...I'm guessing she's maybe mixed-race? Like, half black and half white? I dunno, just throwin' that possibility out there.
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Re: ...Are there any black characters in PW?*Possible Spoilers*
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Anna Cassidy wrote:
Enter The Jaws Theme wrote:
However, sadly I would say there are no people who you refer to as "American Black." I'd honestly say the closest you COULD get was the Judge, but then you saw his no-nothing brother who was clearly not Black. Hey, GS isn't done yet, who knows, it might happen!
...since when was the Judge black?
I'd say the closest we have to a black person (at the moment) would be Lotta. Judging by the combination of facial features and skin tone...I'm guessing she's maybe mixed-race? Like, half black and half white? I dunno, just throwin' that possibility out there.
Sorry, but last time I saw her, Lotta was white.
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And you TELL ME THE JUDGE DOESN'T LOOK LIKE THE JUDGE FROM THE FRESH PRINCE WHO WAS CLEARLY BLACK. TELL ME TO MY FACE!
As I stated above, speculation is great and all, but we'll just have to wait for some proof, ja?
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Re: ...Are there any black characters in PW?*Possible Spoilers*
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burninator59 wrote:
...godot is NOT black. he is definintely hispanic.
Spoiler:
Nobody said he was black Oo
... The judge? Black? Wtf?
I want evidence for that!
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Enter The Jaws Theme wrote:
Now now, just because she's southern, she's Black now? Tsk tsk tsk, haven't been south lately, have we? There are plenty of white southern belles who have her look.
...Uh, it's not because she's Southern. It's because of her facial features. :/
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Enter The Jaws Theme wrote:
Also, I never considered a Middle East influence with the Troupe, but now that I hear it, it would make sense. I could also say southern Italy or around there maybe?
For the actual Gramaryes (i.e., those born with the Gramarye last name), I'd say Italian, but it could go a little closer to eastern Europe...
Shadi Enigmar, though: How can you not get this? CLEAR Middle Eastern. Or fairly clear. Skin tone + name = middle eastern badass.
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Anna Cassidy wrote:
Enter The Jaws Theme wrote:
Now now, just because she's southern, she's Black now? Tsk tsk tsk, haven't been south lately, have we? There are plenty of white southern belles who have her look.
...Uh, it's not because she's Southern. It's because of her facial features. :/
Furthermore, her skin tone isn't strictly white. More of a high yellow. I've seen biracial black people with Lotta's skin tone and facial features. The red hair, however, is a new one. Wig/dye, maybe?
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KriimIanga wrote:
Anna Cassidy wrote:
...Uh, it's not because she's Southern. It's because of her facial features. :/
Furthermore, her skin tone isn't strictly white. More of a high yellow. I've seen biracial black people with Lotta's skin tone and facial features. The red hair, however, is a new one. Wig/dye, maybe?
Her face can't be chubby or different, eh? And her skin can't be more olive than pink, ja?? I see... Well then, let's settle this, hmm?
Alright then, since we're so avid on debating this, where's the evidence?
Prove it clearly, and you'll sell your point.
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And ETJT, in the Japanese version the Karmas are American and there is no indication that Kaminogi is Hispanic. Skin tone and color is never really drawn attention to in the Japanese games, except in the cases of the Marshalls (whom everyone assumes to be American, even though they're really Japanese) and Max (who Maya was disappointed to realize was not a foreigner). Then you have the Karmas and the Gavins who have Japanese names despite Franziska and Klavier doing their scholing in America.
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Re: ...Are there any black characters in PW?*Possible Spoilers*
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Croik wrote:
Guys, Lotta was designed to be a stereotypical Osakan: red-hair, accent, personality and all. There is pretty much no chance that they intended for her to be anything but that.
And ETJT, in the Japanese version the Karmas are American and there is no indication that Kaminogi is Hispanic. Skin tone and color is never really drawn attention to in the Japanese games, except in the cases of the Marshalls (whom everyone assumes to be American, even though they're really Japanese) and Max (who Maya was disappointed to realize was not a foreigner). Then you have the Karmas and the Gavins who have Japanese names despite Franziska and Klavier doing their scholing in America.
And ETJT, in the Japanese version the Karmas are American and there is no indication that Kaminogi is Hispanic. Skin tone and color is never really drawn attention to in the Japanese games, except in the cases of the Marshalls (whom everyone assumes to be American, even though they're really Japanese) and Max (who Maya was disappointed to realize was not a foreigner). Then you have the Karmas and the Gavins who have Japanese names despite Franziska and Klavier doing their scholing in America.
That's what I thought too. Basically, everyone in the Japanese versions is Japanese unless stated otherwise. The localization team put ethnities on the characters for what ever reason they felt necessary (America is a very diverse place, after all).
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Re: ...Are there any black characters in PW?*Possible Spoilers*
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Bad Player wrote:
Black means African. (And typically African American in the USA.)
What happened to Caribbean peoples? They aren't black anymore?
In my opinion, the only truly black character in the series is Joe Darke.
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Perrydotto wrote:
burninator59 wrote:
...godot is NOT black. he is definintely hispanic.
Spoiler:
Nobody said he was black Oo
... The judge? Black? Wtf?
I want evidence for that!
yeah someone said that he was
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Gyakuten Phoenix wrote:
The question isn't about the Japanese version, though. It's clearly asking for characters in "Phoenix Wright" which would be the American or European version. I think Lotta may have a black parent, but aside from her afro and maybe her mouth, she doesn't really have any features to suggest she's black.
Sorry for not elaborating earlier, but what I meant by that is this game is orignally Japanese in origin; therefore, every character in the game is Japanese (excepted where noted). Bringing the game to American changes all the characters to Americans (except where noted). Since America is a deverse place, and many of the characters already had different skin tones, the localization team made all the characters different ethnicities for whatever reason they felt they needed. Whether any of those placed ethnicities are black, is a matter of opinion it seems.
TL; DR: No, there are no black characters in Phoenix Wright because they're were none in the Japanese version.
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Lunaria42 wrote:
Whether any of those placed ethnicities are black, is a matter of opinion it seems.
TL; DR: No, there are no black characters in Phoenix Wright because they're were none in the Japanese version.
TL; DR: No, there are no black characters in Phoenix Wright because they're were none in the Japanese version.
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Gyakuten Phoenix wrote:
Lunaria42 wrote:
Whether any of those placed ethnicities are black, is a matter of opinion it seems.
TL; DR: No, there are no black characters in Phoenix Wright because they're were none in the Japanese version.
TL; DR: No, there are no black characters in Phoenix Wright because they're were none in the Japanese version.
Basically, Lunaria's saying that since the Japanese version didn't have any characters who were intended to be black, there's none in the American version either. You can try and argue "But, in the American version..." all you want, but fact of the matter is that the American version was made by Japanese people as well. It just happened to be localized by Americans, but that's all. They had nothing to do with the character creation or anything like that.
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However, the localization team has the right to change the heritage of any character they want, and I sorta see Lotta coming across as black. Somewhat.
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crouton wrote:
Gyakuten Phoenix wrote:
Lunaria42 wrote:
Whether any of those placed ethnicities are black, is a matter of opinion it seems.
TL; DR: No, there are no black characters in Phoenix Wright because they're were none in the Japanese version.
TL; DR: No, there are no black characters in Phoenix Wright because they're were none in the Japanese version.
Basically, Lunaria's saying that since the Japanese version didn't have any characters who were intended to be black, there's none in the American version either. You can try and argue "But, in the American version..." all you want, but fact of the matter is that the American version was made by Japanese people as well. It just happened to be localized by Americans, but that's all. They had nothing to do with the character creation or anything like that.
Yes, that is what I was saying.
Gyakuten Phoenix wrote:
Yes, I understand this. I was just pointing out the inconsistency between the two points that were made.
However, the localization team has the right to change the heritage of any character they want, and I sorta see Lotta coming across as black. Somewhat.
However, the localization team has the right to change the heritage of any character they want, and I sorta see Lotta coming across as black. Somewhat.
What I meant by "is a matter of opinion it seems" is that if you want to believe a character is black, by all means do so (argue about it all you want either way), but that is not what the original intentions of the creators of the game was. I don't think I was being inconsisent at all. I was just saying that it seems that some people believe characters are black, and others don't.
I can see why people think Lotta is black (I think it mainly has to do with her hair and her skin tone), but nothing else about her says that she's black to me. None of the other characters seem black to me either.
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someOen wrote:
This may be a little bump but I remembered that the victim from 3-2 has kinda dark skin, at least. Can't remember his name right now.
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"Yeah, I wouldn't go asking random guys if you can lick their penor." crouton December 2009
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