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Re: The World Ends With You (yeah, that's the real name)Topic%20Title
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i think this game is pretty good :)

well, although the characters make me sick.... I think the music is also pretty good!
Re: The World Ends With You (yeah, that's the real name)Topic%20Title
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I like the EP version of Three Minutes Clapping out of all the OSTs. TWEWY has a good soundtrack overall, topping that of Persona 3 and 4 when it comes to RPGs. But overall, the best OST in any series is Guilty Gear hands down.
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Re: The World Ends With You (yeah, that's the real name)Topic%20Title

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Harry Miste wrote:
I've had enough time to make a judgement on it, so here's my review and opinion on it:

Spoiler: TWEWY
OVERVIEW
You play as Neku Sakuraba, a whinge-bag emo who happens to be the possessor of both luckiest and unluckiest bastard on the planet. Lucky as in he manages to avoid death, unlucky that he has to compete in a bloodsport to win his life back. Oh, and he has an epiphany about the value of friendship and shit; I zoned out about Week 1, Day 4. The game builds around the dual-screen combat, which has its moments but is ultimately annoying. There's also a Trend system that alters the way the game is played, which doesn't really affect much until the end of the story.

GAMEPLAY
TWEWY does its best to be as fucking annoying as humanly possible. There are two main parts to the battle mode: Neku and his Partner. Neku's combat revolves around collecting pins that have mystical powers, such as shooting lightning or spewing fire from the middle of nowhere. The combat is through the stylus, which can get really annoying because it may mark one line for a seperate one. I've even had parts where I've accidentally healed enemies and had my ass kicked because of it. On the top of the screen is Neku's Partner, which can range from a fashion victim, a gay kid who doesn't hide he's out of the closet (a fact made clearer in the Bizzaro story), and some "hardcore" skateboarder. Each partner possesses a set of attacks. Shiki attacks with a pig/cat doll, Joshua attacks with a phone and Beat attacks with his skateboard. Yeah, not the kind of arsenal you'd expect from a deathmatch, but then again, attacking with magical pins doesn't make sense. The Partners have their own special attack, or Fusion, that is fulfilled by playing a small mini-game with them in combat. Shiki's Fusion is enabled by guessing cards, Joshua's Fusion is activated by trying to get a number higher, lower or the same as a previous one, and Fusion is turned on by playing a bastard form of poker. The Partners are controlled with the D-Pad, which vexxes me to no end since I'm already busy controlling Angsty on the bottom screen. Thankfully, the developers planned ahead of us and gave us the option of having the computer take over the Partners for us. I let the AI take over Ms. Fashion and Mr. Cleargay up until Mr. Internet Tough Guy, where the boss battles became so hard with Neku that I focused on the Partners, who had a good amount of damage that could take out about 7/8 of the bosses (with the exception of the Final Boss).

There's a gameplay factor that can make or break battles: The Trend System. Because the game is taking place in "Fashion Heaven" Shibuya, the clothes you're wearing in the correct districts give your character a boost in battle. Wearing, for instance, Brand A clothes and pins in District A where Brand A is a big trend will give a buff in battle on top of the base stats that Brand A brings. Alternatively, wearing Brand B clothes and pins in District B where Brand B is the least-preferred trend will detract your statistics. I hate myself for saying this, but it's actually important to follow fashion in this game. Because if you don't follow capitalism, you're going to take a hit on the battlefield.

One of my major gripes about the game is in the way it handles unlocking gameplay features. Alright, I can accept having to go through a few battles before trends actually mean something, or unlocking the ability to dash across the stage dodging projectiles, but I draw the fucking line at having to wait until the last boss battle of Week 1 so I can retry battles. I wish I could make this stuff up, but I'm not. Everytime I lost a battle, I was thrust back at the beginning of the chapter. Easy Mode isn't unlocked until you get past half of the first week as well.

Which brings me to my next point, the difficulty. Now, in regular games, the difficulty is designed as a constant level for the game to accomodate the lack of experience for rookies or to give veterans a challenge. But TWEWY spits on common protocol, urinates in its face and takes a Desert Eagle to its kneecaps. The game starts at Normal, and you have to - oh, get ready for this - unlock Easy, Hard and Ultimate as you progress throughout the game. The difficulties will also affect the loot you receive from encounters; Easy is more manageable but you'll receive less loot, Hard is a challenge but you'll get something good out of all the conflict. That isn't the worst part. Even if you're a newbie at it, the game will force you to change difficulties in order to pass several stages.

Here's an example. I was somewhere around Week 2 and I had to get past this roadblock erected by one of the bloodsport's managers. He said that in order to get past, I needed to bring him a pin often found in enemy encounters. 'Fine', says I, scanning for the nearest enemy. Oh, but there's a twist. I need to change my difficulty from Easy to Normal. Worse is that later in the week, I needed to get past another roadblock. Fresh off a Hard Mode challenge, the guy told me I needed to grab another pin in Normal Mode. So I frantically searched around, repeatedly getting my ass kicked because I figured that if Hard Mode was tougher, I might get the pin easier, which actually is true in the game. It wasn't until an hour later when I realised that the specific type of enemy I needed to kill was only on Normal Mode.

This is not innovative, this is frustrating and a complete fuck you to rookies. If I am a novice at the game, I want a difficulty that reflects it. I don't want to have to switch between them so I can progress throughout the game; it is why we have difficulty curves within the difficulty settings. Not only that, but the fact that Easy Mode is less fruitful than its older sister is almost a slap in the face to those who aren't good at it.

Let's move off of the combat and focus on the gameplay that intertwines the combat stages. You control Neku and run around Shibuya. There's stores where you can buy food, pharmaceuticals, clothing, pins and other miscellaneous items; places you'll be visiting fairly often. You can use your Player Pin to scan the screen for enemies and eavesdrop on people's thoughts. I swear, the Thought Fragments are some of the most boring parts in the game. Here's a few I snagged from the Wiki.

Quote:
Ooh, what's that song playing? It really gets my blood pumping!

Bum-chicka, oomph, yeah! Music just ain't music unless you can dance to it!


Quote:
If I ask her out from the phone booth in front of Molco, she's SURE to say yes!

OK, here goes... I'm gonna do it! I'm really gonna do it!


Quote:
All the shirts from their new line are so cool... How can I choose just one? Hell, I'll just buy them all!


Quote:
Wonder if there're shops with skimpier clothes around... I really wanna find out how much skin I can get away with showing!


Quote:
Ooh, those glasses, that lab coat... HAWT. I can't go a single day without dropping into Nishimura Drugs just to gaze at her.


Quote:
Maybe I'll check out a movie at Shibukyu. They always show films you can't see anywhere else.


Imagine all of this times at least twenty. I was bored out of my fucking mind that the only reason I scanned was to either advance the plot or fight enemies. Cycling through everyone's petty mind is just sad, and makes me question our society. At least make them hilarious, like this one:

Quote:
My girlfriend looks just like Eiji Oji (editor: some fucktard Internet celebrity). Wait. Is she really a woman!?


I'll give you all a moment to catch your breath.

Back to the gameplay. There's two mini-games that will happen by way of plot out of combat. The first is Tin Pin, which is a Beyblade clone with your pins. There's very little you can say about it; a nice distraction, but ultimately a boring one once you collect the right pins. You can play it against your friends, provided you'll have one that has the game.

The second is Reaper Creeper; Wicca called, they want their Ouija board back. Idiots use this as a means to gain an answer to a question through supernatural means, claiming that something called a Reaper will move it for them (the Reapers are an actual part of the storyline, but not in this way), and that it never lies. You have to move a coin around a triangle and choose from three options: Yes, No, Neither. The trick is to move it slow; too fast will make people lose faith in you. This is rarely useful, and acts more of a Griefing tool that loses immersion when you realise it doesn't really matter whether you play it or not. Having said that, there is nothing funnier than fucking up a schoolgirl's life through this game.

STORYLINE
As I said, you play as a whingy emo who ends up getting himself killed and thrown into the Reaper's Game, a bloodsport that dead people enter. The catch with the Reaper's Game is that, in order to play, you need to forfeit something of yourself that is dear to you. Sometimes, it's physical; other times, it's mental. You get this wierd pin called a Player Pin that allows you to scan the minds of others. Then, you get a partner and you're thrust into the Underground (UG), a seperate universe to the Realground (RG) with the exception that you can see the RG from the UG. By this stage, you start getting attacked by Noise, monsters that feed off people's negative reactions. When you kill these Noise, positive reactions flow into the area. I am not making this shit up. The game is run by Reapers, dead people with magic powers who look like rejects from Birdhouse. There's also a doll of a cat, or a pig, that attacks people. Yeeaahh.

Anyway, so the catch is that you need a partner to defeat the Noise, or else you die within death; an act known as "Erasure". Then you need to survive for seven days, each day completing some challenge the Game Master, the one who runs the challenge for the week, cooks up for you. Neku gets partnered up with this seamstress/whore-in-attire Shiki Misaki, who constantly tries to get Neku to open up to her. In one scene, she even tries to get into Neku's pants. No, I'm serious, she tries to get into Neku's pants. Don't take that as a sexual term; Neku rips his pants and Shiki repairs it. Yeah, it was certainly odd, but I was beyond the point of caring ever since fashion became important. The Game Master of Week 1 is a burly guy named Yodai Higashizawa, who has a cooking fetish. They meet two other players: Beat, the Internet Tough Guy, and Rhyme, an androgynous kid who follows Beat around like some puppy dog. Surprise twist, Rhyme is Beat's Brother and she doesn't know it. Also, around Day 4, Rhyme is killed by some Reaper trap. This is supposed to be emotional, but I felt detached from them. By Day 6, there's another surprise twist, the body we see Shiki in actually belongs to her friend Eri, who she envied. Day 7 comes around, we kill the chef, and we have to do the whole fucking week over again, this time with Mr. Rainbow.

That's Week 1 for you. Let me speak on a general term of the story. The story can be wrapped up like this: "You die. You come back to life to compete for some sadist. You learn lessons about friendship. Shit happens. The end." The story wasn't greatly compelling, and the characters that I did like were given crazy backstories that made me question why I liked them in the first place.

One of the most obvious ones is Mr. Hanekoma, an unshaven cafe owner. He puts Neku back in his fucking place, which is always good. Unfortunately, the character is ruined when we learn he's Joshua's personal assistant/bitch, and he's CAT, the name of some enigmatic graffiti artist who controls people through the awwwesum powaahhh of art.

Another gripe about the storyline is the complete dumbing-down of it. Now, I admit that the storyline itself is quite complex, but the way the game handles important story events and the story itself was catered to the lowest common denominator of the gene pool. Here's an example. In Week 2, I was tasked to locate X = 30 +74. This translates to finding a pretentious shopping outlet named 104. Now, I ended up one district north of there, but a Reaper blocked it off and wouldn't let me pass. So I had to go the long way. As I was walking, I came across a story event where I was told it. I have more than three brain cells, I think I gathered that, you morons. But the game was adamant in telling me the answer, and I was left with a deep-seated grudge against the game. And I know most of you are holding a grudge against me for ripping off Zero Punctuation, but that scene was so annoying it had to be repeated.

FINAL THOUGHTS
This game is unique in its own right, but the massive amount of flaws were just too annoying to spare it the trouble, along with the so-and-so soundtrack. Then again, if you can get past them, TWEWY is a good game. The gameplay is a clusterfuck, but it's manageable if you don't have good reflexes. There's also the Another Day mode, where you get to view a fucked up version of TWEWY solely focusing on Tin Pin where Joshua is openly gay and Neku is doing his best to suppress emo urges; always fun, but you need to beat the main game first. Just don't go scanning people for fun. There's absolutely no point.


Worst review I ever read. 'Ripping off Zero Punctuation' would imply that it was actually funny, which it wasn't. It was a 10 minute long read consisting of solely bashing the game, where most of the things you bash are optional (come now, you didn't have to scan everyone's mind (and I know you didn't. So don't bash it). You don't have to set the game to easy).

Alright, that x = 70 + 34 was easy. But what happens next?
Acquire the sqrt(3) Au pin.
Developers have to keep in mind that kids play their games too, if they're going to make a game that is suitable for them (and let's face it, this is). How would a bloody kid know that Au is the whatchamacallit for gold? How would a kid know 2.23... is the square root of 5?

It's not the developers' fault if someone's too stupid to follow the Reapers' instructions. That's what you're supposed to do! You don't simply assume anything.

On combat: is it really that hard to memorise the combo map? You don't even have to properly pay attention to the top screen, you just need to glance at it every so often to see if you're attacking the right direction. Is that going to kill you on the lower screen? I think not. You will be able to use fusion anyway, even if you just spam left or right, seeing as the things you need always change places.

Also, 'because if you don't follow capitalism...'? WHAT? This is a GAME. And if this was supposed to be a joke, cue facepalm ascii.

You were thrown back to the start of the chapter because you couldn't retry? Riiight... because there's no save button anywhere, right?

'but the fact that Easy Mode is less fruitful than its older sister is almost a slap in the face to those who aren't good at it'--now this one I hear often. TOO often. If you're NOT good at a game, you do NOT deserve optimal rewards! Not to mention that this is a single player game. Who gives a proverbial about rewards? You don't need them to progress the game, and that's what a single player game is all about. Chances are if you beat the game you're good enough to play on at least Hard mode, and only after you beat the game it really matters what rewards you get.

Going back to the 'x = 70 + 34' thing. You said you were blocked by a reaper. Well, duh, you didn't have a partner--you yourself said you need a partner in order not to die, so this argument is completely moot and only someone who has played the game would know better (read: this part is extremely misleading to someone who's thinking about picking up the game and is reading a few reviews).

In closing: 3/10 for the effort but you completely failed at objectively reviewing the game. Your review was littered with swears which was completely unnecessary in every respect, unless your goal was really to rip off Zero Punctuation... but you should've known from the start that a text version of Zero Punctuation would fail.
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Re: The World Ends With You (yeah, that's the real name)Topic%20Title
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I wasn't trying to be funny. I wasn't trying to plagarise the WHOLE review, just that last part about X = 70 + 34. Everything else was my own writing, and you mistook my words (though this may be a mistake on my part for not writing it correctly). But at least somebody knows that I suck at writing.
Oh, and perhaps I should have renamed it a rant rather than a review. That would have fit more.

Quote:
It's not the developers' fault if someone's too stupid to follow the Reapers' instructions. That's what you're supposed to do! You don't simply assume anything.

Then why not just have the hints optional for those who can't get it and leave those who can get it?

Quote:
'but the fact that Easy Mode is less fruitful than its older sister is almost a slap in the face to those who aren't good at it'--now this one I hear often. TOO often. If you're NOT good at a game, you do NOT deserve optimal rewards!

This can vary from person to person. Somebody might be able to pick it up right away and can get through their first playthrough on Hard, others may struggle to beat it on Easy. But when the game forces you to switch between difficulties on the fly - difficulties that some players may not be accustomed to - to progress through the game, all it creates is grief. Which is why it would have been easier if there was just four difficulty levels that you picked at the start of the game, and stayed at that level unless you wanted to change it. If the player doesn't deserve the bigger, optional rewards, then they don't get it. If you get better, then you deserve the rewards. That wasn't my point. My point was that Easy Mode was less rewarding and, therefore, did not have loot that was needed to progress through the game.

Quote:
(come now, you didn't have to scan everyone's mind (and I know you didn't. So don't bash it).

I did, because I was following the idea that if I didn't do it, then I might have missed out on an important hint. Which often helped getting clues from cameo characters scattered throughout the game (Shooter and Mick's boss in Week 1).

Quote:
It was a 10 minute long read consisting of solely bashing the game

Did you miss the part right at the end where I did give some positive aspects of the game? And the follow-up post?

Quote:
Going back to the 'x = 70 + 34' thing. You said you were blocked by a reaper. Well, duh, you didn't have a partner--you yourself said you need a partner in order not to die, so this argument is completely moot and only someone who has played the game would know better

Yes, but I had no problem with that. I understood that a Pact needed to be formed to pass through the Reaper. My problem was that the long way told you the answer to what was supposed to be a riddle.

Quote:
On combat: is it really that hard to memorise the combo map? You don't even have to properly pay attention to the top screen, you just need to glance at it every so often to see if you're attacking the right direction. Is that going to kill you on the lower screen? I think not. You will be able to use fusion anyway, even if you just spam left or right, seeing as the things you need always change places.

You do realise that the combo map randomly changes at times (yes, I bought the items that changed them into a shape, but my point still stands for those who didn't). And I actually needed to pay attention to the top screen, because if my partner lost all of their preliminary health, Neku would have died easier. So yes, I was paying attention at both screens. Not only that, but I also needed to guarantee I had the fusion at some points.
I'll give you an example. I was fighting Leo Cantus with Joshua, where I was not yet caring for the partner, just keeping it alive when I needed to and letting it to its own devices. Guess what? At the very last moment of the battle, where both of us were down to our last health, I had just got a fusion from my AI partner, who had taken a considerable amount of time to acquire it. By the time it was ready to be deployed, the Noise took a shot at me and I died.

Quote:
You were thrown back to the start of the chapter because you couldn't retry? Riiight... because there's no save button anywhere, right?

Which isn't accessible until Day 2. Granted, I hadn't saved until the end of chapters, but that was because I was too busy playing the game than focus on saving - which, in retrospect, is what I should have been doing.
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Harry Miste wrote:
Quote:
'but the fact that Easy Mode is less fruitful than its older sister is almost a slap in the face to those who aren't good at it'--now this one I hear often. TOO often. If you're NOT good at a game, you do NOT deserve optimal rewards!

This can vary from person to person. Somebody might be able to pick it up right away and can get through their first playthrough on Hard, others may struggle to beat it on Easy. But when the game forces you to switch between difficulties on the fly - difficulties that some players may not be accustomed to - to progress through the game, all it creates is grief. Which is why it would have been easier if there was just four difficulty levels that you picked at the start of the game, and stayed at that level unless you wanted to change it. If the player doesn't deserve the bigger, optional rewards, then they don't get it. If you get better, then you deserve the rewards. That wasn't my point. My point was that Easy Mode was less rewarding and, therefore, did not have loot that was needed to progress through the game.

Easy mode changes the which pins you get from monsters, not how many you get. So you can still get fine pins, plus all the pins in the stores and in story events are exactly the same, plus the pins can evolve into stronger pins! Plus, pins aren't the end-all be-all; there's a lot of skill, too. So there might be a shallow learning curve, but the pins don't have much to do with it. And, even if you don't get pins as good as in other modes (of course, not every easy pin is worse than other pins, but anyway) do you really need them since you're in an easier mode?

Quote:
Quote:
(come now, you didn't have to scan everyone's mind (and I know you didn't. So don't bash it).

I did, because I was following the idea that if I didn't do it, then I might have missed out on an important hint. Which often helped getting clues from cameo characters scattered throughout the game (Shooter and Mick's boss in Week 1).

First you complain that they feed you the answers to the riddle, and then you complain that it is too tedious getting hints for them. Make up your mind.

Quote:
Quote:
On combat: is it really that hard to memorise the combo map? You don't even have to properly pay attention to the top screen, you just need to glance at it every so often to see if you're attacking the right direction. Is that going to kill you on the lower screen? I think not. You will be able to use fusion anyway, even if you just spam left or right, seeing as the things you need always change places.

You do realise that the combo map randomly changes at times (yes, I bought the items that changed them into a shape, but my point still stands for those who didn't). And I actually needed to pay attention to the top screen, because if my partner lost all of their preliminary health, Neku would have died easier. So yes, I was paying attention at both screens. Not only that, but I also needed to guarantee I had the fusion at some points.
I'll give you an example. I was fighting Leo Cantus with Joshua, where I was not yet caring for the partner, just keeping it alive when I needed to and letting it to its own devices. Guess what? At the very last moment of the battle, where both of us were down to our last health, I had just got a fusion from my AI partner, who had taken a considerable amount of time to acquire it. By the time it was ready to be deployed, the Noise took a shot at me and I died.

Like AZ said, just spam left and right, checking to make sure that you're doing it in the right direction. It works, and it gets plenty of fusions. It got me through the entire game xDD

Quote:
Quote:
You were thrown back to the start of the chapter because you couldn't retry? Riiight... because there's no save button anywhere, right?

Which isn't accessible until Day 2. Granted, I hadn't saved until the end of chapters, but that was because I was too busy playing the game than focus on saving - which, in retrospect, is what I should have been doing.

You can't save until 5 minutes in? How horrible! And if you die, you need to replay possibly 10 minutes? Even worse!
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:D I finally got enough BRV for Josh to wear Pi-Face's Jeans!

Leo Cantus, kiss my ***
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Okay. You have to be an idiot to die on the first day. When I picked it up, I didn't DIE ON THE FIRST GODDAMN DAY. I actually had the most trouble in the third week. Taboo noise were my only threat besides the boss.
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DokenMaster wrote:
Okay. You have to be an idiot to die on the first day. When I picked it up, I didn't DIE ON THE FIRST GODDAMN DAY. I actually had the most trouble in the third week. Taboo noise were my only threat besides the boss.


Actually, Doken, don't you remember?

You CAN'T die on the first day! You can die on either the second or third (One of the two, is when they post an alert saying "As of this point on, if you lose all your HP, your game ends" or something like that... but it is NOT on the first day!)!!!
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Harry Miste wrote:
Oh, and perhaps I should have renamed it a rant rather than a review. That would have fit more.


This

</crappyreviewdiscussion>
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rednano12 wrote:
Harry Miste wrote:
Oh, and perhaps I should have renamed it a rant rather than a review. That would have fit more.


This

</crappyreviewdiscussion>

I second the end of this crappy review discussion. I will jam one of my limitless massive wangs in it. Now... erm...
Ah, yes, getting back now to wether Sho is still alive or not.
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Wrestlemania wrote:
DokenMaster wrote:
Okay. You have to be an idiot to die on the first day. When I picked it up, I didn't DIE ON THE FIRST GODDAMN DAY. I actually had the most trouble in the third week. Taboo noise were my only threat besides the boss.


Actually, Doken, don't you remember?

You CAN'T die on the first day! You can die on either the second or third (One of the two, is when they post an alert saying "As of this point on, if you lose all your HP, your game ends" or something like that... but it is NOT on the first day!)!!!

Idiocy sometimes defies programming. xD
And Sho is still alive. He just got... (in the words of Chris Tucker) GOT KNOCKED THE FUCK OUT... by the Composer. If he was dead, we wouldn't see his body under all that junk now would we?
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Spoiler: Happy now, Wrestle? also, retroactive reply ftw!
Maybe Sho and Josh are secret gay lovers and Josh made a replica of Sho (or he used his supa-powers to go to Chrono Trigger and get a Doppel Doll) and placed it under the junk?

:will:

But Sho is crazy and taboo and stuff, so we don't know. He was already erased once. Maybe he's still classified as "erased", so he can't be erased again?

And even if Sho is still alive, Josh could come and erase him at any time since he's pinned under the garbage, so it's kinda pointless to talk about it...

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Last edited by Bad Player on Mon Apr 13, 2009 10:07 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler: End of the Game
Maybe Sho and Josh are secret gay lovers and Josh made a replica of Sho (or he used his supa-powers to go to Chrono Trigger and get a Doppel Doll) and placed it under the junk?

:will:

But Sho is crazy and taboo and stuff, so we don't know. He was already erased once. Maybe he's still classified as "erased", so he can't be erased again?

And even if Sho is still alive, Josh could come and erase him at any time since he's pinned under the garbage, so it's kinda pointless to talk about it...


1. We should REALLY stick to spoiler tags...

Spoiler: End of the Game
Actually, it's NOT pointless to discuss it... Joshua has no reason to kill Sho, and as we know, Joshua never does anything unless he feels a need to do it (Or if he wants to bother someone like Neku, as he does numerous times)... maybe Sho got out from under the trash heap and recovered elsewhere while Neku was fighting Megumi or something... Heck, we never check to see Sho's status, such as a pulse (which would've been interesting...), so for all we know, he was playing possum under the vending machine & car...

Keep in mind, he was in Taboo Sho Form, for all we know, he could easily push those off of him... works for Neku with his pins... *shrugs*

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Spoiler:
Yeah, the fact that Sho is super-powered and is trying with all his might to kill Josh is no reason to kill him. >_> Josh probably wouldn't just leave him there for no reason.

Also, you said it's not pointless to discuss it, but you never explained why.




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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
Yeah, the fact that Sho is super-powered and is trying with all his might to kill Josh is no reason to kill him. >_> Josh probably wouldn't just leave him there for no reason.

Also, you said it's not pointless to discuss it, but you never explained why.


Spoiler: My Reply
Because we're still discussing it, AND the idea Joshua would find him a threat is ridiculous... Sho'd have to eat "Slabs Of Ham, Celery And Horseradish, Tons Of Asparagus" by the droves before he'd be able to pose a challenge to Joshua... I mean, did Joshua look HURT from his "fight"?




Bad Player wrote:
offtopic: Why is Rawk Hawk your avatar? I've been wondering a while...


Because CR RAWWWWWWWKS!!!... Hey, that's the reason I posted originally and I'm sticking too it! That, and I can't think of a new Avatar... Heh...
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.... you had to put that pun, didn't you?
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Wrestlemania wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
Yeah, the fact that Sho is super-powered and is trying with all his might to kill Josh is no reason to kill him. >_> Josh probably wouldn't just leave him there for no reason.

Also, you said it's not pointless to discuss it, but you never explained why.


Spoiler: My Reply
Because we're still discussing it, AND the idea Joshua would find him a threat is ridiculous... Sho'd have to eat "Slabs Of Ham, Celery And Horseradish, Tons Of Asparagus" by the droves before he'd be able to pose a challenge to Joshua... I mean, did Joshua look HURT from his "fight"?


Spoiler: Beware~ Secret Report spoilers
Sho was Hanekoma's last resort to prevent Shibuya from being destroyed. At least Taboo!Sho posed a threat to Hanekoma, otherwise he wouldn't have supported Sho.

And we can discuss which shade of green we think makes asparagus look most appealing, but that doesn't make it not pointless to discuss it :-P

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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler: Beare~ Secret Report spoilers
Sho was Hanekoma's last resort to prevent Shibuya from being destroyed. At least Taboo!Sho posed a threat to Hanekoma, otherwise he wouldn't have supported Sho.

And we can discuss which shade of green we think makes asparagus look most appealing, but that doesn't make it not pointless to discuss it :-P


Spoiler: My Reply... Again. Heh...
There's quite a difference between Hanekoma and Joshua, though... We're not talking about Hanekoma here, we're talking about someone more powerful than Hanekoma: The Composer.


And it's Lime Green, BP. :zenitora:
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Spoiler:
You said that Sho wasn't a threat, but Sho had to be a threat if Hanekoma picked him.

And shouldn't Hanekoma be stronger than Josh, since he's an angel and Josh isn't? o_O

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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
You said that Sho wasn't a threat, but Sho had to be a threat if Hanekoma picked him.

And shouldn't Hanekoma be stronger than Josh, since he's an angel and Josh isn't? o_O


Spoiler: My Reply... Again. Heh...
For Sho not being a threat, I stand by how he wasn't one to Joshua... I believe that Hanekoma overestimated the abilities of Sho.

And Hanekoma isn't stronger than Josh... otherwise, why they heck did he try recruiting Sho in the first place!? He wouldn't need SHO if he was already able to take out Joshua!

"The Composer" is also an Angel! I mean, his item is called "Angel Feather" for crying out loud!!!

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And that is why I always question it when people mention Taboo Noise.
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Wrestlemania wrote:
Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
You said that Sho wasn't a threat, but Sho had to be a threat if Hanekoma picked him.

And shouldn't Hanekoma be stronger than Josh, since he's an angel and Josh isn't? o_O


Spoiler: My Reply... Again. Heh...
For Sho not being a threat, I stand by how he wasn't one to Joshua... I believe that Hanekoma overestimated the abilities of Sho.

And Hanekoma isn't stronger than Josh... otherwise, why they heck did he try recruiting Sho in the first place!? He wouldn't need SHO if he was already able to take out Joshua!

"The Composer" is also an Angel! I mean, his item is called "Angel Feather" for crying out loud!!!


Spoiler:
I knew you would say that! It's because that's exactly what I thought ^^

I don't really remember the Secret Reports that well... Didn't he say "the best players become reaper, the best reapers the composer, and the best composers angels"? Also (this part I'm even less sure of) didn't it say something about him not being able to get involved?

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So what did you people think about the soundtrack? I loved it. My personal favourite song is Three Minutes Clapping.
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Ember-the-prosecutor wrote:
So what did you people think about the soundtrack? I loved it. My personal favourite song is Three Minutes Clapping.


Loved it so much I went out and bought it, the one with the english songs included too.

Best soundtrack ever. Three minutes clapping is an awesome song but I prefer Deja Vu, Transformation (Transformed) and my all time favourite is the One Star.
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Herr Blondie wrote:
Ember-the-prosecutor wrote:
So what did you people think about the soundtrack? I loved it. My personal favourite song is Three Minutes Clapping.


Loved it so much I went out and bought it, the one with the english songs included too.

Best soundtrack ever. Three minutes clapping is an awesome song but I prefer Deja Vu, Transformation (Transformed) and my all time favourite is the One Star.

Ah, I should buy it too. It's pretty cheap on iTunes after all.

Are there any differences between the soundtrack in the Japanese version and the PAL/American version?
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Ember-the-prosecutor wrote:
Herr Blondie wrote:
Ember-the-prosecutor wrote:
So what did you people think about the soundtrack? I loved it. My personal favourite song is Three Minutes Clapping.


Loved it so much I went out and bought it, the one with the english songs included too.

Best soundtrack ever. Three minutes clapping is an awesome song but I prefer Deja Vu, Transformation (Transformed) and my all time favourite is the One Star.

Ah, I should buy it too. It's pretty cheap on iTunes after all.

Are there any differences between the soundtrack in the Japanese version and the PAL/American version?


You betcha, the International Soundtrack has Three Minutes Clapping (plus a live version), Deju Vu (and it's horrid disco version), The One Star and Transformation (complete with Transformed) on it to replace....fighting for freedom and some other song...however it doesn't have all the tracks but it's got more than the japanese one.

Lullabye for You and Emptyness And, aren't on the international one but since the international one has more songs....I imagine the Japanese one misses some out as well.
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Also to comment on the ongoing Josh VS Hanaekoma debate......

Spoiler: Yarr here be spoilaaarrrs
In the secret ending Joshua is shown in his true form ya? Hanaekoma also shows his true form as he grows wings (note true form not noise form...but Another day isn't Canon it says anyway). Since due to all the talk about frequencies affecting how something is visible in a world is going on about like players exist on a frequency that can't be seen by normal people but Reapers can move through some. Here's a thought.....if Joshua's form in the special ending is STILL blurring and unclear doesn't that mean he is operating at a higher frequency (and therefore power) than Hanaekoma when he sprouts his wings

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Spoiler:
I don't think the frequencies work like that... If you're on a higher frequency, they just can't see you. You don't get all blurred. Besides, even if Josh were in a higher frequency than Hanekoma then, it doesn't mean that Hanekoma couldn't go to an even higher frequency if he didn't want to.


Oh, and Another Day is totally canon. For that dimension. It just takes place in a different dimension than the main game, get it? Although the Hanekoma you fight is the same.

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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
I don't think the frequencies work like that... If you're on a higher frequency, they just can't see you. You don't get all blurred. Besides, even if Josh were in a higher frequency than Hanekoma then, it doesn't mean that Hanekoma couldn't go to an even higher frequency if he didn't want to.


Oh, and Another Day is totally canon. For that dimension. It just takes place in a different dimension than the main game, get it? Although the Hanekoma you fight is the same.


Spoiler: YAAR SPOILARS HO!
It also says the events are totally unconnected to the main game too ya? And if Hanaekoma's wings were showing then surely that implies he's at his highest frequency.

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Spoiler:
They are unconnected to the main game, but that doesn't make it non-canon :P

Just because he has his wings doesn't mean he's at his highest frequency. He's gotta be able to go to a higher frequency to switch dimensions and go to angel-world.

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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
They are unconnected to the main game, but that doesn't make it non-canon :P

Just because he has his wings doesn't mean he's at his highest frequency. He's gotta be able to go to a higher frequency to switch dimensions and go to angel-world.


Spoiler: Arrr me throat be sore...these spoilarrs be needing a lozenge.
Ok....well look at it this way....say Hanekoma with his wings isn't in his highest form....who's to say he's still not weaker than Joshua. My reasoning is that consistantly throughout the game, Reaper's highest form has wings, even including noise form, only one step above wings are spottable. This implies that the forms work where the person develops wings before obtaining a final 'noise' form. Now by this logic, Hanaekoma's winged form is one step below his ultimate of two noise simultaneously, however when we apply this logic to Joshua not even can we not SEE his form, but what we can see there isn't even wings, Joshua could have two or even 3 forms more to go along this step of evolution proving his might over Hanaekoma.

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Spoiler:
We don't know why the Reapers have wings. Players and Reapers are both in the UG, but only Reapers have wings. Neku is stronger than all the Reapers, but he doesn't get wings, so wings aren't an indicator of power.

Also, Josh can lower his power from his God-form to his teen-form. Those wings on Hanekoma could just be a lower form that he can change into when he feels like it.

Because people with lots of power can change their appearance, we can't gauge their power by their appearance because we have no way of knowing which is their highest form. However, looking at the simple hierarchy Angels > Composer > Reapers > Players, Hanekoma would be stronger than Josh.


EDIT: Of course, look at what I just said: Neku, a player, is stronger than the Reapers. But the Reapers are higher on the hierarchy than players. So if a super-strong player can be stronger than a reaper, a super-strong composer can be stronger than an angel.

But then again, we have no idea if Josh is a super-strong composer, a regular one, or even a below-average one.


...We have absolutely no way of knowing, looking at all the layers of the TWEWY world xD

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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
We don't know why the Reapers have wings. Players and Reapers are both in the UG, but only Reapers have wings. Neku is stronger than all the Reapers, but he doesn't get wings, so wings aren't an indicator of power.

Also, Josh can lower his power from his God-form to his teen-form. Those wings on Hanekoma could just be a lower form that he can change into when he feels like it.

Because people with lots of power can change their appearance, we can't gauge their power by their appearance because we have no way of knowing which is their highest form. However, looking at the simple hierarchy Angels > Composer > Reapers > Players, Hanekoma would be stronger than Josh.


EDIT: Of course, look at what I just said: Neku, a player, is stronger than the Reapers. But the Reapers are higher on the hierarchy than players. So if a super-strong player can be stronger than a reaper, a super-strong composer can be stronger than an angel.

But then again, we have no idea if Josh is a super-strong composer, a regular one, or even a below-average one.


...We have absolutely no way of knowing, looking at all the layers of the TWEWY world xD



Spoiler: Spoilers...I think...I'm just saying spoilers for the heck of it
Surely Playa you must admit Neku is a special case? Neku was given a direct blessing by Joshua by dropping the little magical badge of power. Even then a large theme of the game is cooperation in every fight he is assisted by powerful players, we can't tell if individually he is stronger than reapers. Even then who's to say it's not a proportional thing? If Neku became a reaper he may still become massively strong and it's just the standard hood reapers are pretty weak. An example of how there is power in reapers, look at Beat before and after he became a reaper and tell me he was not significantly stronger? It's not that reapers are weak, it's that the ones Neku fights as bog-standard in the last few stages of the game are your bog-standard wall reapers not really skilled in fighting. Also may I point out that only reapers are able to raise their frequency to the RG.

I'm just saying the evidence points to wings being the step before transforming into a final form.
After all I think specifically for Iron Maiden's battle she sprouts wings instantly before transforming showing it works in steps a better example there isn't of the stages of power.

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Spoiler:
Everyone sprouts wings before turning into their Noise form.

But even if the "real" wings indicate the final level before noise form, Hanekoma's wings could've been "fake" wings, as Josh's appearance throughout the entire game was "fake".

We also never got to fight not-reaper!Beat, so we really don't know how much stronger becoming a Reaper made him. He could've just been that strong all along xD

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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
Everyone sprouts wings before turning into their Noise form.

But even if the "real" wings indicate the final level before noise form, Hanekoma's wings could've been "fake" wings, as Josh's appearance throughout the entire game was "fake".

We also never got to fight not-reaper!Beat, so we really don't know how much stronger becoming a Reaper made him. He could've just been that strong all along xD


Spoiler:
:yuusaku: Well Beat joins you for the third game and he sure as hell loses a lot of power along with his wings so I think thats a good indication of how he's not that strong.

Also the 'fake' wings are absolutely ludicrous. Think about the context with these wings, it's the FINAL cutscene the ultimate one, for all we know he may never show up again, and why would they make his wings fake at this point. Besides if anything the lower the form the more normal people look, I mean Joshua blurred out when he powered up, why should Hanaekoma use less power using fake wings?

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Spoiler:
Well, EVERYBODY in EVERY single video game EVER made is stronger (as a fighter in the battle system, not story-wise) when they are an enemy than when they are in your party. So it's hard to tell, as they never say anything about reaper wings specifically making someone stronger.

And... how should I know why he would want to add wings to his appearance? Do you know why he supposedly powered up at that form? And Josh didn't blur when he powered up; he became a teenager when he powered down (since the "blurred" form is his regular form).
I mean that maybe Hanekoma's evolution tree is like regular!Hanekoma --> winged!Hanekoma --> [insert other forms here] --> noise!Hanekoma. We really don't know much about wings; just that reapers have them. They could be purely for show, for all we know. We really have barely any info on the specifics on angels, composers, how their powers work and how the extent of their powers; it's hard to make a definitive argument for any standpoint, so we should just give up now.

Plus, who's to say that Josh's blur effect has to do with having massive amounts of power? Maybe all composers automatically get the blur, but it comes off when they become an angel?

Maybe Hanekoma has been at full power this entire time--he hasn't had a reason to need to power down--and he can just put out and pull in his wings whenever he feels like it? (Kinda like Colette from Tales of Symphonia :-P )

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Hmmmmm..... If memory serves me there are Pins from FF that are in this game. Ifrit and Bahamut. Correct me if I'm wrong.
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Ifrit are Bahamut are in FF, but not from FF.
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The following are form FF:
Ifrit, Shiva, Bahamut
All of them make appearances in FFVII. Thing is, I think Golem also appears in one of the FF games.
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Bad Player wrote:
Spoiler:
Well, EVERYBODY in EVERY single video game EVER made is stronger (as a fighter in the battle system, not story-wise) when they are an enemy than when they are in your party. So it's hard to tell, as they never say anything about reaper wings specifically making someone stronger.

And... how should I know why he would want to add wings to his appearance? Do you know why he supposedly powered up at that form? And Josh didn't blur when he powered up; he became a teenager when he powered down (since the "blurred" form is his regular form).
I mean that maybe Hanekoma's evolution tree is like regular!Hanekoma --> winged!Hanekoma --> [insert other forms here] --> noise!Hanekoma. We really don't know much about wings; just that reapers have them. They could be purely for show, for all we know. We really have barely any info on the specifics on angels, composers, how their powers work and how the extent of their powers; it's hard to make a definitive argument for any standpoint, so we should just give up now.

Plus, who's to say that Josh's blur effect has to do with having massive amounts of power? Maybe all composers automatically get the blur, but it comes off when they become an angel?

Maybe Hanekoma has been at full power this entire time--he hasn't had a reason to need to power down--and he can just put out and pull in his wings whenever he feels like it? (Kinda like Colette from Tales of Symphonia :-P )


Spoiler:
Yeah sure thats the standard procedure for party members to be weaker as they turn to you from the enemy but in this case it'd be literal. And the Wings aren't the source of the power, they are a byproduct of it, an indicator if you will. Beat specifically became a Reaper so he would gain the power to use the Rhyme pin, note....GAIN the power. There is no question most Reapers are more powerful than players so the whole Beat getting weaker just because he's a good guy.....is actually perfectly explainable via the story.

As for the wings....of course they serve a purpose, you see Beat using them, Kariya uses them, Angry Woman uses them. The wings are not just for show. Besides how do you suspect Mr H got on top of that building with Joshua to survey everything anyway? Of course he uses his wings. And we know he wasn't at full power, his noise form is maxxed out, even you admit that according to your tree.

But I must digress....in reading the secret reports to try and find evidence about why Joshua's blurryness indicates his high frequency I found evidence supporting Hanaekoma's supremecy.

Firstly it says that Reapers evolve into the Composer....meaning essentially Joshua is just an incredibly powerful reaper. Secondly it says that even the Composer can't pick up all the frequencies of Angels....in fact he can only pick up the Producer so while Hanaekoma must be a weak angel....if Joshua in all his power can't percieve any of the other angels they must be on a whole other level to even the Composer's power.

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You thought you could be safe in your courts, with your laws and attorneys to protect you. In this world only I am law, my word is fact, my power is absolute.
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